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Paris Skins - alternatives (2) [message #73665]

Fri, 06 October 2006 10:43

Yanoska

Messages: 32
Registered: January 2007

Member

ate to harp but don't skip over this gem off a preamp.

AA

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:45396589$1@linux...
>
> Don,
>
> Are all the params you are talking about controllable by midi? If so the
> kind of app you are talking about is definitely possible.
>
> Chuck
>
> "DC" <dc@spammersatnamm.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>Hi Aaron,
>>
>>What I want to do is to have a playing field on the computer screen,
>>kinda like the Soundweb example I attached here. You add modules
>>to it in the order you prefer, then you open them and dial the
>>settings in. It's a more simple and sophisticated app I am looking
>>for. No one makes an FX processor like this at all, and it would be
>>very cool. When you use the MagicStomp, you page through
>>all these presets, looking for one that is close to what you want,
>>then you open it and more pages to find the control you want, and
>>some presets have that control available and some do not, and
>>there is no well to tell without digging through all of 'em.
>>I would like to be able to start from scratch, with everything
>>available, and design what I need, rather than this convoluted
>>nonsense where certain processors show up and others do not,
>>depending on the preset you are playing with.
>>
>>I should build it huh?
>>
>>DC
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>if you want to pie up the FX (it has two chips in it dedicated to FX),
> you
>>
>>>should try ebay for a used 2112 / 2120 from digitech. Sweet sweet unit,
>>
>>>presets suck.
>>>The modifiers section in that thing is the most comprehensive section
>>>I've
>>
>>>ever seen and it's tube and/or solid state on the pre.
>>>
>>>AA
>Both snares in Paris??correct?????
Both tracks identical?? level, pan is center??no plugs on either, or the
same plug with same setting on both???
You should get a complete null.
Rod

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>
>
>There might be some other issues going on because side by side snare and
=
>a reverse polarity snare do not null...hmmmm....very interesting
>
>Any ideas as to why this might ne happening?
>
>Don
> "Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
>news:45391d65@linux...
> Don,
> Try SampleSlide and you should get a complete null.
> In the process you may need to nudge the track one more/less
> millisecond to work.
> Tom
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>news:4538f824$1@linux...
> I spoke too soon...I can get really close but can not get total =
>nulling of=20
> two snare tracks (one phase reversed)
>
> I'm getting the equvilent of a drop of 17db when summing the two =
>tracks
>
> Is this normal?
>
> DOn
>
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:4538ed12@linux...
> > Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got it
> >
> > Don
> >
> >
> > "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>news:4538a5f0@linux...
> >>I am presently
> >>
> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and back
> >>
> >> 2) recording into cubase or transferring files into cubase, =
>processing=20
> >> them and then sending them back to Paris.
> >>
> >> The second option is time aligned and sample accurate (without =
>plugs) but=20
> >> going out and back creates at least a 50 ms delay (without plugs)
> >>
> >> My question is how do I determine the exact time delay for the =
>round=20
> >> trip...I can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial and
=
>error=20
> >> thing or can this be determined accurately beforehand
> >>
> >>
> >> Don
> >>
> >>
> >> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com> wrote in message=20
> >> news:453843ca$1@linux...
> >>>
> >>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
=
>SX3=20
> >>> going
> >>> either way, with Paris as master, via adat 9 pin sync.
> >>> This doesn't take into account any plugs in cubase though, just
=
>dry=20
> >>> tracks.
> >>> As far as using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but
=
>it's as
> >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those timecodes, by =
>nature, are=20
> >>> not
> >>> accurate on the sample level, but are fine for most things, as =
>long as=20
> >>> phase
> >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't needed. I have done
=
>tests,=20
> >>> however,
> >>> and MTC is tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave)
> >>> Rod
> >>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
> >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined the latency settings =
>for Paris
> >>> or
> >>>>your second rig and the various plugins you use?
> >>>>
> >>>>I realise that's a loaded question but I'm having trouble =
>getting zero
> >>>>latency just flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other =
>rig with
> >>>
> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper let alone adding plugs into the =
>equation
> >>>>
> >>>>Thanks
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>"Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote in message=20
> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
> >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the master also and like your =
>setup rock
> >>>>>>solid...the question was more of a "like to know" question
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>As to sample accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris
=
>or just
> >>> to
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>Paris
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>DOn
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> Both.
> >>>>> Gene
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >=20
>
>
>
>
> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
><HTML><HEAD>
><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2963" name=3DGENERATOR>
><STYLE></STYLE>
></HEAD>
><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
><DIV>There might be some other issues going
=
>on=20
>because�side by side snare and a reverse polarity snare do not=20
>null...hmmmm....very interesting</DIV>
><DIV>�</DIV>
><DIV>Any ideas as to why this might ne=20
>happening?</DIV>
><DIV>�</DIV>
><DIV>Don</DIV>
><BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
> <DIV>"Tom Bruhl" <<A=20
> href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>> wrote =
>in message=20
> <A href=3D"news:45391d65@linux">news:45391d65@linux</A>...</DIV>
> <DIV>Don,</DIV>
> <DIV>Try SampleSlide and you should get a
=
>complete=20
> null.</DIV>
> <DIV>In the process you may need to nudge
=
>the track=20
> one more/less</DIV>
> <DIV>millisecond to work.</DIV>
> <DIV>Tom</DIV>
> <BLOCKQUOTE=20
> style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
> <DIV>"Don Nafe" <<A =
>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
> wrote in message <A=20
> href=3D"news:4538f824$1@linux">news:4538f824$1@linux</A>...</DIV>I =
>spoke too=20
> soon...I can get really close but can not get total nulling of =
> two snare=20
> tracks (one phase reversed) I'm getting the equvilent of a =
>drop of=20
> 17db when summing the two tracks Is this=20
> normal? DOn "Don Nafe" <<A=20
> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>message <A=20
> href=3D"news:4538ed12@linux">news:4538ed12@linux</A>... >=20
> Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got =
>it > >=20
> Don > > > "Don Nafe" <<A=20
> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>message <A=20
> href=3D"news:4538a5f0@linux">news:4538a5f0@linux</A>... >>I =
>am=20
> presently >> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and=20
> back >> >> 2) recording into cubase or =
>transferring files=20
> into cubase, processing >> them and then sending them back =
>to=20
> Paris. >> >> The second option is time aligned and =
>sample=20
> accurate (without plugs) but >> going out and back creates =
>at=20
> least a 50 ms delay (without plugs) >> >> My =
>question is=20
> how do I determine the exact time delay for the round >> =
>trip...I=20
> can get close but not close enough.� Is this a trial and error=20
> >> thing or can this be determined accurately=20
> beforehand >> >> >>=20
> Don >> >> >> "Rod Lincoln" <<A=20
> =
>href=3D"mailto:rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com">rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com</A>=
>>=20
> wrote in message >> <A=20
> =
>href=3D"news:453843ca$1@linux">news:453843ca$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>t; >>>=20
> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase SX3=20
> >>> going >>> either way, with Paris as =
>master, via=20
> adat 9 pin sync. >>> This doesn't take into account any =
>plugs in=20
> cubase though, just dry >>> tracks. >>> As =
>far as=20
> using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but it's=20
> as >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those =
>timecodes,=20
> by nature, are >>> not >>> accurate on the =
>sample=20
> level, but are fine for most things, as long as >>>=20
> phase >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't =
>needed. I=20
> have done tests, >>> however, >>> and MTC =
>is=20
> tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave) >>> =
>
> Rod >>> "Don Nafe" <<A=20
> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
> wrote: >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined =
>the=20
> latency settings for Paris >>> =
>or >>>>your second=20
> rig and the various plugins you=20
> use? >>>> >>>>I realise that's a =
>loaded=20
> question but I'm having trouble getting =
>zero >>>>latency just=20
> flying back and forth� my Paris rig and my other rig�=20
> with >>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper =
>let=20
> alone adding plugs into the=20
> =
>equation >>>> >>>>Thanks >>>>=
>; >>>> >>>>"Gene=20
> Lennon" <<A =
>href=3D"mailto:glennon@NOSP.com">glennon@NOSP.com</A>> wrote=20
> in message=20
> =
> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux... >>>>> &=
>gt;>>>>=20
> "Don Nafe" <<A =
>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
> wrote: >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the =
>master=20
> also and like your setup rock >>>>>>solid...the =
>
> question was more of a "like to know"=20
> question >>>>>> >>>>>>As =
>to sample=20
> accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris or =
>just >>>=20
> =
>to >>>>> >>>>>>Paris >>&g=
>t;>>> >>>>>>DOn >>>>>>=
> >>>>>> >>>>>=20
> Both. >>>>>=20
> =
>Gene >>>> >>>> >>> >><=
>BR>>> > >=20
> </BLOCKQUOTE>
> <DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam,
=
>and=20
> you? <A=20
> =
>href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
>.html</A>��</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
>
>"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:45396fb4$1@linux...

> Both snares in Paris??correct?????

yes

> Both tracks identical?? level, pan is center??no plugs on either???

yes

> You should get a complete null.

Nope...about a 30db drop in volume...have to crank the level but it's
there....I'll be checking things again tomorrow because something isn't
right here

Don

> Rod
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>
>>
>>There might be some other issues going on because side by side snare and
> =
>>a reverse polarity snare do not null...hmmmm....very interesting
>>
>>Any ideas as to why this might ne happening?
>>
>>Don
>> "Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
>>news:45391d65@linux...
>> Don,
>> Try SampleSlide and you should get a complete null.
>> In the process you may need to nudge the track one more/less
>> millisecond to work.
>> Tom
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>news:4538f824$1@linux...
>> I spoke too soon...I can get really close but can not get total =
>>nulling of=20
>> two snare tracks (one phase reversed)
>>
>> I'm getting the equvilent of a drop of 17db when summing the two =
>>tracks
>>
>> Is this normal?
>>
>> DOn
>>
>>
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:4538ed12@linux...
>> > Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got it
>> >
>> > Don
>> >
>> >
>> > "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>news:4538a5f0@linux...
>> >>I am presently
>> >>
>> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and back
>> >>
>> >> 2) recording into cubase or transferring files into cubase, =
>>processing=20
>> >> them and then sending them back to Paris.
>> >>
>> >> The second option is time aligned and sample accurate (without =
>>plugs) but=20
>> >> going out and back creates at least a 50 ms delay (without plugs)
>> >>
>> >> My question is how do I determine the exact time delay for the =
>>round=20
>> >> trip...I can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial and
> =
>>error=20
>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately beforehand
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Don
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com> wrote in message=20
>> >> news:453843ca$1@linux...
>> >>>
>> >>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
> =
>>SX3=20
>> >>> going
>> >>> either way, with Paris as master, via adat 9 pin sync.
>> >>> This doesn't take into account any plugs in cubase though, just
> =
>>dry=20
>> >>> tracks.
>> >>> As far as using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but
> =
>>it's as
>> >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those timecodes, by =
>>nature, are=20
>> >>> not
>> >>> accurate on the sample level, but are fine for most things, as =
>>long as=20
>> >>> phase
>> >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't needed. I have done
> =
>>tests,=20
>> >>> however,
>> >>> and MTC is tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave)
>> >>> Rod
>> >>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>> >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined the latency settings =
>>for Paris
>> >>> or
>> >>>>your second rig and the various plugins you use?
>> >>>>
>> >>>>I realise that's a loaded question but I'm having trouble =
>>getting zero
>> >>>>latency just flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other =
>>rig with
>> >>>
>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper let alone adding plugs into the =
>>equation
>> >>>>
>> >>>>Thanks
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>"Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote in message=20
>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux...
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>> >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the master also and like your =
>>setup rock
>> >>>>>>solid...the question was more of a "like to know" question
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>As to sample accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris
> =
>>or just
>> >>> to
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>>Paris
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>DOn
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>> Both.
>> >>>>> Gene
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >=20
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>
>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>><HTML><HEAD>
>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2963" name=3DGENERATOR>
>><STYLE></STYLE>
>></HEAD>
>><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
>><DIV>There might be some other issues going
> =
>>on=20
>>because side by side snare and a reverse polarity snare do not=20
>>null...hmmmm....very interesting</DIV>
>><DIV> </DIV>
>><DIV>Any ideas as to why this might ne=20
>>happening?</DIV>
>><DIV> </DIV>
>><DIV>Don</DIV>
>><BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
>>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>> <DIV>"Tom Bruhl" <<A=20
>> href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>> wrote =
>>in message=20
>> <A href=3D"news:45391d65@linux">news:45391d65@linux</A>...</DIV>
>> <DIV>Don,</DIV>
>> <DIV>Try SampleSlide and you should get a
> =
>>complete=20
>> null.</DIV>
>> <DIV>In the process you may need to nudge
> =
>>the track=20
>> one more/less</DIV>
>> <DIV>millisecond to work.</DIV>
>> <DIV>Tom</DIV>
>> <BLOCKQUOTE=20
>> style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>> <DIV>"Don Nafe" <<A =
>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>> wrote in message <A=20
>> href=3D"news:4538f824$1@linux">news:4538f824$1@linux</A>...</DIV>I =
>>spoke too=20
>> soon...I can get really close but can not get total nulling of =
>> two snare=20
>> tracks (one phase reversed) I'm getting the equvilent of a =
>>drop of=20
>> 17db when summing the two tracks Is this=20
>> normal? DOn "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>message <A=20
>> href=3D"news:4538ed12@linux">news:4538ed12@linux</A>... >=20
>> Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got =
>>it > >=20
>> Don > > > "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>message <A=20
>> href=3D"news:4538a5f0@linux">news:4538a5f0@linux</A>... >>I =
>>am=20
>> presently >> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and=20
>> back >> >> 2) recording into cubase or =
>>transferring files=20
>> into cubase, processing >> them and then sending them back =
>>to=20
>> Paris. >> >> The second option is time aligned and =
>>sample=20
>> accurate (without plugs) but >> going out and back creates =
>>at=20
>> least a 50 ms delay (without plugs) >> >> My =
>>question is=20
>> how do I determine the exact time delay for the round >> =
>>trip...I=20
>> can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial and error=20
>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately=20
>> beforehand >> >> >>=20
>> Don >> >> >> "Rod Lincoln" <<A=20
>> =
>>href=3D"mailto:rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com">rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com</A>=
>>>=20
>> wrote in message >> <A=20
>> =
>>href=3D"news:453843ca$1@linux">news:453843ca$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>>t; >>>=20
>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase SX3=20
>> >>> going >>> either way, with Paris as =
>>master, via=20
>> adat 9 pin sync. >>> This doesn't take into account any =
>>plugs in=20
>> cubase though, just dry >>> tracks. >>> As =
>>far as=20
>> using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but it's=20
>> as >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those =
>>timecodes,=20
>> by nature, are >>> not >>> accurate on the =
>>sample=20
>> level, but are fine for most things, as long as >>>=20
>> phase >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't =
>>needed. I=20
>> have done tests, >>> however, >>> and MTC =
>>is=20
>> tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave) >>> =
>>
>> Rod >>> "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>> wrote: >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined =
>>the=20
>> latency settings for Paris >>> =
>>or >>>>your second=20
>> rig and the various plugins you=20
>> use? >>>> >>>>I realise that's a =
>>loaded=20
>> question but I'm having trouble getting =
>>zero >>>>latency just=20
>> flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other rig =20
>> with >>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper =
>>let=20
>> alone adding plugs into the=20
>> =
>>equation >>>> >>>>Thanks >>>>=
>>; >>>> >>>>"Gene=20
>> Lennon" <<A =
>>href=3D"mailto:glennon@NOSP.com">glennon@NOSP.com</A>> wrote=20
>> in message=20
>> =
>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux... >>>>> &=
>>gt;>>>>=20
>> "Don Nafe" <<A =
>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>> wrote: >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the =
>>master=20
>> also and like your setup rock >>>>>>solid...the =
>>
>> question was more of a "like to know"=20
>> question >>>>>> >>>>>>As =
>>to sample=20
>> accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris or =
>>just >>>=20
>> =
>>to >>>>> >>>>>>Paris >>&g=
>>t;>>> >>>>>>DOn >>>>>>=
>> >>>>>> >>>>>=20
>> Both. >>>>>=20
>> =
>>Gene >>>> >>>> >>> >><=
>>BR>>> > >=20
>> </BLOCKQUOTE>
>> <DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam,
> =
>>and=20
>> you? <A=20
>> =
>>href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
>>.html</A> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
>>
>>
>Actually come to think of it they aren't identical...I had to render the
snare track to get the invert poarity to work...wouldn't do the original
track for some reason...I have an idea why and I'll get back to you on this
tomorrow

DOn

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:45397215@linux...
> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:45396fb4$1@linux...
>
>> Both snares in Paris??correct?????
>
> yes
>
>> Both tracks identical?? level, pan is center??no plugs on either???
>
> yes
>
>> You should get a complete null.
>
> Nope...about a 30db drop in volume...have to crank the level but it's
> there....I'll be checking things again tomorrow because something isn't
> right here
>
> Don
>
>
>> Rod
>>
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>There might be some other issues going on because side by side snare and
>> =
>>>a reverse polarity snare do not null...hmmmm....very interesting
>>>
>>>Any ideas as to why this might ne happening?
>>>
>>>Don
>>> "Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
>>>news:45391d65@linux...
>>> Don,
>>> Try SampleSlide and you should get a complete null.
>>> In the process you may need to nudge the track one more/less
>>> millisecond to work.
>>> Tom
>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>>news:4538f824$1@linux...
>>> I spoke too soon...I can get really close but can not get total =
>>>nulling of=20
>>> two snare tracks (one phase reversed)
>>>
>>> I'm getting the equvilent of a drop of 17db when summing the two =
>>>tracks
>>>
>>> Is this normal?
>>>
>>> DOn
>>>
>>>
>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:4538ed12@linux...
>>> > Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got it
>>> >
>>> > Don
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>>news:4538a5f0@linux...
>>> >>I am presently
>>> >>
>>> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and back
>>> >>
>>> >> 2) recording into cubase or transferring files into cubase, =
>>>processing=20
>>> >> them and then sending them back to Paris.
>>> >>
>>> >> The second option is time aligned and sample accurate (without =
>>>plugs) but=20
>>> >> going out and back creates at least a 50 ms delay (without plugs)
>>> >>
>>> >> My question is how do I determine the exact time delay for the =
>>>round=20
>>> >> trip...I can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial and
>> =
>>>error=20
>>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately beforehand
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Don
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com> wrote in message=20
>>> >> news:453843ca$1@linux...
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
>> =
>>>SX3=20
>>> >>> going
>>> >>> either way, with Paris as master, via adat 9 pin sync.
>>> >>> This doesn't take into account any plugs in cubase though, just
>> =
>>>dry=20
>>> >>> tracks.
>>> >>> As far as using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but
>> =
>>>it's as
>>> >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those timecodes, by =
>>>nature, are=20
>>> >>> not
>>> >>> accurate on the sample level, but are fine for most things, as =
>>>long as=20
>>> >>> phase
>>> >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't needed. I have done
>> =
>>>tests,=20
>>> >>> however,
>>> >>> and MTC is tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave)
>>> >>> Rod
>>> >>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>> >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined the latency settings =
>>>for Paris
>>> >>> or
>>> >>>>your second rig and the various plugins you use?
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>I realise that's a loaded question but I'm having trouble =
>>>getting zero
>>> >>>>latency just flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other =
>>>rig with
>>> >>>
>>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper let alone adding plugs into the =
>>>equation
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>Thanks
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>"Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote in message=20
>>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux...
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>> >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the master also and like your =
>>>setup rock
>>> >>>>>>solid...the question was more of a "like to know" question
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>As to sample accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris
>> =
>>>or just
>>> >>> to
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>>Paris
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>DOn
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>> Both.
>>> >>>>> Gene
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >=20
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>
>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2963" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>></HEAD>
>>><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
>>><DIV>There might be some other issues going
>> =
>>>on=20
>>>because side by side snare and a reverse polarity snare do not=20
>>>null...hmmmm....very interesting</DIV>
>>><DIV> </DIV>
>>><DIV>Any ideas as to why this might ne=20
>>>happening?</DIV>
>>><DIV> </DIV>
>>><DIV>Don</DIV>
>>><BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
>>>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>>> <DIV>"Tom Bruhl" <<A=20
>>> href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>> wrote =
>>>in message=20
>>> <A href=3D"news:45391d65@linux">news:45391d65@linux</A>...</DIV>
>>> <DIV>Don,</DIV>
>>> <DIV>Try SampleSlide and you should get a
>> =
>>>complete=20
>>> null.</DIV>
>>> <DIV>In the process you may need to nudge
>> =
>>>the track=20
>>> one more/less</DIV>
>>> <DIV>millisecond to work.</DIV>
>>> <DIV>Tom</DIV>
>>> <BLOCKQUOTE=20
>>> style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>>> <DIV>"Don Nafe" <<A =
>>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>> wrote in message <A=20
>>> href=3D"news:4538f824$1@linux">news:4538f824$1@linux</A>...</DIV>I =
>>>spoke too=20
>>> soon...I can get really close but can not get total nulling of =
>>> two snare=20
>>> tracks (one phase reversed) I'm getting the equvilent of a =
>>>drop of=20
>>> 17db when summing the two tracks Is this=20
>>> normal? DOn "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>>message <A=20
>>> href=3D"news:4538ed12@linux">news:4538ed12@linux</A>... >=20
>>> Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got =
>>>it > >=20
>>> Don > > > "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>>message <A=20
>>> href=3D"news:4538a5f0@linux">news:4538a5f0@linux</A>... >>I =
>>>am=20
>>> presently >> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and=20
>>> back >> >> 2) recording into cubase or =
>>>transferring files=20
>>> into cubase, processing >> them and then sending them back =
>>>to=20
>>> Paris. >> >> The second option is time aligned and =
>>>sample=20
>>> accurate (without plugs) but >> going out and back creates =
>>>at=20
>>> least a 50 ms delay (without plugs) >> >> My =
>>>question is=20
>>> how do I determine the exact time delay for the round >> =
>>>trip...I=20
>>> can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial and error=20
>>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately=20
>>> beforehand >> >> >>=20
>>> Don >> >> >> "Rod Lincoln" <<A=20
>>> =
>>>href=3D"mailto:rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com">rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com</A>=
>>>>=20
>>> wrote in message >> <A=20
>>> =
>>>href=3D"news:453843ca$1@linux">news:453843ca$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>>>t; >>>=20
>>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
>>> SX3=20
>>> >>> going >>> either way, with Paris as =
>>>master, via=20
>>> adat 9 pin sync. >>> This doesn't take into account any =
>>>plugs in=20
>>> cubase though, just dry >>> tracks. >>> As =
>>>far as=20
>>> using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but it's=20
>>> as >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those =
>>>timecodes,=20
>>> by nature, are >>> not >>> accurate on the =
>>>sample=20
>>> level, but are fine for most things, as long as >>>=20
>>> phase >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't =
>>>needed. I=20
>>> have done tests, >>> however, >>> and MTC =
>>>is=20
>>> tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave) >>> =
>>>
>>> Rod >>> "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>> wrote: >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined =
>>>the=20
>>> latency settings for Paris >>> =
>>>or >>>>your second=20
>>> rig and the various plugins you=20
>>> use? >>>> >>>>I realise that's a =
>>>loaded=20
>>> question but I'm having trouble getting =
>>>zero >>>>latency just=20
>>> flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other rig =20
>>> with >>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper =
>>>let=20
>>> alone adding plugs into the=20
>>> =
>>>equation >>>> >>>>Thanks >>>>=
>>>; >>>> >>>>"Gene=20
>>> Lennon" <<A =
>>>href=3D"mailto:glennon@NOSP.com">glennon@NOSP.com</A>> wrote=20
>>> in message=20
>>> =
>>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux... >>>>> &=
>>>gt;>>>>=20
>>> "Don Nafe" <<A =
>>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>> wrote: >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the =
>>>master=20
>>> also and like your setup rock >>>>>>solid...the =
>>>
>>> question was more of a "like to know"=20
>>> question >>>>>> >>>>>>As =
>>>to sample=20
>>> accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris or =
>>>just >>>=20
>>> =
>>>to >>>>> >>>>>>Paris >>&g=
>>>t;>>> >>>>>>DOn >>>>>>=
>>> >>>>>> >>>>>=20
>>> Both. >>>>>=20
>>> =
>>>Gene >>>> >>>> >>> >><=
>>>BR>>> > >=20
>>> </BLOCKQUOTE>
>>> <DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam,
>> =
>>>and=20
>>> you? <A=20
>>> =
>>>href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
>>>.html</A> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>So doing the math to sum em, do they run out of floating point top end
and have to drop -20 to get digital headroom?

chuck duffy wrote:
> 100% in the digital domain.
>
> Chuck
>
> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>> This is all in the digital domain ? WOW
>>
>> chuck duffy wrote:
>>> Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just the
> source
>>> code for the mixer.
>>>
>>> Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the individual
>>> channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master. That's
> why
>>> you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'. This
>>> is what many analog consoles do.
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>>
>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>> How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the
>
>>>> Submix masters ?
>>>>
>>>> DJ wrote:
>>>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and it
> still
>>>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
> it
>>>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders that
>>> are
>>>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
>>>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal DAW
>>> would
>>>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>>>
>>>>> ;o)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966 Thunderbird
>>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>>>> the
>>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>>> was
>>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
> the
>>>>> master
>>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>>> Keep
>>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
> to
>>>>> design
>>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> TCB
>huh? Are you doing this in Paris? if so, just flip the phase switch on the
Paris Mixer channel, just below the eq(you have to select show phase on the
eq pull down menu.
Rod
"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>Actually come to think of it they aren't identical...I had to render the

>snare track to get the invert poarity to work...wouldn't do the original

>track for some reason...I have an idea why and I'll get back to you on this

>tomorrow
>
>DOn
>
>
>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:45397215@linux...
>> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
>> news:45396fb4$1@linux...
>>
>>> Both snares in Paris??correct?????
>>
>> yes
>>
>>> Both tracks identical?? level, pan is center??no plugs on either???
>>
>> yes
>>
>>> You should get a complete null.
>>
>> Nope...about a 30db drop in volume...have to crank the level but it's

>> there....I'll be checking things again tomorrow because something isn't

>> right here
>>
>> Don
>>
>>
>>> Rod
>>>
>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>There might be some other issues going on because side by side snare
and
>>> =
>>>>a reverse polarity snare do not null...hmmmm....very interesting
>>>>
>>>>Any ideas as to why this might ne happening?
>>>>
>>>>Don
>>>> "Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
>>>>news:45391d65@linux...
>>>> Don,
>>>> Try SampleSlide and you should get a complete null.
>>>> In the process you may need to nudge the track one more/less
>>>> millisecond to work.
>>>> Tom
>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>>>news:4538f824$1@linux...
>>>> I spoke too soon...I can get really close but can not get total =
>>>>nulling of=20
>>>> two snare tracks (one phase reversed)
>>>>
>>>> I'm getting the equvilent of a drop of 17db when summing the two
=
>>>>tracks
>>>>
>>>> Is this normal?
>>>>
>>>> DOn
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:4538ed12@linux...
>>>> > Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got it
>>>> >
>>>> > Don
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>>>news:4538a5f0@linux...
>>>> >>I am presently
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and back
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 2) recording into cubase or transferring files into cubase, =
>>>>processing=20
>>>> >> them and then sending them back to Paris.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> The second option is time aligned and sample accurate (without
=
>>>>plugs) but=20
>>>> >> going out and back creates at least a 50 ms delay (without plugs)
>>>> >>
>>>> >> My question is how do I determine the exact time delay for the
=
>>>>round=20
>>>> >> trip...I can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial
and
>>> =
>>>>error=20
>>>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately beforehand
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Don
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com> wrote in message=20
>>>> >> news:453843ca$1@linux...
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
>>> =
>>>>SX3=20
>>>> >>> going
>>>> >>> either way, with Paris as master, via adat 9 pin sync.
>>>> >>> This doesn't take into account any plugs in cubase though, just
>>> =
>>>>dry=20
>>>> >>> tracks.
>>>> >>> As far as using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate,
but
>>> =
>>>>it's as
>>>> >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those timecodes, by =
>>>>nature, are=20
>>>> >>> not
>>>> >>> accurate on the sample level, but are fine for most things, as
=
>>>>long as=20
>>>> >>> phase
>>>> >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't needed. I have done
>>> =
>>>>tests,=20
>>>> >>> however,
>>>> >>> and MTC is tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave)
>>>> >>> Rod
>>>> >>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>> >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined the latency settings
=
>>>>for Paris
>>>> >>> or
>>>> >>>>your second rig and the various plugins you use?
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>I realise that's a loaded question but I'm having trouble =
>>>>getting zero
>>>> >>>>latency just flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other
=
>>>>rig with
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper let alone adding plugs into the =
>>>>equation
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>Thanks
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>"Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote in message=20
>>>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux...
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>> >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the master also and like your
=
>>>>setup rock
>>>> >>>>>>solid...the question was more of a "like to know" question
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>As to sample accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris
>>> =
>>>>or just
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>Paris
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>DOn
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>>>
>>>> >>>>> Both.
>>>> >>>>> Gene
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >=20
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>
>>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2963" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>>></HEAD>
>>>><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
>>>><DIV>There might be some other issues going
>>> =
>>>>on=20
>>>>because side by side snare and a reverse polarity snare do not=20
>>>>null...hmmmm....very interesting</DIV>
>>>><DIV> </DIV>
>>>><DIV>Any ideas as to why this might ne=20
>>>>happening?</DIV>
>>>><DIV> </DIV>
>>>><DIV>Don</DIV>
>>>><BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
>>>>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>>>> <DIV>"Tom Bruhl" <<A=20
>>>> href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>> wrote
=
>>>>in message=20
>>>> <A href=3D"news:45391d65@linux">news:45391d65@linux</A>...</DIV>
>>>> <DIV>Don,</DIV>
>>>> <DIV>Try SampleSlide and you should get
a
>>> =
>>>>complete=20
>>>> null.</DIV>
>>>> <DIV>In the process you may need to nudge
>>> =
>>>>the track=20
>>>> one more/less</DIV>
>>>> <DIV>millisecond to work.</DIV>
>>>> <DIV>Tom</DIV>
>>>> <BLOCKQUOTE=20
>>>> style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>>>> <DIV>"Don Nafe" <<A =
>>>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>> wrote in message <A=20
>>>> href=3D"news:4538f824$1@linux">news:4538f824$1@linux</A>...</DIV>I
=
>>>>spoke too=20
>>>> soon...I can get really close but can not get total nulling of =
>>>> two snare=20
>>>> tracks (one phase reversed) I'm getting the equvilent of a
=
>>>>drop of=20
>>>> 17db when summing the two tracks Is this=20
>>>> normal? DOn "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>>>message <A=20
>>>> href=3D"news:4538ed12@linux">news:4538ed12@linux</A>... >=20
>>>> Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got =
>>>>it > >=20
>>>> Don > > > "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>>>message <A=20
>>>> href=3D"news:4538a5f0@linux">news:4538a5f0@linux</A>... >>I =
>>>>am=20
>>>> presently >> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and=20
>>>> back >> >> 2) recording into cubase or =
>>>>transferring files=20
>>>> into cubase, processing >> them and then sending them back =
>>>>to=20
>>>> Paris. >> >> The second option is time aligned and =
>>>>sample=20
>>>> accurate (without plugs) but >> going out and back creates =
>>>>at=20
>>>> least a 50 ms delay (without plugs) >> >> My =
>>>>question is=20
>>>> how do I determine the exact time delay for the round >> =
>>>>trip...I=20
>>>> can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial and error=20
>>>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately=20
>>>> beforehand >> >> >>=20
>>>> Don >> >> >> "Rod Lincoln" <<A=20
>>>> =
>>>>href=3D"mailto:rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com">rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com</A>=
>>>>>=20
>>>> wrote in message >> <A=20
>>>> =
>>>>href=3D"news:453843ca$1@linux">news:453843ca$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>>>>t; >>>=20
>>>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
>>>> SX3=20
>>>> >>> going >>> either way, with Paris as =
>>>>master, via=20
>>>> adat 9 pin sync. >>> This doesn't take into account any =
>>>>plugs in=20
>>>> cubase though, just dry >>> tracks. >>> As =
>>>>far as=20
>>>> using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but it's=20
>>>> as >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those =
>>>>timecodes,=20
>>>> by nature, are >>> not >>> accurate on the =
>>>>sample=20
>>>> level, but are fine for most things, as long as >>>=20
>>>> phase >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't =
>>>>needed. I=20
>>>> have done tests, >>> however, >>> and MTC =
>>>>is=20
>>>> tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave) >>> =
>>>>
>>>> Rod >>> "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>> wrote: >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined =
>>>>the=20
>>>> latency settings for Paris >>> =
>>>>or >>>>your second=20
>>>> rig and the various plugins you=20
>>>> use? >>>> >>>>I realise that's a =
>>>>loaded=20
>>>> question but I'm having trouble getting =
>>>>zero >>>>latency just=20
>>>> flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other rig =20
>>>> with >>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper =
>>>>let=20
>>>> alone adding plugs into the=20
>>>> =
>>>>equation >>>> >>>>Thanks >>>>=
>>>>; >>>> >>>>"Gene=20
>>>> Lennon" <<A =
>>>>href=3D"mailto:glennon@NOSP.com">glennon@NOSP.com</A>> wrote=20
>>>> in message=20
>>>> =
>>>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux... >>>>> &=
>>>>gt;>>>>=20
>>>> "Don Nafe" <<A =
>>>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>> wrote: >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the =
>>>>master=20
>>>> also and like your setup rock >>>>>>solid...the =
>>>>
>>>> question was more of a "like to know"=20
>>>> question >>>>>> >>>>>>As =
>>>>to sample=20
>>>> accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris or =
>>>>just >>>=20
>>>> =
>>>>to >>>>> >>>>>>Paris >>&g=
>>>>t;>>> >>>>>>DOn >>>>>>=
>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>=20
>>>> Both. >>>>>=20
>>>> =
>>>>Gene >>>> >>>> >>> >><=
>>>>BR>>> > >=20
>>>> </BLOCKQUOTE>
>>>> <DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam,
>>> =
>>>>and=20
>>>> you? <A=20
>>>> =
>>>>href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
>>>>.html</A> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>Hey DJ, whats the going price for this route if you don't mind me askin?

Rob

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:45392ba8@linux...
> Yeah......that's the reason. I just had a long discussion with the
Creamware
> rep for North America and ordered a Creamware Scope card with 6 DSP
> processors, 24 ADAT I/O and a sync plate. If this works as I envision and
I
> like the FX, I'll be mixing in totally Paris once again and using Scope
DSP,
> Paris DSP and hardware DSP and losing all of the RME cards and the UAD
cards
> (I'll keep one for mastering). I love the UAD-1 cards, but I'm going to
have
> to look for an alternate solution for mixing. Too much latency to use with
> Paris for the way I want to work. I'll also probably be ordering a second
> Scope card with another ADAT I./O and a Z-link option so that I can use
> their 16 track analog AD/DA converter for routing external FX through
Paris
> as well. I want zero latency DSP mixing and Native just ain't for me. The
> more processing I add to a native mix to make it sound like Paris, the
more
> processed it sounds and the less like Paris it sounds. It just isn't
> floating my boat at all.
>
> Stay tuned.
>
> Deej
>
> "Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote in message news:45391c7f@linux...
> > DJ why dont you use the wormhole thing? Is it because you are using
> outboard
> > gear as
> > well?
> >
> > Brandon
> >
> >
>
>So what�s the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not classic
of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867 Mhz
machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to indicate
that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn�t specify whether
it�s classic or not.

Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an accelerator
(say, Sonnet)?

Thanks,
DaleAaron and Chuck,

The device I have in mind does not exist. I used a Soundweb
file simply as an example of clear layout and usage.

A SW for guitar would kill in the EQ and compression stuff,
but not much else other than running 20 amps at once!

I am thinking of a very powerful box like the TC G-Major, for
instance, that instead of one cliched preset after another, that
you then have to modify, it would allow you to use the DSP in
any way you wish. If you want 96 channels of parametric to
do a .05 octave L-R band split, you could do it. If you wanted
8 delays, all assigned and modulated differently, you could do
that too, because nobody has decided that you don't need to
do that.

The SW app is wonderfully powerful and simple to use (once
you learn it, like anything else)

Hey, why don't you download it, and I can send you a couple
of my design files? Imagine FX modules in addition to the
pro audio stuff, and you can see the power available.

You can get it for free here:

http://www.bss.co.uk/soundweb/designerdownload/latest.html

This is such a powerful model for controlling DSP that I cannot
believe it has not been used in studio or guitar FX yet.

If you get the app let me know.

DC

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>Don,
>
>Are all the params you are talking about controllable by midi? If so the
>kind of app you are talking about is definitely possible.
>
>Chuck
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersatnamm.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>Hi Aaron,
>>
>>What I want to do is to have a playing field on the computer screen,
>>kinda like the Soundweb example I attached here. You add modules
>>to it in the order you prefer, then you open them and dial the
>>settings in. It's a more simple and sophisticated app I am looking
>>for. No one makes an FX processor like this at all, and it would be
>>very cool. When you use the MagicStomp, you page through
>>all these presets, looking for one that is close to what you want,
>>then you open it and more pages to find the control you want, and
>>some presets have that control available and some do not, and
>>there is no well to tell without digging through all of 'em.
>>I would like to be able to start from scratch, with everything
>>available, and design what I need, rather than this convoluted
>>nonsense where certain processors show up and others do not,
>>depending on the preset you are playing with.
>>
>>I should build it huh?
>>
>>DC
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>if you want to pie up the FX (it has two chips in it dedicated to FX),
>you
>>
>>>should try ebay for a used 2112 / 2120 from digitech. Sweet sweet unit,
>>
>>>presets suck.
>>>The modifiers section in that thing is the most comprehensive section
I've
>>
>>>ever seen and it's tube and/or solid state on the pre.
>>>
>>>AA
>Can anyone give me a quick walk through of what settings I need on each machine for wormhole?

I've got Wormhole in DP5 set on "start" under direct, and named the channel. In paris I selected "end" and then the "channel name - end" from the drop down.

Is there anything else I need to do paris wise with this to get it to work?

I'm just getting the "host is not feeding audio to Wormhole2" message at the bottom in Paris on the insert.

I'll look at the plasq manual again, but I just thought if someone has a quick answer as to what I'm doing wrong here..

Cheers,

TCHi,
One dum question too.
Have you connected the two computers via ethernet and does this work ok ?
ALSO VITAL did you put an empty 24 bit audio file on the track you wanna
accept wormholed audio ??
This might be the missing point right ?

Secondly use FXpansion 3.3 to wrap wormhole in Paris.
If it does not work something with your ethernet connection beetween computers
might be wrong.
Wormhole works, tested...
Regards,
Dimitrios

TC <tc@spammetodeathyoubastards.org> wrote:
>
>Can anyone give me a quick walk through of what settings I need on each
machine for
>wormhole?
>
>I've got Wormhole in DP5 set on "start" under direct, and named the channel.
In paris
>I selected "end" and then the "channel name - end" from the drop down.
>
>Is there anything else I need to do paris wise with this to get it to work?
>
>I'm just getting the "host is not feeding audio to Wormhole2" message at
the bottom
>in Paris on the insert.
>
>I'll look at the plasq manual again, but I just thought if someone has a
quick answer
>as to what I'm doing wrong here..
>
>Cheers,
>
>TCHi,
In Euros you can find a Pulsar II card (6 dsps) with software either mix
pack or synth pack (ask me when you find one to guide you) 350 Euros.
That will have (classic option) 2 adat ports (16 channels) in/out on spdif
stereo analog in/out and two midi ports in/out (32 midi channels)
Great price !!!
Then as you add, say a sync plate for wordclocking Pulsar with adat sync
that is anothe 179 $ new.

If you choose NOT the classic wire assembly but the "z-link" then you get
16 adat channels again and one firewire port to attach either Luna (8 analog
ins and outs) or A16U which gives you 16 analog channels in and out !!
A16 is expensive though.
Over 800 $ new.
Luna can be found cheap.
Converters are better on A16 but for outboard effects Luna is adequate.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>Hey DJ, whats the going price for this route if you don't mind me askin?
>
>Rob
>
>"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:45392ba8@linux...
>> Yeah......that's the reason. I just had a long discussion with the
>Creamware
>> rep for North America and ordered a Creamware Scope card with 6 DSP
>> processors, 24 ADAT I/O and a sync plate. If this works as I envision
and
>I
>> like the FX, I'll be mixing in totally Paris once again and using Scope
>DSP,
>> Paris DSP and hardware DSP and losing all of the RME cards and the UAD
>cards
>> (I'll keep one for mastering). I love the UAD-1 cards, but I'm going to
>have
>> to look for an alternate solution for mixing. Too much latency to use
with
>> Paris for the way I want to work. I'll also probably be ordering a second
>> Scope card with another ADAT I./O and a Z-link option so that I can use
>> their 16 track analog AD/DA converter for routing external FX through
>Paris
>> as well. I want zero latency DSP mixing and Native just ain't for me.
The
>> more processing I add to a native mix to make it sound like Paris, the
>more
>> processed it sounds and the less like Paris it sounds. It just isn't
>> floating my boat at all.
>>
>> Stay tuned.
>>
>> Deej
>>
>> "Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote in message news:45391c7f@linux...
>> > DJ why dont you use the wormhole thing? Is it because you are using
>> outboard
>> > gear as
>> > well?
>> >
>> > Brandon
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>i'm tooo pretty for the big house. ;o)

On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 14:47:26 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:

>are we gonna go to Tuscon and get arrested? I never got a confirmation on
>that.
>
>;o)
>
>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:vr3ij296k8e9cfraagtkc1e7coeklfpb7q@4ax.com...
>> yup.
>>
>> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 10:30:40 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>>
>> >Well, this is pretty cool then. To get rid of these errors, all I've got
>to
>> >do is change the default settings in WL.........right?
>> >
>> >;o)
>> >
>> >
>> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >news:tr2hj2hpp391cn4kj5p2ktere5bmpcc77o@4ax.com...
>> >> at it's default setting wavelab will show 1000's of errors per second.
>> >>
>> >> On 20 Oct 2006 04:56:18 +1000, "Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >"DJ" <no@way.jack> wrote:
>> >> >>The other day I posted about my bounces having literally millions of
>> >errors
>> >> >
>> >> >>showing up in Wavelab. They were inaudible but it was bothering the
>hell
>> >> >out
>> >> >>of me that they were there. Well, I just ripped some commercial CD
>> >tracks
>> >> >
>> >> >>(New Favorite-Allison Krause and Wide Open Spaces-Dixie Chicks) and
>ran
>> >> >the
>> >> >>same analysis on them. They are the same. Millions of (inaudible
>errors)
>> >> >
>> >> >>digital errors. Also, the click detection shows as many or more of
>these
>> >> >
>> >> >>than my mixes do. I was thinking my ears might be going south on me
>and
>> >> >that
>> >> >>my mix method using Cubase -into-Paris whil'st insanely clocked was
>> >creating
>> >> >
>> >> >>a mess that I just wasn't hearing but that would be rejected if I
>ever
>> >sent
>> >> >
>> >> >>a mix out of here to a third party mastering house. Well, if
>anything,
>> >my
>> >> >
>> >> >>mixes are the same or less error prone than the ones I'm seeing here.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Just another reason to trust the ears, not the eyes...............
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Deej
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >I have to look into this further, but my recent mixes (CD
>masters),done
>> >via
>> >> >lightpipe to Paris, have been checked in PlexTools for errors and have
>
>> >come
>> >> >up 100% clean.
>> >> >
>> >> >Gene
>> >>
>> >
>>
>Get the single 1.25GHz.

James

"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>So what�s the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not classic
>of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867 Mhz
>machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to indicate
>that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn�t specify whether
>it�s classic or not.
>
>Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an accelerator
>(say, Sonnet)?
>
>Thanks,
>DaleYes, the 1.25GHz running OS9.2 works good.

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>Get the single 1.25GHz.
>
>James
>
>"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>So what�s the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not
classic
>>of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867 Mhz
>>machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to indicate
>>that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn�t specify whether
>>it�s classic or not.
>>
>>Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an accelerator
>>(say, Sonnet)?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Dale
>I have the exact same problem trying to go between Cubasesx2 and
Paris on the same computer.
Everything looks good in Cubase and it is sending to 127.0.0.
but in Paris it says host not sending.
Also it does the same thing in Waveleb4 when trying to receive.
Dimitrios...so you are saying there has to be a dummy silent
audio track on the receiving track channel in Paris?
I read something to that effect on the plasq forum.
Some apps mute the plugin signal if there is no audio track
present or something....I guess Paris is one of those apps???

I want to track into PARIS and send to Cubase for effects and
grouping and send back to Paris in stereo submixes.
You dont think this is possible on 1 comp?
And have itsample accurate?

thx
b

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>
>Hi,
>One dum question too.
>Have you connected the two computers via ethernet and does this work ok
?
>ALSO VITAL did you put an empty 24 bit audio file on the track you wanna
>accept wormholed audio ??
>This might be the missing point right ?
>
>Secondly use FXpansion 3.3 to wrap wormhole in Paris.
>If it does not work something with your ethernet connection beetween computers
>might be wrong.
>Wormhole works, tested...
>Regards,
>Dimitrios
>
>TC <tc@spammetodeathyoubastards.org> wrote:
>>
>>Can anyone give me a quick walk through of what settings I need on each
>machine for
>>wormhole?
>>
>>I've got Wormhole in DP5 set on "start" under direct, and named the channel.
> In paris
>>I selected "end" and then the "channel name - end" from the drop down.
>>
>>Is there anything else I need to do paris wise with this to get it to work?
>>
>>I'm just getting the "host is not feeding audio to Wormhole2" message at
>the bottom
>>in Paris on the insert.
>>
>>I'll look at the plasq manual again, but I just thought if someone has
a
>quick answer
>>as to what I'm doing wrong here..
>>
>>Cheers,
>>
>>TC
>Why do you think there is floating point in paris? It's strictly integer.

They drop the *individual* channels by 22, but show the actual levels on
the channel meters. Then they beef up the master by 22 to add it back.
It's just like analog consoles used to do.

Chuck

John <no@no.com> wrote:
>So doing the math to sum em, do they run out of floating point top end
>and have to drop -20 to get digital headroom?
>
>chuck duffy wrote:
>> 100% in the digital domain.
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>> This is all in the digital domain ? WOW
>>>
>>> chuck duffy wrote:
>>>> Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just
the
>> source
>>>> code for the mixer.
>>>>
>>>> Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the
individual
>>>> channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master. That's
>> why
>>>> you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'.
This
>>>> is what many analog consoles do.
>>>>
>>>> Chuck
>>>>
>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>> How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the
>>
>>>>> Submix masters ?
>>>>>
>>>>> DJ wrote:
>>>>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and
it
>> still
>>>>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
>> it
>>>>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders
that
>>>> are
>>>>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
>>>>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal
DAW
>>>> would
>>>>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ;o)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966 Thunderbird
>>>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But,
during
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native
there
>>>> was
>>>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses
to
>> the
>>>>>> master
>>>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>>>> Keep
>>>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
>> to
>>>>>> design
>>>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> TCB
>>DC,

I'm not familiar with soundweb, but I am familiar with the Peavey Mediamatrix
system, and it has a similar, but even more powerful design surface in combination
with a DSP mainframe that allows you to do exactly what you describe. It's
all digital and cobranet based.

The system a sub of ours put in at Phoenix Sky Harbor airport has 128 inputs,
64 sense mic inputs (PZM) and 128 outputs per headend, with one head-end
per terminal. Logical zones can be created that route any input to any output
group. The only analog portion of the chain is the ADC that each mic connects
to. From there on it's 20 bit 48KHZ digital audio over cobranet to the mainframe.

Eq, ducking, limiting and agc (sense mic based) on every channel. The routing
matrix and 'effects' are laid out in a design surface much like the one you
pointed us to.

The system has integrated high quality text to speech in up to 13 languages,
queuing and prioritization of audio and virtually unlimited logical zones.

What I was getting at before, is that it's not all that difficult to write
these sorts of design surfaces, as long as the underlying hardware supports
the design activity. They are like big remote control surfaces.

Klotz digital has a similar system that XM radio uses in their studios on
beautiful Florida Avenue here in our nations capital :-)

Chuck

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Aaron and Chuck,
>
>The device I have in mind does not exist. I used a Soundweb
>file simply as an example of clear layout and usage.
>
>A SW for guitar would kill in the EQ and compression stuff,
>but not much else other than running 20 amps at once!
>
>I am thinking of a very powerful box like the TC G-Major, for
>instance, that instead of one cliched preset after another, that
>you then have to modify, it would allow you to use the DSP in
>any way you wish. If you want 96 channels of parametric to
>do a .05 octave L-R band split, you could do it. If you wanted
>8 delays, all assigned and modulated differently, you could do
>that too, because nobody has decided that you don't need to
>do that.
>
>The SW app is wonderfully powerful and simple to use (once
>you learn it, like anything else)
>
>Hey, why don't you download it, and I can send you a couple
>of my design files? Imagine FX modules in addition to the
>pro audio stuff, and you can see the power available.
>
>You can get it for free here:
>
>http://www.bss.co.uk/soundweb/designerdownload/latest.html
>
>This is such a powerful model for controlling DSP that I cannot
>believe it has not been used in studio or guitar FX yet.
>
>If you get the app let me know.
>
>DC
>
>
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>Don,
>>
>>Are all the params you are talking about controllable by midi? If so the
>>kind of app you are talking about is definitely possible.
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersatnamm.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Hi Aaron,
>>>
>>>What I want to do is to have a playing field on the computer screen,
>>>kinda like the Soundweb example I attached here. You add modules
>>>to it in the order you prefer, then you open them and dial the
>>>settings in. It's a more simple and sophisticated app I am looking
>>>for. No one makes an FX processor like this at all, and it would be

>>>very cool. When you use the MagicStomp, you page through
>>>all these presets, looking for one that is close to what you want,
>>>then you open it and more pages to find the control you want, and
>>>some presets have that control available and some do not, and
>>>there is no well to tell without digging through all of 'em.
>>>I would like to be able to start from scratch, with everything
>>>available, and design what I need, rather than this convoluted
>>>nonsense where certain processors show up and others do not,
>>>depending on the preset you are playing with.
>>>
>>>I should build it huh?
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>if you want to pie up the FX (it has two chips in it dedicated to FX),
>>you
>>>
>>>>should try ebay for a used 2112 / 2120 from digitech. Sweet sweet unit,
>>>
>>>>presets suck.
>>>>The modifiers section in that thing is the most comprehensive section
>I've
>>>
>>>>ever seen and it's tube and/or solid state on the pre.
>>>>
>>>>AA
>>
>You're not going to believe this but I'd completely forgot tat button was
there and yes I now have total, sample accurate, time aligned, there and
back tracking

Can you say DUH!

thanks

Don

"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:45397a4c$1@linux...
>
> huh? Are you doing this in Paris? if so, just flip the phase switch on the
> Paris Mixer channel, just below the eq(you have to select show phase on
> the
> eq pull down menu.
> Rod
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>Actually come to think of it they aren't identical...I had to render the
>
>>snare track to get the invert poarity to work...wouldn't do the original
>
>>track for some reason...I have an idea why and I'll get back to you on
>>this
>
>>tomorrow
>>
>>DOn
>>
>>
>>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:45397215@linux...
>>> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
>>> news:45396fb4$1@linux...
>>>
>>>> Both snares in Paris??correct?????
>>>
>>> yes
>>>
>>>> Both tracks identical?? level, pan is center??no plugs on either???
>>>
>>> yes
>>>
>>>> You should get a complete null.
>>>
>>> Nope...about a 30db drop in volume...have to crank the level but it's
>
>>> there....I'll be checking things again tomorrow because something isn't
>
>>> right here
>>>
>>> Don
>>>
>>>
>>>> Rod
>>>>
>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>There might be some other issues going on because side by side snare
> and
>>>> =
>>>>>a reverse polarity snare do not null...hmmmm....very interesting
>>>>>
>>>>>Any ideas as to why this might ne happening?
>>>>>
>>>>>Don
>>>>> "Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
>>>>>news:45391d65@linux...
>>>>> Don,
>>>>> Try SampleSlide and you should get a complete null.
>>>>> In the process you may need to nudge the track one more/less
>>>>> millisecond to work.
>>>>> Tom
>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>>>>news:4538f824$1@linux...
>>>>> I spoke too soon...I can get really close but can not get total =
>>>>>nulling of=20
>>>>> two snare tracks (one phase reversed)
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm getting the equvilent of a drop of 17db when summing the two
> =
>>>>>tracks
>>>>>
>>>>> Is this normal?
>>>>>
>>>>> DOn
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:4538ed12@linux...
>>>>> > Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got it
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Don
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>>>>news:4538a5f0@linux...
>>>>> >>I am presently
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and back
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> 2) recording into cubase or transferring files into cubase, =
>>>>>processing=20
>>>>> >> them and then sending them back to Paris.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> The second option is time aligned and sample accurate (without
> =
>>>>>plugs) but=20
>>>>> >> going out and back creates at least a 50 ms delay (without
>>>>> plugs)
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> My question is how do I determine the exact time delay for the
> =
>>>>>round=20
>>>>> >> trip...I can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial
> and
>>>> =
>>>>>error=20
>>>>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately beforehand
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Don
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>> >> news:453843ca$1@linux...
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
>>>> =
>>>>>SX3=20
>>>>> >>> going
>>>>> >>> either way, with Paris as master, via adat 9 pin sync.
>>>>> >>> This doesn't take into account any plugs in cubase though, just
>>>> =
>>>>>dry=20
>>>>> >>> tracks.
>>>>> >>> As far as using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate,
> but
>>>> =
>>>>>it's as
>>>>> >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those timecodes, by =
>>>>>nature, are=20
>>>>> >>> not
>>>>> >>> accurate on the sample level, but are fine for most things, as
> =
>>>>>long as=20
>>>>> >>> phase
>>>>> >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't needed. I have
>>>>> done
>>>> =
>>>>>tests,=20
>>>>> >>> however,
>>>>> >>> and MTC is tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave)
>>>>> >>> Rod
>>>>> >>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>> >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined the latency settings
> =
>>>>>for Paris
>>>>> >>> or
>>>>> >>>>your second rig and the various plugins you use?
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>>I realise that's a loaded question but I'm having trouble =
>>>>>getting zero
>>>>> >>>>latency just flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other
> =
>>>>>rig with
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper let alone adding plugs into the =
>>>>>equation
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>>Thanks
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>>"Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux...
>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>> >>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>> >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the master also and like your
> =
>>>>>setup rock
>>>>> >>>>>>solid...the question was more of a "like to know" question
>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>> >>>>>>As to sample accurate, is this flying tracks to and from
>>>>> Paris
>>>> =
>>>>>or just
>>>>> >>> to
>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>> >>>>>>Paris
>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>> >>>>>>DOn
>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>> >>>>> Both.
>>>>> >>>>> Gene
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >
>>>>> >=20
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>
>>>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2963" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>>>></HEAD>
>>>>><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
>>>>><DIV>There might be some other issues going
>>>> =
>>>>>on=20
>>>>>because side by side snare and a reverse polarity snare do not=20
>>>>>null...hmmmm....very interesting</DIV>
>>>>><DIV> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV>Any ideas as to why this might ne=20
>>>>>happening?</DIV>
>>>>><DIV> </DIV>
>>>>><DIV>Don</DIV>
>>>>><BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
>>>>>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>>>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>>>>> <DIV>"Tom Bruhl" <<A=20
>>>>> href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>> wrote
> =
>>>>>in message=20
>>>>> <A href=3D"news:45391d65@linux">news:45391d65@linux</A>...</DIV>
>>>>> <DIV>Don,</DIV>
>>>>> <DIV>Try SampleSlide and you should get
> a
>>>> =
>>>>>complete=20
>>>>> null.</DIV>
>>>>> <DIV>In the process you may need to nudge
>>>> =
>>>>>the track=20
>>>>> one more/less</DIV>
>>>>> <DIV>millisecond to work.</DIV>
>>>>> <DIV>Tom</DIV>
>>>>> <BLOCKQUOTE=20
>>>>> style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>>>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>>>>> <DIV>"Don Nafe" <<A =
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>>> wrote in message <A=20
>>>>> href=3D"news:4538f824$1@linux">news:4538f824$1@linux</A>...</DIV>I
> =
>>>>>spoke too=20
>>>>> soon...I can get really close but can not get total nulling of =
>>>>> two snare=20
>>>>> tracks (one phase reversed) I'm getting the equvilent of a
> =
>>>>>drop of=20
>>>>> 17db when summing the two tracks Is this=20
>>>>> normal? DOn "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>>>>message <A=20
>>>>> href=3D"news:4538ed12@linux">news:4538ed12@linux</A>... >=20
>>>>> Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got =
>>>>>it > >=20
>>>>> Don > > > "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>>>>message <A=20
>>>>> href=3D"news:4538a5f0@linux">news:4538a5f0@linux</A>... >>I =
>>>>>am=20
>>>>> presently >> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and=20
>>>>> back >> >> 2) recording into cubase or =
>>>>>transferring files=20
>>>>> into cubase, processing >> them and then sending them back =
>>>>>to=20
>>>>> Paris. >> >> The second option is time aligned and =
>>>>>sample=20
>>>>> accurate (without plugs) but >> going out and back creates =
>>>>>at=20
>>>>> least a 50 ms delay (without plugs) >> >> My =
>>>>>question is=20
>>>>> how do I determine the exact time delay for the round >> =
>>>>>trip...I=20
>>>>> can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial and error=20
>>>>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately=20
>>>>> beforehand >> >> >>=20
>>>>> Don >> >> >> "Rod Lincoln" <<A=20
>>>>> =
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com">rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com</A>=
>>>>>>=20
>>>>> wrote in message >> <A=20
>>>>> =
>>>>>href=3D"news:453843ca$1@linux">news:453843ca$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>>>>>t; >>>=20
>>>>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
>>>>> SX3=20
>>>>> >>> going >>> either way, with Paris as =
>>>>>master, via=20
>>>>> adat 9 pin sync. >>> This doesn't take into account any =
>>>>>plugs in=20
>>>>> cubase though, just dry >>> tracks. >>> As =
>>>>>far as=20
>>>>> using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but it's=20
>>>>> as >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those =
>>>>>timecodes,=20
>>>>> by nature, are >>> not >>> accurate on the =
>>>>>sample=20
>>>>> level, but are fine for most things, as long as >>>=20
>>>>> phase >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't =
>>>>>needed. I=20
>>>>> have done tests, >>> however, >>> and MTC =
>>>>>is=20
>>>>> tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave) >>> =
>>>>>
>>>>> Rod >>> "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>>> wrote: >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined =
>>>>>the=20
>>>>> latency settings for Paris >>> =
>>>>>or >>>>your second=20
>>>>> rig and the various plugins you=20
>>>>> use? >>>> >>>>I realise that's a =
>>>>>loaded=20
>>>>> question but I'm having trouble getting =
>>>>>zero >>>>latency just=20
>>>>> flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other rig =20
>>>>> with >>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper =
>>>>>let=20
>>>>> alone adding plugs into the=20
>>>>> =
>>>>>equation >>>> >>>>Thanks >>>>=
>>>>>; >>>> >>>>"Gene=20
>>>>> Lennon" <<A =
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:glennon@NOSP.com">glennon@NOSP.com</A>> wrote=20
>>>>> in message=20
>>>>> =
>>>>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux... >>>>> &=
>>>>>gt;>>>>=20
>>>>> "Don Nafe" <<A =
>>>>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the =
>>>>>master=20
>>>>> also and like your setup rock >>>>>>solid...the =
>>>>>
>>>>> question was more of a "like to know"=20
>>>>> question >>>>>> >>>>>>As =
>>>>>to sample=20
>>>>> accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris or =
>>>>>just >>>=20
>>>>> =
>>>>>to >>>>> >>>>>>Paris >>&g=
>>>>>t;>>> >>>>>>DOn >>>>>>=
>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>=20
>>>>> Both. >>>>>=20
>>>>> =
>>>>>Gene >>>> >>>> >>> >><=
>>>>>BR>>> > >=20
>>>>> </BLOCKQUOTE>
>>>>> <DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam,
>>>> =
>>>>>and=20
>>>>> you? <A=20
>>>>> =
>>>>>href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
>>>>>.html</A> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>No problem
;-)
Rod
"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>You're not going to believe this but I'd completely forgot tat button was

>there and yes I now have total, sample accurate, time aligned, there and

>back tracking
>
>Can you say DUH!
>
>thanks
>
>Don
>
>
>"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:45397a4c$1@linux...
>>
>> huh? Are you doing this in Paris? if so, just flip the phase switch on
the
>> Paris Mixer channel, just below the eq(you have to select show phase on

>> the
>> eq pull down menu.
>> Rod
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>Actually come to think of it they aren't identical...I had to render the
>>
>>>snare track to get the invert poarity to work...wouldn't do the original
>>
>>>track for some reason...I have an idea why and I'll get back to you on

>>>this
>>
>>>tomorrow
>>>
>>>DOn
>>>
>>>
>>>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:45397215@linux...
>>>> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:45396fb4$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>>> Both snares in Paris??correct?????
>>>>
>>>> yes
>>>>
>>>>> Both tracks identical?? level, pan is center??no plugs on either???
>>>>
>>>> yes
>>>>
>>>>> You should get a complete null.
>>>>
>>>> Nope...about a 30db drop in volume...have to crank the level but it's
>>
>>>> there....I'll be checking things again tomorrow because something isn't
>>
>>>> right here
>>>>
>>>> Don
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Rod
>>>>>
>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>There might be some other issues going on because side by side snare
>> and
>>>>> =
>>>>>>a reverse polarity snare do not null...hmmmm....very interesting
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Any ideas as to why this might ne happening?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Don
>>>>>> "Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
>>>>>>news:45391d65@linux...
>>>>>> Don,
>>>>>> Try SampleSlide and you should get a complete null.
>>>>>> In the process you may need to nudge the track one more/less
>>>>>> millisecond to work.
>>>>>> Tom
>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>>>>>news:4538f824$1@linux...
>>>>>> I spoke too soon...I can get really close but can not get total
=
>>>>>>nulling of=20
>>>>>> two snare tracks (one phase reversed)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm getting the equvilent of a drop of 17db when summing the two
>> =
>>>>>>tracks
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is this normal?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DOn
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:4538ed12@linux...
>>>>>> > Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got it
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Don
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message =
>>>>>>news:4538a5f0@linux...
>>>>>> >>I am presently
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and back
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> 2) recording into cubase or transferring files into cubase,
=
>>>>>>processing=20
>>>>>> >> them and then sending them back to Paris.
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> The second option is time aligned and sample accurate (without
>> =
>>>>>>plugs) but=20
>>>>>> >> going out and back creates at least a 50 ms delay (without
>>>>>> plugs)
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> My question is how do I determine the exact time delay for the
>> =
>>>>>>round=20
>>>>>> >> trip...I can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial
>> and
>>>>> =
>>>>>>error=20
>>>>>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately beforehand
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> Don
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> "Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>> >> news:453843ca$1@linux...
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
>>>>> =
>>>>>>SX3=20
>>>>>> >>> going
>>>>>> >>> either way, with Paris as master, via adat 9 pin sync.
>>>>>> >>> This doesn't take into account any plugs in cubase though,
just
>>>>> =
>>>>>>dry=20
>>>>>> >>> tracks.
>>>>>> >>> As far as using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate,
>> but
>>>>> =
>>>>>>it's as
>>>>>> >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those timecodes, by
=
>>>>>>nature, are=20
>>>>>> >>> not
>>>>>> >>> accurate on the sample level, but are fine for most things,
as
>> =
>>>>>>long as=20
>>>>>> >>> phase
>>>>>> >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't needed. I have

>>>>>> done
>>>>> =
>>>>>>tests,=20
>>>>>> >>> however,
>>>>>> >>> and MTC is tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave)
>>>>>> >>> Rod
>>>>>> >>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined the latency settings
>> =
>>>>>>for Paris
>>>>>> >>> or
>>>>>> >>>>your second rig and the various plugins you use?
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>I realise that's a loaded question but I'm having trouble =
>>>>>>getting zero
>>>>>> >>>>latency just flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other
>> =
>>>>>>rig with
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper let alone adding plugs into the
=
>>>>>>equation
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>Thanks
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>"Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote in message=20
>>>>>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux...
>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the master also and like your
>> =
>>>>>>setup rock
>>>>>> >>>>>>solid...the question was more of a "like to know" question
>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>>>As to sample accurate, is this flying tracks to and from

>>>>>> Paris
>>>>> =
>>>>>>or just
>>>>>> >>> to
>>>>>> >>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>>>Paris
>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>>>DOn
>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>> >>>>> Both.
>>>>>> >>>>> Gene
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >=20
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>>>>>> http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>>>>>><HTML><HEAD>
>>>>>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>>>>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>>>>>><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2963" name=3DGENERATOR>
>>>>>><STYLE></STYLE>
>>>>>></HEAD>
>>>>>><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
>>>>>><DIV>There might be some other issues going
>>>>> =
>>>>>>on=20
>>>>>>because side by side snare and a reverse polarity snare do not=20
>>>>>>null...hmmmm....very interesting</DIV>
>>>>>><DIV> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV>Any ideas as to why this might ne=20
>>>>>>happening?</DIV>
>>>>>><DIV> </DIV>
>>>>>><DIV>Don</DIV>
>>>>>><BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
>>>>>>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>>>>>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>>>>>> <DIV>"Tom Bruhl" <<A=20
>>>>>> href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>> wrote
>> =
>>>>>>in message=20
>>>>>> <A href=3D"news:45391d65@linux">news:45391d65@linux</A>...</DIV>
>>>>>> <DIV>Don,</DIV>
>>>>>> <DIV>Try SampleSlide and you should get
>> a
>>>>> =
>>>>>>complete=20
>>>>>> null.</DIV>
>>>>>> <DIV>In the process you may need to nudge
>>>>> =
>>>>>>the track=20
>>>>>> one more/less</DIV>
>>>>>> <DIV>millisecond to work.</DIV>
>>>>>> <DIV>Tom</DIV>
>>>>>> <BLOCKQUOTE=20
>>>>>> style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px;
=
>>>>>>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
>>>>>> <DIV>"Don Nafe" <<A =
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>>>> wrote in message <A=20
>>>>>> href=3D"news:4538f824$1@linux">news:4538f824$1@linux</A>...</DIV>I
>> =
>>>>>>spoke too=20
>>>>>> soon...I can get really close but can not get total nulling of
=
>>>>>> two snare=20
>>>>>> tracks (one phase reversed) I'm getting the equvilent of
a
>> =
>>>>>>drop of=20
>>>>>> 17db when summing the two tracks Is this=20
>>>>>> normal? DOn "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>>>>>message <A=20
>>>>>> href=3D"news:4538ed12@linux">news:4538ed12@linux</A>... >=20
>>>>>> Nevermind...took a while and a PITA but I think I've got =
>>>>>>it > >=20
>>>>>> Don > > > "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>> wrote in =
>>>>>>message <A=20
>>>>>> href=3D"news:4538a5f0@linux">news:4538a5f0@linux</A>... >>I
=
>>>>>>am=20
>>>>>> presently >> >> 1) sending stuff to cubase and=20
>>>>>> back >> >> 2) recording into cubase or =
>>>>>>transferring files=20
>>>>>> into cubase, processing >> them and then sending them back
=
>>>>>>to=20
>>>>>> Paris. >> >> The second option is time aligned and =
>>>>>>sample=20
>>>>>> accurate (without plugs) but >> going out and back creates
=
>>>>>>at=20
>>>>>> least a 50 ms delay (without plugs) >> >> My =
>>>>>>question is=20
>>>>>> how do I determine the exact time delay for the round >> =
>>>>>>trip...I=20
>>>>>> can get close but not close enough. Is this a trial and error=20
>>>>>> >> thing or can this be determined accurately=20
>>>>>> beforehand >> >> >>=20
>>>>>> Don >> >> >> "Rod Lincoln" <<A=20
>>>>>> =
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com">rlincoln@nospamn.kc.rr.com</A>=
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> wrote in message >> <A=20
>>>>>> =
>>>>>>href=3D"news:453843ca$1@linux">news:453843ca$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>>>>>>t; >>>=20
>>>>>> Don, FWIW, I have sample accurate sync between Paris and Cubase
>>>>>> SX3=20
>>>>>> >>> going >>> either way, with Paris as =
>>>>>>master, via=20
>>>>>> adat 9 pin sync. >>> This doesn't take into account any =
>>>>>>plugs in=20
>>>>>> cubase though, just dry >>> tracks. >>> As =
>>>>>>far as=20
>>>>>> using Paris as a slave...it's not sample accurate, but it's=20
>>>>>> as >>> close as anything is with smpte or mtc. Those =
>>>>>>timecodes,=20
>>>>>> by nature, are >>> not >>> accurate on the =
>>>>>>sample=20
>>>>>> level, but are fine for most things, as long as >>>=20
>>>>>> phase >>> coherency (a la a multi miked drumkit) isn't =
>>>>>>needed. I=20
>>>>>> have done tests, >>> however, >>> and MTC =
>>>>>>is=20
>>>>>> tighter than SMPTE converted to MTC (Paris as slave) >>> =
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rod >>> "Don Nafe" <<A=20
>>>>>> href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>>>> wrote: >>>>May I ask how and also how you determined =
>>>>>>the=20
>>>>>> latency settings for Paris >>> =
>>>>>>or >>>>your second=20
>>>>>> rig and the various plugins you=20
>>>>>> use? >>>> >>>>I realise that's a =
>>>>>>loaded=20
>>>>>> question but I'm having trouble getting =
>>>>>>zero >>>>latency just=20
>>>>>> flying back and forth my Paris rig and my other rig =20
>>>>>> with >>> >>>>Cubase / SawStudio / Reaper =
>>>>>>let=20
>>>>>> alone adding plugs into the=20
>>>>>> =
>>>>>>equation >>>> >>>>Thanks >>>>=
>>>>>>; >>>> >>>>"Gene=20
>>>>>> Lennon" <<A =
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:glennon@NOSP.com">glennon@NOSP.com</A>> wrote=20
>>>>>> in message=20
>>>>>> =
>>>>>> >>>>news:4537e097$1@linux... >>>>> &=
>>>>>>gt;>>>>=20
>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <<A =
>>>>>>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>My Paris rig is the presently the =
>>>>>>master=20
>>>>>> also and like your setup rock >>>>>>solid...the =
>>>>>>
>>>>>> question was more of a "like to know"=20
>>>>>> question >>>>>> >>>>>>As =
>>>>>>to sample=20
>>>>>> accurate, is this flying tracks to and from Paris or =
>>>>>>just >>>=20
>>>>>> =
>>>>>>to >>>>> >>>>>>Paris >>&g=
>>>>>>t;>>> >>>>>>DOn >>>>>>=
>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>=20
>>>>>> Both. >>>>>=20
>>>>>> =
>>>>>>Gene >>>> >>>> >>> >><=
>>>>>>BR>>> > >=20
>>>>>> </BLOCKQUOTE>
>>>>>> <DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam,
>>>>> =
>>>>>>and=20
>>>>>> you? <A=20
>>>>>> =
>>>>>>href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
>>>>>>.html</A> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>I have promised myself that should this recording/mixing thing become a
viable business I will treat myself to a) a full dressed Harley or b) a
65/66 T-Bird Convertible

so far we're halfway there

Don

"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45393f12$1@linux...
>
> Ah, don't have any yet but I'll take some. She really is a lovely one.
> Standard
> hardtop (no Landau or convertible), Green, in pretty darn good shape, but
> of course there's a lot to be done . . .
>
> TCB
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>Pics of the bird man, pics of the bird!
>>
>>Don
>>
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>
>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966
>>> Thunderbird
>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>
>>> the
>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
> was
>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to the
>
>>> master
>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>
>>> Keep
>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how to
>
>>> design
>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> TCB
>>
>>
>OK then Mr. Banjohead,

Click on Weeeeee!!!!!!!!
http://squealpiggie.ytmnd.com/
http://www.funnyjunk.com/funny_pictures/788/Squeal+like+a+pi g

;o)

"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3fmjj2pgqi41jgp10rlv9u78qd65pd90j4@4ax.com...
> i'm tooo pretty for the big house. ;o)
>
> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 14:47:26 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>
> >are we gonna go to Tuscon and get arrested? I never got a confirmation on
> >that.
> >
> >;o)
> >
> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:vr3ij296k8e9cfraagtkc1e7coeklfpb7q@4ax.com...
> >> yup.
> >>
> >> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 10:30:40 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Well, this is pretty cool then. To get rid of these errors, all I've
got
> >to
> >> >do is change the default settings in WL.........right?
> >> >
> >> >;o)
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >> >news:tr2hj2hpp391cn4kj5p2ktere5bmpcc77o@4ax.com...
> >> >> at it's default setting wavelab will show 1000's of errors per
second.
> >> >>
> >> >> On 20 Oct 2006 04:56:18 +1000, "Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com>
wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> >"DJ" <no@way.jack> wrote:
> >> >> >>The other day I posted about my bounces having literally millions
of
> >> >errors
> >> >> >
> >> >> >>showing up in Wavelab. They were inaudible but it was bothering
the
> >hell
> >> >> >out
> >> >> >>of me that they were there. Well, I just ripped some commercial CD
> >> >tracks
> >> >> >
> >> >> >>(New Favorite-Allison Krause and Wide Open Spaces-Dixie Chicks)
and
> >ran
> >> >> >the
> >> >> >>same analysis on them. They are the same. Millions of (inaudible
> >errors)
> >> >> >
> >> >> >>digital errors. Also, the click detection shows as many or more of
> >these
> >> >> >
> >> >> >>than my mixes do. I was thinking my ears might be going south on
me
> >and
> >> >> >that
> >> >> >>my mix method using Cubase -into-Paris whil'st insanely clocked
was
> >> >creating
> >> >> >
> >> >> >>a mess that I just wasn't hearing but that would be rejected if I
> >ever
> >> >sent
> >> >> >
> >> >> >>a mix out of here to a third party mastering house. Well, if
> >anything,
> >> >my
> >> >> >
> >> >> >>mixes are the same or less error prone than the ones I'm seeing
here.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>Just another reason to trust the ears, not the eyes...............
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>Deej
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> >I have to look into this further, but my recent mixes (CD
> >masters),done
> >> >via
> >> >> >lightpipe to Paris, have been checked in PlexTools for errors and
have
> >
> >> >come
> >> >> >up 100% clean.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Gene
> >> >>
> >> >
> >>
> >
>Since we seem to be talking cars a little bit. My other 'baby', a 97 2.8
litre 6 cylinder Z3 turns 10 next month (date of manufacture dec 96).

It's garage kept, stored in winter has around 80k on it and runs like the
day I drove it home, maybe even better. I keep it up at my sisters in syracuse
NY, so I rarely get to drive it. I had the chance to hit the back country
roads this past summer and it was a blast.

St. Croix always used to pick on me, telling me to dump it and get a miata.
He always said the bimmers have 'ZERO' torque.

When I was growing up I was always fascinated by small british 2 seater 'droptops'.
When I got older, a very wise old friend advised me to stear completely
clear of any such vehicle if I ever wanted to actually drive.

When the z3s came out I thought it was just about what I wanted except for
the miniuscule 4 banger. I had previously owned a 74 2002 and racked up
200+K miles on it, so I didn't have any questions about reliability. I waited
around for the inline 6, and when it finally came out I pounced.

Anyway, to make a long story short, the older z's are pretty cheap now.
You can pick up an old 2.8 for under 10K. These cars are built like tanks
and extremely reliable. It's just shy of 200 horses, about 190 torque, zero
to 60 under 6 and an absolute blast to drive. The inline 2.8 engine is about
as reliable and time tested as they come, it's been floating around BMW models,
constantly refined for over 20 years.

So anyway, if anyone is looking around for a fun, relatively inexpensive
2 seat ragtop that's a blast to drive and reliable, I defintely recommend
you check out an older z3

ChuckI realized a few years ago that I didn't want to use the Z any more for daily
driving, and we needed a slightly more practical second car due to our growing
family.

In 2001 they were starting the zero financing stuff on Fords. We bought
a 2002 7 passenger explorer. They would only do zero % for three years at
that time, but I bit the bullet and took the higher payment to get it over
with and get that great rate (NOTHING). That car was paid off in 2004, and
I have NEVER had a single problem with it.

I took over my wifes previous vehicle as my daily driver. A 1995 Jetta GL
III 4cyl automatic. I cannot begin to describe the depths of my hatred for
that car.

Everything about it was oddball, from the antifreeze, to the oil to the battery,
to the doorlocks that froze and FELL OUT OF THE DOOR when I turned the key
in winter, to the stupid way the wheels get bolted on, body trim that fell
off in the wind, windshield that cracked with the slightest stone hit. OMFG
that car drove me crazy. Quick group question, has anyone ever seen, anywhere
an older jetta that HAS THE RUBBER BODY TRIM STRIPS INTACT!!!

Besides all that, a constant stream of expensive repairs that never seemed
to resolve anything. But hey, it was paid for and it ran (well kind of meandered
was more like it). Who could ask for more, right?

So I drove it from 2004 till last october, when on my way home from work
somehow, unbeknownst to me EVERY SINGLE DROP OF OIL LEAKED FROM THE ENGINE.
The next day I went to start it, it let out an ear piercing scream of metal
on metal and never moved again. I was so disgusted with it I let it sit
and rot for the next year, and along the way lost the keys.

I went to donate it but they didn't want it without keys. I called VW about
getting keys. They said to bring it to a dealership!. Yeah right, tow it
to a dealership, to get a key, so I could tow it back to my house to dump
it and donate it. Jeez....

Finally I found someone who would pick up the piece of shit engine siezed
no doorlock, no bodytrim, batteryless, keyless jetta 'for free'.

I am finally FREE!

ChuckI'm using a G4 with OWC 1.5ghz processor. it works great
and rendering tracks and overviews is noticeable faster
than my original 800mhz processor.
cheers,
Mike

"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>So what�s the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not classic
>of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867 Mhz
>machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to indicate
>that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn�t specify whether
>it�s classic or not.
>
>Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an accelerator
>(say, Sonnet)?
>
>Thanks,
>DaleHi Dimitrios,

I tried the dummy track, but still no luck.

I have the mac sending to the ip address, and the channel name shows up in the paris instance, so I am assuming that the two systems are seeing each other here.

I just set the Digital Performer channel to "start" and paris to "end" for each instance?

Do I need sync checked? What about buffer settings and the "play through" option?

Thanks a lot for you help!

TC

Dimitrios wrote:
> Hi,
> One dum question too.
> Have you connected the two computers via ethernet and does this work ok ?
> ALSO VITAL did you put an empty 24 bit audio file on the track you wanna
> accept wormholed audio ??
> This might be the missing point right ?
>
> Secondly use FXpansion 3.3 to wrap wormhole in Paris.
> If it does not work something with your ethernet connection beetween computers
> might be wrong.
> Wormhole works, tested...
> Regards,
> Dimitrios
>
> TC <tc@spammetodeathyoubastards.org> wrote:
>> Can anyone give me a quick walk through of what settings I need on each
> machine for
>> wormhole?
>>
>> I've got Wormhole in DP5 set on "start" under direct, and named the channel.
> In paris
>> I selected "end" and then the "channel name - end" from the drop down.
>>
>> Is there anything else I need to do paris wise with this to get it to work?
>>
>> I'm just getting the "host is not feeding audio to Wormhole2" message at
> the bottom
>> in Paris on the insert.
>>
>> I'll look at the plasq manual again, but I just thought if someone has a
> quick answer
>> as to what I'm doing wrong here..
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> TC
>I also noticed that in Paris if I select "end" under direct, then try and select "test - end" (my wh channel name) from the chooser, it doesn't seem to take (the name doesn't appear where it says "enter channel name or use chooser").

If I click "start" though, "test" appears in the channel name.

I guess I need to look at the manual again.. RTFM once again..

Cheers,

TC

TC wrote:
> Hi Dimitrios,
>
> I tried the dummy track, but still no luck.
>
> I have the mac sending to the ip address, and the channel name shows up
> in the paris instance, so I am assuming that the two systems are seeing
> each other here.
>
> I just set the Digital Performer channel to "start" and paris to "end"
> for each instance?
>
> Do I need sync checked? What about buffer settings and the "play
> through" option?
>
> Thanks a lot for you help!
>
> TC
>glad to hear it.

c.

On 21 Oct 2006 06:11:11 +1000, "Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com> wrote:

>
>Chas. Duncan <duncan5199ATsbcglobalDOTnet@> wrote:
>>
>>Tyrone --
>>
>>I was about to say the same thing -- not a good sign at all... Might
>>be time for Gene to step away from the computer and walk around
>>outside for a while. By himself, if you see what I mean...
>>
>>-- good luck with that, Gene, and keep the good thoughts coming, both
>>of you...
>>
>>chas.
>>
>We thank you for your concern. Outdoor activities are planned for tomorrow.
>
>
>GeneDoes Paris works on W2K with the XP driver ?Media Matrix was the first, and is still a great product.

That's exactly what I am talking about. What enormous
potential an FX box would have, controlled in such a manner.

It's not at all hard to do, it's simply a matter of getting the
manufacturers minds around it.

DC

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>DC,
>
>I'm not familiar with soundweb, but I am familiar with the Peavey Mediamatrix
>system, and it has a similar, but even more powerful design surface in combination
>with a DSP mainframe that allows you to do exactly what you describe. It's
>all digital and cobranet based.
>
>The system a sub of ours put in at Phoenix Sky Harbor airport has 128 inputs,
>64 sense mic inputs (PZM) and 128 outputs per headend, with one head-end
>per terminal. Logical zones can be created that route any input to any
output
>group. The only analog portion of the chain is the ADC that each mic connects
>to. From there on it's 20 bit 48KHZ digital audio over cobranet to the
mainframe.
>
>
>Eq, ducking, limiting and agc (sense mic based) on every channel. The
routing
>matrix and 'effects' are laid out in a design surface much like the one
you
>pointed us to.
>
>The system has integrated high quality text to speech in up to 13 languages,
>queuing and prioritization of audio and virtually unlimited logical zones.
>
>What I was getting at before, is that it's not all that difficult to write
>these sorts of design surfaces, as long as the underlying hardware supports
>the design activity. They are like big remote control surfaces.
>
>Klotz digital has a similar system that XM radio uses in their studios on
>beautiful Florida Avenue here in our nations capital :-)
>
>
>Chuck
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Aaron and Chuck,
>>
>>The device I have in mind does not exist. I used a Soundweb
>>file simply as an example of clear layout and usage.
>>
>>A SW for guitar would kill in the EQ and compression stuff,
>>but not much else other than running 20 amps at once!
>>
>>I am thinking of a very powerful box like the TC G-Major, for
>>instance, that instead of one cliched preset after another, that
>>you then have to modify, it would allow you to use the DSP in
>>any way you wish. If you want 96 channels of parametric to
>>do a .05 octave L-R band split, you could do it. If you wanted
>>8 delays, all assigned and modulated differently, you could do
>>that too, because nobody has decided that you don't need to
>>do that.
>>
>>The SW app is wonderfully powerful and simple to use (once
>>you learn it, like anything else)
>>
>>Hey, why don't you download it, and I can send you a couple
>>of my design files? Imagine FX modules in addition to the
>>pro audio stuff, and you can see the power available.
>>
>>You can get it for free here:
>>
>>http://www.bss.co.uk/soundweb/designerdownload/latest.html
>>
>>This is such a powerful model for controlling DSP that I cannot
>>believe it has not been used in studio or guitar FX yet.
>>
>>If you get the app let me know.
>>
>>DC
>>
>>
>>
>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Don,
>>>
>>>Are all the params you are talking about controllable by midi? If so
the
>>>kind of app you are talking about is definitely possible.
>>>
>>>Chuck
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersatnamm.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Hi Aaron,
>>>>
>>>>What I want to do is to have a playing field on the computer screen,
>>>>kinda like the Soundweb example I attached here. You add modules
>>>>to it in the order you prefer, then you open them and dial the
>>>>settings in. It's a more simple and sophisticated app I am looking

>>>>for. No one makes an FX processor like this at all, and it would be
>
>>>>very cool. When you use the MagicStomp, you page through
>>>>all these presets, looking for one that is close to what you want,
>>>>then you open it and more pages to find the control you want, and
>>>>some presets have that control available and some do not, and
>>>>there is no well to tell without digging through all of 'em.
>>>>I would like to be able to start from scratch, with everything
>>>>available, and design what I need, rather than this convoluted
>>>>nonsense where certain processors show up and others do not,
>>>>depending on the preset you are playing with.
>>>>
>>>>I should build it huh?
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>if you want to pie up the FX (it has two chips in it dedicated to FX),
>>>you
>>>>
>>>>>should try ebay for a used 2112 / 2120 from digitech. Sweet sweet unit,
>>>>
>>>>>presets suck.
>>>>>The modifiers section in that thing is the most comprehensive section
>>I've
>>>>
>>>>>ever seen and it's tube and/or solid state on the pre.
>>>>>
>>>>>AA
>>>
>>
>Ouch... sounds awful... We had a 2000 VW GTI with the VR6
motor and it was nearly flawless. We changed a couple of
sensors and part of the window regulator and that's about it.

Evidently they got the message?

I drive a 1971 BMW 2002 with a 1995 318ti motor in it.

Here's a story on it...

http://www.francisscott.com/~bmw2002/gallery/don.htm

That is my LAST engine swap...

DCDon,

VW produces a quality car now AFAIK. 95 and prior, I don't think that was
the case.

Is there anything we wouldn't do to keep a 2002 running? I know in that
I would still have mine today if a friend of mine hadn't wrecked it beyond
repair. Is he still a friend, no I dont think so :-)

Chuck

"DC" <dc@spammersinDK.com> wrote:
>
>Ouch... sounds awful... We had a 2000 VW GTI with the VR6
>motor and it was nearly flawless. We changed a couple of
>sensors and part of the window regulator and that's about it.
>
>Evidently they got the message?
>
>
>I drive a 1971 BMW 2002 with a 1995 318ti motor in it.
>
>Here's a story on it...
>
>http://www.francisscott.com/~bmw2002/gallery/don.htm
>
>That is my LAST engine swap...
>
>DC
>02 prices have really taken off too. Anything decent is now 7K
and nice ones hit 20 all the time.

Mine is not for sale. I kind of miss the sewing machine
sounds of the stock motor, but I do NOT miss carbs and
distributors at all.

Truly one of the great cars.

BTW, BMW Mobile Tradition built a brand new Tii from parts

take a look:

http://www.worldcarfans.com/classics.cfm/classicid/5060331.0 02/country/bmw/bmw/bmw-2002-tii-classic-celebrates-ressurect ion

I want it.

DC

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>Don,
>
>VW produces a quality car now AFAIK. 95 and prior, I don't think that was
>the case.
>
>Is there anything we wouldn't do to keep a 2002 running? I know in that
>I would still have mine today if a friend of mine hadn't wrecked it beyond
>repair. Is he still a friend, no I dont think so :-)
>
>Chuck
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinDK.com> wrote:
>>
>>Ouch... sounds awful... We had a 2000 VW GTI with the VR6
>>motor and it was nearly flawless. We changed a couple of
>>sensors and part of the window regulator and that's about it.
>>
>>Evidently they got the message?
>>
>>
>>I drive a 1971 BMW 2002 with a 1995 318ti motor in it.
>>
>>Here's a story on it...
>>
>>http://www.francisscott.com/~bmw2002/gallery/don.htm
>>
>>That is my LAST engine swap...
>>
>>DC
>>
>Hey Don,

I checked out your engine swap site. Labor of love beyond reason? Not possible.
Awesome job.

Chuck

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>02 prices have really taken off too. Anything decent is now 7K
>and nice ones hit 20 all the time.
>
>Mine is not for sale. I kind of miss the sewing machine
>sounds of the stock motor, but I do NOT miss carbs and
>distributors at all.
>
>Truly one of the great cars.
>
>BTW, BMW Mobile Tradition built a brand new Tii from parts
>
>take a look:
>
> http://www.worldcarfans.com/classics.cfm/classicid/5060331.0 02/country/bmw/bmw/bmw-2002-tii-classic-celebrates-ressurect ion
>
>I want it.
>
>DC
>
>
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>Don,
>>
>>VW produces a quality car now AFAIK. 95 and prior, I don't think that
was
>>the case.
>>
>>Is there anything we wouldn't do to keep a 2002 running? I know in that
>>I would still have mine today if a friend of mine hadn't wrecked it beyond
>>repair. Is he still a friend, no I dont think so :-)
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinDK.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Ouch... sounds awful... We had a 2000 VW GTI with the VR6
>>>motor and it was nearly flawless. We changed a couple of
>>>sensors and part of the window regulator and that's about it.
>>>
>>>Evidently they got the message?
>>>
>>>
>>>I drive a 1971 BMW 2002 with a 1995 318ti motor in it.
>>>
>>>Here's a story on it...
>>>
>>>http://www.francisscott.com/~bmw2002/gallery/don.htm
>>>
>>>That is my LAST engine swap...
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>
>Pretty funny...

http://people.consolidated.net/marcab/Bob_and_Tom_-_Telemark eter_Nightmare.mp3I had a 65' hard top .. tre' cool man. The dash lighting, sequential signals
and flip away steering were definitely the bomb.
AA

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:453a38c3$1@linux...
>I have promised myself that should this recording/mixing thing become a
>viable business I will treat myself to a) a full dressed Harley or b) a
>65/66 T-Bird Convertible
>
> so far we're halfway there
>
> Don
>
>
> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45393f12$1@linux...
>>
>> Ah, don't have any yet but I'll take some. She really is a lovely one.
>> Standard
>> hardtop (no Landau or convertible), Green, in pretty darn good shape, but
>> of course there's a lot to be done . . .
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>Pics of the bird man, pics of the bird!
>>>
>>>Don
>>>
>>>
>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966
>>>> Thunderbird
>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>
>>>> the
>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>> was
>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to the
>>
>>>> master
>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>
>>>> Keep
>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how to
>>
>>>> design
>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>Thanks. Pertty nutty for sure. It drives really nicely though, and
has been totally reliable.

I love the look on the Car Club people's faces when I lift the hood.

heh heh

No surprise we all ended up using PARIS huh?

Somewhere SSC is grinning... (he never smiled, only grinned)

DC

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>Hey Don,
>
>I checked out your engine swap site. Labor of love beyond reason? Not
possible.
>Awesome job.
>
>Chuck
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>02 prices have really taken off too. Anything decent is now 7K
>>and nice ones hit 20 all the time.
>>
>>Mine is not for sale. I kind of miss the sewing machine
>>sounds of the stock motor, but I do NOT miss carbs and
>>distributors at all.
>>
>>Truly one of the great cars.
>>
>>BTW, BMW Mobile Tradition built a brand new Tii from parts
>>
>>take a look:
>>
>> http://www.worldcarfans.com/classics.cfm/classicid/5060331.0 02/country/bmw/bmw/bmw-2002-tii-classic-celebrates-ressurect ion
>>
>>I want it.
>>
>>DC
>>
>>
>>
>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Don,
>>>
>>>VW produces a quality car now AFAIK. 95 and prior, I don't think that
>was
>>>the case.
>>>
>>>Is there anything we wouldn't do to keep a 2002 running? I know in that
>>>I would still have mine today if a friend of mine hadn't wrecked it beyond
>>>repair. Is he still a friend, no I dont think so :-)
>>>
>>>Chuck
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinDK.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Ouch... sounds awful... We had a 2000 VW GTI with the VR6
>>>>motor and it was nearly flawless. We changed a couple of
>>>>sensors and part of the window regulator and that's about it.
>>>>
>>>>Evidently they got the message?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I drive a 1971 BMW 2002 with a 1995 318ti motor in it.
>>>>
>>>>Here's a story on it...
>>>>
>>>>http://www.francisscott.com/~bmw2002/gallery/don.htm
>>>>
>>>>That is my LAST engine swap...
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>
>>
>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0040_01C6F520.8A4CB7C0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

ahh, now I've got my head in your space. Yeah that would be about the =
coolest thing ever.... I remember the promise of this in the early days =
of DAW with Metalithic. Man, I wish they would have made it.=20

AA

"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:453a5a8e$1@linux...
>=20
> Media Matrix was the first, and is still a great product.
>=20
> That's exactly what I am talking about. What enormous
> potential an FX box would have, controlled in such a manner.
>=20
> It's not at all hard to do, it's simply a matter of getting the
> manufacturers minds around it.
>=20
> DC
>=20
>=20
> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>DC,
>>
>>I'm not familiar with soundweb, but I am familiar with the Peavey =
Mediamatrix
>>system, and it has a similar, but even more powerful design surface in =
combination
>>with a DSP mainframe that allows you to do exactly what you describe. =
It's
>>all digital and cobranet based.
>>
>>The system a sub of ours put in at Phoenix Sky Harbor airport has 128 =
inputs,
>>64 sense mic inputs (PZM) and 128 outputs per headend, with one =
head-end
>>per terminal. Logical zones can be created that route any input to =
any
> output
>>group. The only analog portion of the chain is the ADC that each mic =
connects
>>to. From there on it's 20 bit 48KHZ digital audio over cobranet to =
the
> mainframe.
>>
>>
>>Eq, ducking, limiting and agc (sense mic based) on every channel. The =

> routing
>>matrix and 'effects' are laid out in a design surface much like the =
one
> you
>>pointed us to. =20
>>
>>The system has integrated high quality text to speech in up to 13 =
languages,
>>queuing and prioritization of audio and virtually unlimited logical =
zones.
>>
>>What I was getting at before, is that it's not all that difficult to =
write
>>these sorts of design surfaces, as long as the underlying hardware =
supports
>>the design activity. They are like big remote control surfaces.
>>
>>Klotz digital has a similar system that XM radio uses in their studios =
on
>>beautiful Florida Avenue here in our nations capital :-)
>>
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Aaron and Chuck,
>>>
>>>The device I have in mind does not exist. I used a Soundweb
>>>file simply as an example of clear layout and usage. =20
>>>
>>>A SW for guitar would kill in the EQ and compression stuff,
>>>but not much else other than running 20 amps at once!
>>>
>>>I am thinking of a very powerful box like the TC G-Major, for
>>>instance, that instead of one cliched preset after another, that
>>>you then have to modify, it would allow you to use the DSP in
>>>any way you wish. If you want 96 channels of parametric to
>>>do a .05 octave L-R band split, you could do it. If you wanted
>>>8 delays, all assigned and modulated differently, you could do
>>>that too, because nobody has decided that you don't need to
>>>do that.
>>>
>>>The SW app is wonderfully powerful and simple to use (once
>>>you learn it, like anything else)
>>>
>>>Hey, why don't you download it, and I can send you a couple
>>>of my design files? Imagine FX modules in addition to the
>>>pro audio stuff, and you can see the power available.
>>>
>>>You can get it for free here:
>>>
>>>http://www.bss.co.uk/soundweb/designerdownload/latest.html
>>>
>>>This is such a powerful model for controlling DSP that I cannot
>>>believe it has not been used in studio or guitar FX yet.
>>>
>>>If you get the app let me know. =20
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Don,
>>>>
>>>>Are all the params you are talking about controllable by midi? If =
so
> the
>>>>kind of app you are talking about is definitely possible.
>>>>
>>>>Chuck
>>>>
>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersatnamm.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Hi Aaron,
>>>>>
>>>>>What I want to do is to have a playing field on the computer =
screen,
>>>>>kinda like the Soundweb example I attached here. You add modules
>>>>>to it in the order you prefer, then you open them and dial the
>>>>>settings in. It's a more simple and sophisticated app I am =
looking
>=20
>>>>>for. No one makes an FX processor like this at all, and it would =
be
>>
>>>>>very cool. When you use the MagicStomp, you page through
>>>>>all these presets, looking for one that is close to what you want,
>>>>>then you open it and more pages to find the control you want, and
>>>>>some presets have that control available and some do not, and=20
>>>>>there is no well to tell without digging through all of 'em.
>>>>>I would like to be able to start from scratch, with everything=20
>>>>>available, and design what I need, rather than this convoluted=20
>>>>>nonsense where certain processors show up and others do not,=20
>>>>>depending on the preset you are playing with.
>>>>>
>>>>>I should build it huh?
>>>>>
>>>>>DC
>>>>>
>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>>if you want to pie up the FX (it has two chips in it dedicated to =
FX),
>>>>you
>>>>>
>>>>>>should try ebay for a used 2112 / 2120 from digitech. Sweet sweet =
unit,
>>>>>
>>>>>>presets suck.
>>>>>>The modifiers section in that thing is the most comprehensive =
section
>>>I've
>>>>>
>>>>>>ever seen and it's tube and/or solid state on the pre.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>AA
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
------=_NextPart_000_0040_01C6F520.8A4CB7C0
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charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV>ahh, now I've got my head in your =
space. Yeah that=20
would be about the coolest thing ever.... I remember the promise of this =
in the=20
early days of DAW with <A=20
href=3D" http://news.harmony-central.com/Newp/SNAMM97/Other/Wings.htm l">Me=
talithic</A>.=20
Man, I wish they would have made it. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>AA</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>"DC" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com">dc@spammersinhell.com</A>> wrote in=20
message <A href=3D"news:453a5a8e$1@linux">news:453a5a8e$1@linux</A>...</DIV>> > Media =
Matrix was=20
the first, and is still a great product. > > That's exactly =
what I=20
am talking about.  What enormous > potential an FX box would =
have,=20
controlled in such a manner. > > It's not at all hard to =
do, it's=20
simply a matter of getting the > manufacturers minds around =
it. >=20
 > DC > > > "chuck duffy" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:c@c.com">c@c.com</A>> =
wrote: >> >>DC, >> >>I'm not=20
familiar with soundweb, but I am familiar with the Peavey=20
Mediamatrix >>system, and it has a similar, but even more =
powerful=20
design surface in combination >>with a DSP mainframe that =
allows you to=20
do exactly what you describe. It's >>all digital and cobranet=20
based. >> >>The system a sub of ours put in at Phoenix =
Sky=20
Harbor airport has 128 inputs, >>64 sense mic inputs (PZM) and =
128=20
outputs per headend, with one head-end >>per terminal.  =
Logical=20
zones can be created that route any input to any >=20
output >>group.  The only analog portion of the chain is =
the ADC=20
that each mic connects >>to.  From there on it's 20 bit =
48KHZ=20
digital audio over cobranet to the >=20
mainframe. >> >> >>Eq, ducking, limiting and =
agc=20
(sense mic based) on every channel.  The > =
routing >>matrix=20
and 'effects' are laid out in a design surface much like the one > =

you >>pointed us to.  >> >>The system =
has=20
integrated high quality text to speech in up to 13 =
languages, >>queuing=20
and prioritization of audio and virtually unlimited logical=20
zones. >> >>What I was getting at before, is that it's =
not all=20
that difficult to write >>these sorts of design surfaces, as =
long as=20
the underlying hardware supports >>the design activity.  =
They are=20
like big remote control surfaces. >> >>Klotz digital =
has a=20
similar system that XM radio uses in their studios =
on >>beautiful=20
Florida Avenue here in our nations capital=20
:-) >> >> >>Chuck >> >>"DC" =

<<A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com">dc@spammersinhell.com</A>>=20
wrote: >>> >>>Aaron and=20
Chuck, >>> >>>The device I have in mind does not =

exist.  I used a Soundweb >>>file simply as an example =
of clear=20
layout and usage.  >>> >>>A SW for guitar =
would=20
kill in the EQ and compression stuff, >>>but not much else =
other=20
than running 20 amps at once! >>> >>>I am =
thinking of a=20
very powerful box like the TC G-Major, for >>>instance, that =
instead=20
of one cliched preset after another, that >>>you then have =
to=20
modify, it would allow you to use the DSP in >>>any way you=20
wish.   If you want 96 channels of parametric =
to >>>do a=20
..05 octave L-R band split, you could do it.  If you =
wanted >>>8=20
delays, all assigned and modulated differently, you could =
do >>>that=20
too, because nobody has decided that you don't need to >>>do =

that. >>> >>>The SW app is wonderfully powerful =
and=20
simple to use (once >>>you learn it, like anything=20
else) >>> >>>Hey, why don't you download it, and =
I can=20
send you a couple >>>of my design files?   Imagine =
FX=20
modules in addition to the >>>pro audio stuff, and you can =
see the=20
power available. >>> >>>You can get it for free=20
here: >>> >>>http://www.bss.co.uk/soundweb/design=
erdownload/latest.html >>> >>>This=20
is such a powerful model for controlling DSP that I=20
cannot >>>believe it has not been used in studio or guitar =
FX=20
yet. >>> >>>If you get the app let me =
know. =20
 >>> >>>DC >>> >>> &gt=
;>> >>>"chuck=20
duffy" <<A href=3D"mailto:c@c.com">c@c.com</A>>=20
wrote: >>>> >>>>Don, >>>><BR=
>>>>>Are=20
all the params you are talking about controllable by midi?  If =
so >=20
the >>>>kind of app you are talking about is definitely=20
possible. >>>> >>>>Chuck >>>&gt=
; >>>>"DC"=20
<<A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersatnamm.com">dc@spammersatnamm.com</A>>=20
wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>&gt=
;> >>>>>Hi=20
Aaron, >>>>> >>>>>What I want to do =
is to=20
have a playing field on the computer =
screen, >>>>>kinda like=20
the Soundweb example I attached here.   You add=20
modules >>>>>to it in the order you prefer, then you =
open them=20
and dial the >>>>>settings in.   It's a more =
simple=20
and sophisticated app I am looking >=20
 >>>>>for. &n bsp; No one makes an FX processor =
like this=20
at all, and it would be >> >>>>>very=20
cool.   When you use the MagicStomp, you page=20
through >>>>>all these presets, looking for one that =
is close=20
to what you want, >>>>>then you open it and more pages =
to find=20
the control you want, and >>>>>some presets have that =
control=20
available and some do not, and >>>>>there is no well =
to tell=20
without digging through all of 'em. >>>>>I would like =
to be=20
able to start from scratch, with everything =
 >>>>>available,=20
and design what I need, rather than this convoluted=20
 >>>>>nonsense where certain processors show up and =
others do=20
not, >>>>>depending on the preset you are playing=20
with. >>>>> >>>>>I should build it=20
huh? >>>>> >>>>>DC >>>&gt=
;> >>>>>"Aaron=20
Allen" <<A href=3D"mailto:know-spam@not_here.dude">know-spam@not_here.dude</A>>=20
wrote: >>>>>>if you want to pie up the FX (it has =
two chips=20
in it dedicated to=20
FX), >>>>you >>>>> >>>>&g=
t;>should=20
try ebay for a used 2112 / 2120 from digitech. Sweet sweet=20
unit, >>>>> >>>>>>presets=20
suck. >>>>>>The modifiers section in that thing is =
the most=20
comprehensive=20
section >>>I've >>>>> >>>>&g=
t;>ever=20
seen and it's tube and/or solid state on the=20
pre. >>>>>> >>>>>>AA >&gt=
;>> >>> >> ></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0040_01C6F520.8A4CB7C0--Hilarious!!!

"John Macy" <spamlessjohn@johnmacy.com> wrote:
>
>Pretty funny...
>
> http://people.consolidated.net/marcab/Bob_and_Tom_-_Telemark eter_Nightmare.mp3I had an 80's something sirocco with less than 25k original miles on it. I
named it Satan. One day it almost got me killed ( the plastic housing on the
clutch cable split out and pushed me in front of a Semi whilst I was trying
to unhinge it from 4th gear ). The next day I put it out in the field at my
brother's place in the country where I will watch it slowly rot to rust.

AA

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453a45a7$1@linux...
>
> I realized a few years ago that I didn't want to use the Z any more for
> daily
> driving, and we needed a slightly more practical second car due to our
> growing
> family.
>
> In 2001 they were starting the zero financing stuff on Fords. We bought
> a 2002 7 passenger explorer. They would only do zero % for three years at
> that time, but I bit the bullet and took the higher payment to get it over
> with and get that great rate (NOTHING). That car was paid off in 2004,
> and
> I have NEVER had a single problem with it.
>
> I took over my wifes previous vehicle as my daily driver. A 1995 Jetta GL
> III 4cyl automatic. I cannot begin to describe the depths of my hatred
> for
> that car.
>
> Everything about it was oddball, from the antifreeze, to the oil to the
> battery,
> to the doorlocks that froze and FELL OUT OF THE DOOR when I turned the key
> in winter, to the stupid way the wheels get bolted on, body trim that fell
> off in the wind, windshield that cracked with the slightest stone hit.
> OMFG
> that car drove me crazy. Quick group question, has anyone ever seen,
> anywhere
> an older jetta that HAS THE RUBBER BODY TRIM STRIPS INTACT!!!
>
> Besides all that, a constant stream of expensive repairs that never seemed
> to resolve anything. But hey, it was paid for and it ran (well kind of
> meandered
> was more like it). Who could ask for more, right?
>
> So I drove it from 2004 till last october, when on my way home from work
> somehow, unbeknownst to me EVERY SINGLE DROP OF OIL LEAKED FROM THE
> ENGINE.
> The next day I went to start it, it let out an ear piercing scream of
> metal
> on metal and never moved again. I was so disgusted with it I let it sit
> and rot for the next year, and along the way lost the keys.
>
> I went to donate it but they didn't want it without keys. I called VW
> about
> getting keys. They said to bring it to a dealership!. Yeah right, tow it
> to a dealership, to get a key, so I could tow it back to my house to dump
> it and donate it. Jeez....
>
> Finally I found someone who would pick up the piece of shit engine siezed
> no doorlock, no bodytrim, batteryless, keyless jetta 'for free'.
>
> I am finally FREE!
>
> ChuckI believe a few have reported that it does here.
I have not personally tried it, and there might be some issues with driver
install paths and Direct X to watch out for.

AA

"Damien Gel�e" <damien.gelee@club-internet.fr> wrote in message
news:453a58be@linux...
> Does Paris works on W2K with the XP driver ?
>oops sorry, i just find the anser in the xp driver readme.txt ==>

This document explains how to update your Paris 2.x or 3.x installation to
support Microsoft Windows 2000 or Microsoft Windows XP.

"Damien Gel�e" <damien.gelee@club-internet.fr> a �crit dans le message de
news: 453a58be@linux...
> Does Paris works on W2K with the XP driver ?
>Using an old Matrox G450 PCI video card in a Gigabyte GA-K8NS Ultra 939 mobo
will cause it not to post

Using an NVidia GEForce 5500 dual head in an old ASUS A7V mobo (which works
great with Paris and the old Matrox G450 video cards) will be incredibly
unstable, eventually causing the system to boot repeatedly to safe mode.
Also, this video card/chipset/driver combination does not like the EDS
driver and will cause error messages stating that the master card is not
connected to the MEC.I'm no overclocker (or any kind of clocker I guess). I'm testing a mobo,
getting ready to load Windows on this beast and when the system posts, the
AMD 4200 dual core is showing up at 200mhz. If I boot to the bios there are
clock settings but I'm an idiot and don't know what to set to get tis thing
happening at 2100MHZ........and since I blow stuff up sometimes, I want to
at least get some advice before I fry the CPU. I'll be testing a 3 card
Paris system on this rig to see how/if it can work with dual core CPU's and
multiple C-16's so so if anyone wants to pitch in, please give me a ring

970-375-7081

Thanks,

DeejI need to do some slight changes on 7 mixes tomorrow.
I think I will try pulling every fader down by 1 as well as all effects and
automation points.
See what I do is probably totally wrong but I have been running a pair of
BAE 312's oi the master bus as an insert, but because I don't yet have an
ATTY I have to back the submix faders down to about -8 or so so I don;t clip
coming back in. This may allow me to also bring those back up a tad. But
really I'd love to get a bit more air in there too.

"Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>This is how I use to mix by pushing the red all the time, louder is better

>rite....!! I started noticing my mixs were loud alright but getting dull
and
>almost distorted at times, specially the more quiet Country/bluegrass stuff.

>I started being more conservative with the faders, hardly and reds and I

>keep my submix master around -1, I found my mixs have cleaned up
>drastically.
>
>My two cents....
>Rob
>
>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:4538da56@linux...
>>I push em till they scream and use my ears. We don't care about no
>>stinking red lights.
>>
>> John
>>
>> Cujo wrote:
>>> How hot do you gys push faders during mix..
>>> Remebering the BT vid, he mentions lowereing channels will give Paris
a
>>> clearer
>>> sound.
>>> Where do you guys generally keep them?
>
>Poop. I was about to drop the bomb on a pair of the 5500's for my asus A7s
paris rig.
Wanna get rid of your PCI Matrox?
AA

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453a826a@linux...
> Using an old Matrox G450 PCI video card in a Gigabyte GA-K8NS Ultra 939
> mobo
> will cause it not to post
>
> Using an NVidia GEForce 5500 dual head in an old ASUS A7V mobo (which
> works
> great with Paris and the old Matrox G450 video cards) will be incredibly
> unstable, eventually causing the system to boot repeatedly to safe mode.
> Also, this video card/chipset/driver combination does not like the EDS
> driver and will cause error messages stating that the master card is not
> connected to the MEC.
>
>
>
>It's easier just to bump down the EQ gain by 1 db everywhere than fooling
with all your automation, ainnit?
AA

"Cujo" <chris@applemanstudio.com> wrote in message news:453a8b66$1@linux...
>
>
> I need to do some slight changes on 7 mixes tomorrow.
> I think I will try pulling every fader down by 1 as well as all effects
> and
> automation points.
> See what I do is probably totally wrong but I have been running a pair of
> BAE 312's oi the master bus as an insert, but because I don't yet have an
> ATTY I have to back the submix faders down to about -8 or so so I don;t
> clip
> coming back in. This may allow me to also bring those back up a tad. But
> really I'd love to get a bit more air in there too.
>
> "Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>This is how I use to mix by pushing the red all the time, louder is better
>
>>rite....!! I started noticing my mixs were loud alright but getting dull
> and
>>almost distorted at times, specially the more quiet Country/bluegrass
>>stuff.
>
>>I started being more conservative with the faders, hardly and reds and I
>
>>keep my submix master around -1, I found my mixs have cleaned up
>>drastically.
>>
>>My two cents....
>>Rob
>>
>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:4538da56@linux...
>>>I push em till they scream and use my ears. We don't care about no
>>>stinking red lights.
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>> Cujo wrote:
>>>> How hot do you gys push faders during mix..
>>>> Remebering the BT vid, he mentions lowereing channels will give Paris
> a
>>>> clearer
>>>> sound.
>>>> Where do you guys generally keep them?
>>
>>
>http://www.recordproduction.com/jason-miles.htmlI think this is the funniest thing thats been posted on the NG! LOL!

James

"John Macy" <spamlessjohn@johnmacy.com> wrote:
>
>Pretty funny...
>
> http://people.consolidated.net/marcab/Bob_and_Tom_-_Telemark eter_Nightmare.mp3I can't right now, but maybe .............sooooooonnnn!!!!!!!!!!

"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
news:453a8d3f@linux...
> Poop. I was about to drop the bomb on a pair of the 5500's for my asus A7s
> paris rig.
> Wanna get rid of your PCI Matrox?
> AA
>
> "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453a826a@linux...
> > Using an old Matrox G450 PCI video card in a Gigabyte GA-K8NS Ultra 939
> > mobo
> > will cause it not to post
> >
> > Using an NVidia GEForce 5500 dual head in an old ASUS A7V mobo (which
> > works
> > great with Paris and the old Matrox G450 video cards) will be incredibly
> > unstable, eventually causing the system to boot repeatedly to safe mode.
> > Also, this video card/chipset/driver combination does not like the EDS
> > driver and will cause error messages stating that the master card is not
> > connected to the MEC.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>HI DJ,
Which motherboard was it again?

Chris

DJ wrote:

>I'm no overclocker (or any kind of clocker I guess). I'm testing a mobo,
>getting ready to load Windows on this beast and when the system posts, the
>AMD 4200 dual core is showing up at 200mhz. If I boot to the bios there are
>clock settings but I'm an idiot and don't know what to set to get tis thing
>happening at 2100MHZ........and since I blow stuff up sometimes, I want to
>at least get some advice before I fry the CPU. I'll be testing a 3 card
>Paris system on this rig to see how/if it can work with dual core CPU's and
>multiple C-16's so so if anyone wants to pitch in, please give me a ring
>
>970-375-7081
>
>Thanks,
>
>Deej
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

--
Chris Ludwig
ADK
chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
(859) 635-5762Naw...just Ctrl A in the auto editor, and pull all down by 1 db.
Rinse and repeat for each submix. Maximum of 8 moves, as opposed to a possible
maxium of 128 moves.
If no automation is written, do a ctrl N in the mixer and lower by one. 8
moves at the most here also. Make sure fader groups are turned off first
though (for method B)
Rod
"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>It's easier just to bump down the EQ gain by 1 db everywhere than fooling

>with all your automation, ainnit?
>AA
>
>
>"Cujo" <chris@applemanstudio.com> wrote in message news:453a8b66$1@linux...
>>
>>
>> I need to do some slight changes on 7 mixes tomorrow.
>> I think I will try pulling every fader down by 1 as well as all effects

>> and
>> automation points.
>> See what I do is probably totally wrong but I have been running a pair
of
>> BAE 312's oi the master bus as an insert, but because I don't yet have
an
>> ATTY I have to back the submix faders down to about -8 or so so I don;t

>> clip
>> coming back in. This may allow me to also bring those back up a tad. But
>> really I'd love to get a bit more air in there too.
>>
>> "Rob Arsenault" <mani2@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote:
>>>This is how I use to mix by pushing the red all the time, louder is better
>>
>>>rite....!! I started noticing my mixs were loud alright but getting dull
>> and
>>>almost distorted at times, specially the more quiet Country/bluegrass

>>>stuff.
>>
>>>I started being more conservative with the faders, hardly and reds and
I
>>
>>>keep my submix master around -1, I found my mixs have cleaned up
>>>drastically.
>>>
>>>My two cents....
>>>Rob
>>>
>>>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:4538da56@linux...
>>>>I push em till they scream and use my ears. We don't care about no
>>>>stinking red lights.
>>>>
>>>> John
>>>>
>>>> Cujo wrote:
>>>>> How hot do you gys push faders during mix..
>>>>> Remebering the BT vid, he mentions lowereing channels will give Paris
>> a
>>>>> clearer
>>>>> sound.
>>>>> Where do you guys generally keep them?
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>Never mind i saw it in the other post.
Before you start toying with over clocking make sure you did these
things. They will increase the odds for stability with the Paris and
over clocking.

1. Make sure you have the most current BIOS.
2. Use the the newest Nividia motherboard chipset driver s from Nvidias
website.
3. Install AMD dual core optimizer driver from AMDs website.
Install MIcrosoft CPU Hotfix driver.
4. Install current Nividia video driver
5. Install all the latest xp updates. Use the custom option. "Install
the framework 2.0 last"
6. Do XP tweaks

Install the Paris stuff and see if it works before you start fooling
around. I would also suggest doing a system image before you start over
clocking, especially if you get paris working OK. Over clocking to far
will some time hose your xp install.

Chris

Chris Ludwig wrote:

> HI DJ,
> Which motherboard was it again?
>
> Chris
>
>
> DJ wrote:
>
>> I'm no overclocker (or any kind of clocker I guess). I'm testing a mobo,
>> getting ready to load Windows on this beast and when the system
>> posts, the
>> AMD 4200 dual core is showing up at 200mhz. If I boot to the bios
>> there are
>> clock settings but I'm an idiot and don't know what to set to get tis
>> thing
>> happening at 2100MHZ........and since I blow stuff up sometimes, I
>> want to
>> at least get some advice before I fry the CPU. I'll be testing a 3 card
>> Paris system on this rig to see how/if it can work with dual core
>> CPU's and
>> multiple C-16's so so if anyone wants to pitch in, please give me a ring
>>
>> 970-375-7081
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Deej
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>

--
Chris Ludwig
ADK
chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
(859) 635-5762Hey Chuck,

I still can't find the original post you're talking about, but thanks so
much for piping in. That's REALLY interesting. I must needs try some new
things with the native systems I use. Wow. Funny stuff. I've got mean things
on my mind . . .

TCB

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just the
source
>code for the mixer.
>
>Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the individual
>channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master. That's
why
>you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'. This
>is what many analog consoles do.
>
>Chuck
>
>John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the
>>Submix masters ?
>>
>>DJ wrote:
>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and it
still
>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
it
>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders that
>are
>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal DAW
>would
>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>
>>> ;o)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966 Thunderbird
>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>> the
>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>was
>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
the
>>> master
>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>> Keep
>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
to
>>> design
>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>
>>>
>Chris,

I just want to get it clocked above 200MHZ right now. that's it's default
and it has the most recent bios already. what would the voltage settings be
to get this puppy to 2100 mHZ?

Thanks,

Deej

"Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
news:453aa792$1@linux...
> Never mind i saw it in the other post.
> Before you start toying with over clocking make sure you did these
> things. They will increase the odds for stability with the Paris and
> over clocking.
>
> 1. Make sure you have the most current BIOS.
> 2. Use the the newest Nividia motherboard chipset driver s from Nvidias
> website.
> 3. Install AMD dual core optimizer driver from AMDs website.
> Install MIcrosoft CPU Hotfix driver.
> 4. Install current Nividia video driver
> 5. Install all the latest xp updates. Use the custom option. "Install
> the framework 2.0 last"
> 6. Do XP tweaks
>
>
> Install the Paris stuff and see if it works before you start fooling
> around. I would also suggest doing a system image before you start over
> clocking, especially if you get paris working OK. Over clocking to far
> will some time hose your xp install.
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
> Chris Ludwig wrote:
>
> > HI DJ,
> > Which motherboard was it again?
> >
> > Chris
> >
> >
> > DJ wrote:
> >
> >> I'm no overclocker (or any kind of clocker I guess). I'm testing a
mobo,
> >> getting ready to load Windows on this beast and when the system
> >> posts, the
> >> AMD 4200 dual core is showing up at 200mhz. If I boot to the bios
> >> there are
> >> clock settings but I'm an idiot and don't know what to set to get tis
> >> thing
> >> happening at 2100MHZ........and since I blow stuff up sometimes, I
> >> want to
> >> at least get some advice before I fry the CPU. I'll be testing a 3 card
> >> Paris system on this rig to see how/if it can work with dual core
> >> CPU's and
> >> multiple C-16's so so if anyone wants to pitch in, please give me a
ring
> >>
> >> 970-375-7081
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> Deej
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> --
> Chris Ludwig
> ADK
> chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
> www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
> (859) 635-5762I'm scared of two wheelers of any kind but I love my 'bird. The one I bought
is amazing on the engine front, purrs like a kitten. But it has pretty serious
electrical problems. I've managed to get the basics working, the headlights
and (gloriously sequential) tailights work, along with the turn signals and
such. But the entire dash is dark and there's a short somewhere so I get
all redeck when I drive it and pop the hood to turn off the battery mains
whenever I park it. There's some body work to do as well but she's a pretty
sweet ride. I'll get some snaps soon.

TCB

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>I have promised myself that should this recording/mixing thing become a

>viable business I will treat myself to a) a full dressed Harley or b) a

>65/66 T-Bird Convertible
>
>so far we're halfway there
>
>Don
>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45393f12$1@linux...
>>
>> Ah, don't have any yet but I'll take some. She really is a lovely one.

>> Standard
>> hardtop (no Landau or convertible), Green, in pretty darn good shape,
but
>> of course there's a lot to be done . . .
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>Pics of the bird man, pics of the bird!
>>>
>>>Don
>>>
>>>
>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966
>>>> Thunderbird
>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>
>>>> the
>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>> was
>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
the
>>
>>>> master
>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>
>>>> Keep
>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
to
>>
>>>> design
>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>Dimitrios,
Can you send me a copy of the dummy track you use?
lwire98@yahoo.comSPAM.

Also, does the receiving PARIS channel need to be record enabled?
Does PARIS need to be playing?

Thx,
b

TC <tc@spammetodeathyoubastards.org> wrote:
>I also noticed that in Paris if I select "end" under direct, then try and
select "test
>- end" (my wh channel name) from the chooser, it doesn't seem to take (the
name doesn't
>appear where it says "enter channel name or use chooser").
>
>If I click "start" though, "test" appears in the channel name.
>
>I guess I need to look at the manual again.. RTFM once again..
>
>Cheers,
>
>TC
>
>
>TC wrote:
>> Hi Dimitrios,
>>
>> I tried the dummy track, but still no luck.
>>
>> I have the mac sending to the ip address, and the channel name shows up

>> in the paris instance, so I am assuming that the two systems are seeing

>> each other here.
>>
>> I just set the Digital Performer channel to "start" and paris to "end"

>> for each instance?
>>
>> Do I need sync checked? What about buffer settings and the "play
>> through" option?
>>
>> Thanks a lot for you help!
>>
>> TC
>>I will do some serious grinding at NAMM. Who know, maybe
someone will do it.

DC

"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>
>
>ahh, now I've got my head in your space. Yeah that would be about the =
>coolest thing ever.... I remember the promise of this in the early days
=
>of DAW with Metalithic. Man, I wish they would have made it.=20
>
>AA
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:453a5a8e$1@linux...
>>=20
>> Media Matrix was the first, and is still a great product.
>>=20
>> That's exactly what I am talking about. What enormous
>> potential an FX box would have, controlled in such a manner.
>>=20
>> It's not at all hard to do, it's simply a matter of getting the
>> manufacturers minds around it.
>>=20
>> DC
>>=20
>>=20
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>DC,
>>>
>>>I'm not familiar with soundweb, but I am familiar with the Peavey =
>Mediamatrix
>>>system, and it has a similar, but even more powerful design surface in
=
>combination
>>>with a DSP mainframe that allows you to do exactly what you describe.
=
>It's
>>>all digital and cobranet based.
>>>
>>>The system a sub of ours put in at Phoenix Sky Harbor airport has 128
=
>inputs,
>>>64 sense mic inputs (PZM) and 128 outputs per headend, with one =
>head-end
>>>per terminal. Logical zones can be created that route any input to =
>any
>> output
>>>group. The only analog portion of the chain is the ADC that each mic
=
>connects
>>>to. From there on it's 20 bit 48KHZ digital audio over cobranet to =
>the
>> mainframe.
>>>
>>>
>>>Eq, ducking, limiting and agc (sense mic based) on every channel. The
=
>
>> routing
>>>matrix and 'effects' are laid out in a design surface much like the =
>one
>> you
>>>pointed us to. =20
>>>
>>>The system has integrated high quality text to speech in up to 13 =
>languages,
>>>queuing and prioritization of audio and virtually unlimited logical =
>zones.
>>>
>>>What I was getting at before, is that it's not all that difficult to =
>write
>>>these sorts of design surfaces, as long as the underlying hardware =
>supports
>>>the design activity. They are like big remote control surfaces.
>>>
>>>Klotz digital has a similar system that XM radio uses in their studios
=
>on
>>>beautiful Florida Avenue here in our nations capital :-)
>>>
>>>
>>>Chuck
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Aaron and Chuck,
>>>>
>>>>The device I have in mind does not exist. I used a Soundweb
>>>>file simply as an example of clear layout and usage. =20
>>>>
>>>>A SW for guitar would kill in the EQ and compression stuff,
>>>>but not much else other than running 20 amps at once!
>>>>
>>>>I am thinking of a very powerful box like the TC G-Major, for
>>>>instance, that instead of one cliched preset after another, that
>>>>you then have to modify, it would allow you to use the DSP in
>>>>any way you wish. If you want 96 channels of parametric to
>>>>do a .05 octave L-R band split, you could do it. If you wanted
>>>>8 delays, all assigned and modulated differently, you could do
>>>>that too, because nobody has decided that you don't need to
>>>>do that.
>>>>
>>>>The SW app is wonderfully powerful and simple to use (once
>>>>you learn it, like anything else)
>>>>
>>>>Hey, why don't you download it, and I can send you a couple
>>>>of my design files? Imagine FX modules in addition to the
>>>>pro audio stuff, and you can see the power available.
>>>>
>>>>You can get it for free here:
>>>>
>>>>http://www.bss.co.uk/soundweb/designerdownload/latest.html
>>>>
>>>>This is such a powerful model for controlling DSP that I cannot
>>>>believe it has not been used in studio or guitar FX yet.
>>>>
>>>>If you get the app let me know. =20
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Don,
>>>>>
>>>>>Are all the params you are talking about controllable by midi? If =
>so
>> the
>>>>>kind of app you are talking about is definitely possible.
>>>>>
>>>>>Chuck
>>>>>
>>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersatnamm.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Hi Aaron,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>What I want to do is to have a playing field on the computer =
>screen,
>>>>>>kinda like the Soundweb example I attached here. You add modules
>>>>>>to it in the order you prefer, then you open them and dial the
>>>>>>settings in. It's a more simple and sophisticated app I am =
>looking
>>=20
>>>>>>for. No one makes an FX processor like this at all, and it would
=
>be
>>>
>>>>>>very cool. When you use the MagicStomp, you page through
>>>>>>all these presets, looking for one that is close to what you want,
>>>>>>then you open it and more pages to find the control you want, and
>>>>>>some presets have that control available and some do not, and=20
>>>>>>there is no well to tell without digging through all of 'em.
>>>>>>I would like to be able to start from scratch, with everything=20
>>>>>>available, and design what I need, rather than this convoluted=20
>>>>>>nonsense where certain processors show up and others do not,=20
>>>>>>depending on the preset you are playing with.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I should build it huh?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>DC
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>>>>>if you want to pie up the FX (it has two chips in it dedicated to
=
>FX),
>>>>>you
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>should try ebay for a used 2112 / 2120 from digitech. Sweet sweet
=
>unit,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>presets suck.
>>>>>>>The modifiers section in that thing is the most comprehensive =
>section
>>>>I've
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>ever seen and it's tube and/or solid state on the pre.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>AA
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
><HTML><HEAD>
><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.5296.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
><STYLE></STYLE>
></HEAD>
><BODY>
><DIV>ahh, now I've got my head in your =
>space. Yeah that=20
>would be about the coolest thing ever.... I remember the promise of this
=
>in the=20
>early days of DAW with <A=20
>href=3D" http://news.harmony-central.com/Newp/SNAMM97/Other/Wings.htm l">Me=
>talithic</A>.=20
>Man, I wish they would have made it. </DIV>
><DIV> </DIV>
><DIV>AA</DIV>
><DIV> </DIV>
><DIV>"DC" <<A=20
>href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com">size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</A>size=3D2>> wrote in=20
>message <A href=3D"news:453a5a8e$1@linux">size=3D2>news:453a5a8e$1@linux</A>size=3D2>...</DIV>> > Media =
>Matrix was=20
>the first, and is still a great product. > > That's exactly =
>what I=20
>am talking about. What enormous > potential an FX box would =
>have,=20
>controlled in such a manner. > > It's not at all hard to =
>do, it's=20
>simply a matter of getting the > manufacturers minds around =
>it. >=20
> > DC > > > "chuck duffy" <<A=20
>href=3D"mailto:c@c.com">size=3D2>c@c.com</A>size=3D2>> =
>wrote: >> >>DC, >> >>I'm not=20
>familiar with soundweb, but I am familiar with the Peavey=20
>Mediamatrix >>system, and it has a similar, but even more =
>powerful=20
>design surface in combination >>with a DSP mainframe that =
>allows you to=20
>do exactly what you describe. It's >>all digital and cobranet=20
>based. >> >>The system a sub of ours put in at Phoenix =
>Sky=20
>Harbor airport has 128 inputs, >>64 sense mic inputs (PZM) and =
>128=20
>outputs per headend, with one head-end >>per terminal. =
>Logical=20
>zones can be created that route any input to any >=20
>output >>group. The only analog portion of the chain is =
>the ADC=20
>that each mic connects >>to. From there on it's 20 bit =
>48KHZ=20
>digital audio over cobranet to the >=20
>mainframe. >> >> >>Eq, ducking, limiting and =
>agc=20
>(sense mic based) on every channel. The > =
>routing >>matrix=20
>and 'effects' are laid out in a design surface much like the one > =
>
>you >>pointed us to. >> >>The system =
>has=20
>integrated high quality text to speech in up to 13 =
>languages, >>queuing=20
>and prioritization of audio and virtually unlimited logical=20
>zones. >> >>What I was getting at before, is that it's =
>not all=20
>that difficult to write >>these sorts of design surfaces, as =
>long as=20
>the underlying hardware supports >>the design activity. =
>They are=20
>like big remote control surfaces. >> >>Klotz digital =
>has a=20
>similar system that XM radio uses in their studios =
>on >>beautiful=20
>Florida Avenue here in our nations capital=20
>:-) >> >> >>Chuck >> >>"DC" =
>
><<A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersinhell.com">size=3D2>dc@spammersinhell.com</A>size=3D2>>=20
>wrote: >>> >>>Aaron and=20
>Chuck, >>> >>>The device I have in mind does not =
>
>exist. I used a Soundweb >>>file simply as an example =
>of clear=20
>layout and usage. >>> >>>A SW for guitar =
>would=20
>kill in the EQ and compression stuff, >>>but not much else =
>other=20
>than running 20 amps at once! >>> >>>I am =
>thinking of a=20
>very powerful box like the TC G-Major, for >>>instance, that =
>instead=20
>of one cliched preset after another, that >>>you then have =
>to=20
>modify, it would allow you to use the DSP in >>>any way you=20
>wish. If you want 96 channels of parametric =
>to >>>do a=20
>.05 octave L-R band split, you could do it. If you =
>wanted >>>8=20
>delays, all assigned and modulated differently, you could =
>do >>>that=20
>too, because nobody has decided that you don't need to >>>do =
>
>that. >>> >>>The SW app is wonderfully powerful =
>and=20
>simple to use (once >>>you learn it, like anything=20
>else) >>> >>>Hey, why don't you download it, and =
>I can=20
>send you a couple >>>of my design files? Imagine =
>FX=20
>modules in addition to the >>>pro audio stuff, and you can =
>see the=20
>power available. >>> >>>You can get it for free=20
>here: >>> >>>http://www.bss.co.uk/soundweb/design=
>erdownload/latest.html >>> >>>This=20
>is such a powerful model for controlling DSP that I=20
>cannot >>>believe it has not been used in studio or guitar =
>FX=20
>yet. >>> >>>If you get the app let me =
>know. =20
> >>> >>>DC >>> >>> >=
>;>> >>>"chuck=20
>duffy" <<A href=3D"mailto:c@c.com">size=3D2>c@c.com</A>>=20
>wrote: >>>> >>>>Don, >>>><BR=
>>>>>>Are=20
>all the params you are talking about controllable by midi? If =
>so >=20
>the >>>>kind of app you are talking about is definitely=20
>possible. >>>> >>>>Chuck >>>>=
>; >>>>"DC"=20
><<A href=3D"mailto:dc@spammersatnamm.com">size=3D2>dc@spammersatnamm.com</A>size=3D2>>=20
>wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>=
>;> >>>>>Hi=20
>Aaron, >>>>> >>>>>What I want to do =
>is to=20
>have a playing field on the computer =
>screen, >>>>>kinda like=20
>the Soundweb example I attached here. You add=20
>modules >>>>>to it in the order you prefer, then you =
>open them=20
>and dial the >>>>>settings in. It's a more =
>simple=20
>and sophisticated app I am looking >=20
> >>>>>for. No one makes an FX processor =
>like this=20
>at all, and it would be >> >>>>>very=20
>cool. When you use the MagicStomp, you page=20
>through >>>>>all these presets, looking for one that =
>is close=20
>to what you want, >>>>>then you open it and more pages =
>to find=20
>the control you want, and >>>>>some presets have that =
>control=20
>available and some do not, and >>>>>there is no well =
>to tell=20
>without digging through all of 'em. >>>>>I would like =
>to be=20
>able to start from scratch, with everything =
> >>>>>available,=20
>and design what I need, rather than this convoluted=20
> >>>>>nonsense where certain processors show up and =
>others do=20
>not, >>>>>depending on the preset you are playing=20
>with. >>>>> >>>>>I should build it=20
>huh? >>>>> >>>>>DC >>>>=
>;> >>>>>"Aaron=20
>Allen" <<A href=3D"mailto:know-spam@not_here.dude">face=3DArial=20
>size=3D2>know-spam@not_here.dude</A>size=3D2>>=20
>wrote: >>>>>>if you want to pie up the FX (it has =
>two chips=20
>in it dedicated to=20
>FX), >>>>you >>>>> >>>>&g=
>t;>should=20
>try ebay for a used 2112 / 2120 from digitech. Sweet sweet=20
>unit, >>>>> >>>>>>presets=20
>suck. >>>>>>The modifiers section in that thing is =
>the most=20
>comprehensive=20
>section >>>I've >>>>> >>>>&g=
>t;>ever=20
>seen and it's tube and/or solid state on the=20
>pre. >>>>>> >>>>>>AA >>=
>;>> >>> >> ></BODY></HTML>
>
>Bitchin' cars.

Just makes you want to catch an old Highlander marathon...

heh

DC

"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>I'm scared of two wheelers of any kind but I love my 'bird. The one I bought
>is amazing on the engine front, purrs like a kitten. But it has pretty serious
>electrical problems. I've managed to get the basics working, the headlights
>and (gloriously sequential) tailights work, along with the turn signals
and
>such. But the entire dash is dark and there's a short somewhere so I get
>all redeck when I drive it and pop the hood to turn off the battery mains
>whenever I park it. There's some body work to do as well but she's a pretty
>sweet ride. I'll get some snaps soon.
>
>TCB
>
>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>I have promised myself that should this recording/mixing thing become a
>
>>viable business I will treat myself to a) a full dressed Harley or b) a
>
>>65/66 T-Bird Convertible
>>
>>so far we're halfway there
>>
>>Don
>>
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45393f12$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Ah, don't have any yet but I'll take some. She really is a lovely one.
>
>>> Standard
>>> hardtop (no Landau or convertible), Green, in pretty darn good shape,
>but
>>> of course there's a lot to be done . . .
>>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>Pics of the bird man, pics of the bird!
>>>>
>>>>Don
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966
>>>>> Thunderbird
>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>>
>>>>> the
>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>>> was
>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
>the
>>>
>>>>> master
>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>
>>>>> Keep
>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
>to
>>>
>>>>> design
>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>it's mr. footballhead mr. memory...

On Sat, 21 Oct 2006 09:36:28 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:

>OK then Mr. Banjohead,
>
>Click on Weeeeee!!!!!!!!
>http://squealpiggie.ytmnd.com/
> http://www.funnyjunk.com/funny_pictures/788/Squeal+like+a+pi g
>
>;o)
>
>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:3fmjj2pgqi41jgp10rlv9u78qd65pd90j4@4ax.com...
>> i'm tooo pretty for the big house. ;o)
>>
>> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 14:47:26 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>>
>> >are we gonna go to Tuscon and get arrested? I never got a confirmation on
>> >that.
>> >
>> >;o)
>> >
>> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >news:vr3ij296k8e9cfraagtkc1e7coeklfpb7q@4ax.com...
>> >> yup.
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 10:30:40 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Well, this is pretty cool then. To get rid of these errors, all I've
>got
>> >to
>> >> >do is change the default settings in WL.........right?
>> >> >
>> >> >;o)
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >> >news:tr2hj2hpp391cn4kj5p2ktere5bmpcc77o@4ax.com...
>> >> >> at it's default setting wavelab will show 1000's of errors per
>second.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On 20 Oct 2006 04:56:18 +1000, "Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com>
>wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >"DJ" <no@way.jack> wrote:
>> >> >> >>The other day I posted about my bounces having literally millions
>of
>> >> >errors
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>showing up in Wavelab. They were inaudible but it was bothering
>the
>> >hell
>> >> >> >out
>> >> >> >>of me that they were there. Well, I just ripped some commercial CD
>> >> >tracks
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>(New Favorite-Allison Krause and Wide Open Spaces-Dixie Chicks)
>and
>> >ran
>> >> >> >the
>> >> >> >>same analysis on them. They are the same. Millions of (inaudible
>> >errors)
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>digital errors. Also, the click detection shows as many or more of
>> >these
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>than my mixes do. I was thinking my ears might be going south on
>me
>> >and
>> >> >> >that
>> >> >> >>my mix method using Cubase -into-Paris whil'st insanely clocked
>was
>> >> >creating
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>a mess that I just wasn't hearing but that would be rejected if I
>> >ever
>> >> >sent
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>a mix out of here to a third party mastering house. Well, if
>> >anything,
>> >> >my
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>mixes are the same or less error prone than the ones I'm seeing
>here.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>Just another reason to trust the ears, not the eyes...............
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>Deej
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >I have to look into this further, but my recent mixes (CD
>> >masters),done
>> >> >via
>> >> >> >lightpipe to Paris, have been checked in PlexTools for errors and
>have
>> >
>> >> >come
>> >> >> >up 100% clean.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >Gene
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >
>>
>Can you remove some fuses to the dash until you find the short?

TCB wrote:
> I'm scared of two wheelers of any kind but I love my 'bird. The one I bought
> is amazing on the engine front, purrs like a kitten. But it has pretty serious
> electrical problems. I've managed to get the basics working, the headlights
> and (gloriously sequential) tailights work, along with the turn signals and
> such. But the entire dash is dark and there's a short somewhere so I get
> all redeck when I drive it and pop the hood to turn off the battery mains
> whenever I park it. There's some body work to do as well but she's a pretty
> sweet ride. I'll get some snaps soon.
>
> TCB
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>> I have promised myself that should this recording/mixing thing become a
>
>> viable business I will treat myself to a) a full dressed Harley or b) a
>
>> 65/66 T-Bird Convertible
>>
>> so far we're halfway there
>>
>> Don
>>
>>
>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45393f12$1@linux...
>>> Ah, don't have any yet but I'll take some. She really is a lovely one.
>
>>> Standard
>>> hardtop (no Landau or convertible), Green, in pretty darn good shape,
> but
>>> of course there's a lot to be done . . .
>>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>> Pics of the bird man, pics of the bird!
>>>>
>>>> Don
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966
>>>>> Thunderbird
>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>>>> the
>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>>> was
>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
> the
>>>>> master
>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>>> Keep
>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
> to
>>>>> design
>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>
>Hi,
Brandon and whoever is interested.
To use wormhole is dead easy !!
I tried it after some good months in a few minutes really great working.

First I use wormhole in cubase where it is in start mode giving a name like
track1
Now on Paris I open wormhole (wrapped from FXpansion 3.3) and I put an EMPTY
24bit file (although 16 bit could work too but why not have full 24 bits
at least ?)
I made this file with wavelab recording silence and copying mulytiole silent
segments until I got a 5 minute 24 bit empty file.
PARIS MUST PLAY in order to receive the audio from Cubase.
In wormhole in Paris you choose from the 'chooser" the track1-end
where in cubase it is track1-start
I don't know why you are not getting any results ?
Oh one thing is PARIS UNDER XP ??? because I think Me or win98 does not work
with wormhole,if I remember correctly !
ALSO
Do not use wormhole to send to cubase and then back
In order to wormhole right you have tochoose alatency around 10.000 which
is big latency so no easy compensation.
What I SUGGEST is:
Use any great vst/dx sequncer like Cubase,Nuendo,Samplitude ,DP, Sawstudio,
or whatever and process natively there without moving the faders in there,
leave them at 0 !!!
Then with wormhole send as much as 24 audio tracks (Pentium 4 2.6ghz with
Paris) in Paris for summong and EDS effects only.
Native effects do not work under Paris this way and why should ??
Thats the best way to use Paris !
Note wormhgole is sending 32bit floating so Paris truncates to 24 bit integer
(I guess) so better than adat interfacing !
Works SAMPLE ACCURATE if you ONLY wrap it with FXpansion 3.3 , and I mean
ONLY !!
No other wrapper , standalone, can achieve sync !!
It is fine with me.
Ther will be a delay in hearing Paris wormhole tracks after you press play
on Cubase , remember 10000 samples but anyway so what...
If you wanna use Paris transport use ,idi synchronization, MTC so each time
you pusah play on Paris cubase follows.
Amother tip is to have paris in LOOP mode for say 4 bars so it will always
play the wormholed tracks no matter when you push play in Cubase.
SEPARATE machines !
No luck on same computer.
Regards,
Dimitriuos"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>
>Hi,
>Brandon and whoever is interested.
>To use wormhole is dead easy !!
>I tried it after some good months in a few minutes really great working.
>
>First I use wormhole in cubase where it is in start mode giving a name like
>track1
>Now on Paris I open wormhole (wrapped from FXpansion 3.3) and I put an EMPTY
>24bit file (although 16 bit could work too but why not have full 24 bits
>at least ?)
>I made this file with wavelab recording silence and copying mulytiole silent
>segments until I got a 5 minute 24 bit empty file.
>PARIS MUST PLAY in order to receive the audio from Cubase.
>In wormhole in Paris you choose from the 'chooser" the track1-end
>where in cubase it is track1-start
>I don't know why you are not getting any results ?
>Oh one thing is PARIS UNDER XP ??? because I think Me or win98 does not
work
>with wormhole,if I remember correctly !
>ALSO
>Do not use wormhole to send to cubase and then back
>In order to wormhole right you have tochoose alatency around 10.000 which
>is big latency so no easy compensation.
>What I SUGGEST is:
>Use any great vst/dx sequncer like Cubase,Nuendo,Samplitude ,DP, Sawstudio,
>or whatever and process natively there without moving the faders in there,
>leave them at 0 !!!
>Then with wormhole send as much as 24 audio tracks (Pentium 4 2.6ghz with
>Paris) in Paris for summong and EDS effects only.
>Native effects do not work under Paris this way and why should ??
>Thats the best way to use Paris !
>Note wormhgole is sending 32bit floating so Paris truncates to 24 bit integer
>(I guess) so better than adat interfacing !
>Works SAMPLE ACCURATE if you ONLY wrap it with FXpansion 3.3 , and I mean
>ONLY !!
>No other wrapper , standalone, can achieve sync !!
>It is fine with me.
>Ther will be a delay in hearing Paris wormhole tracks after you press play
>on Cubase , remember 10000 samples but anyway so what...
>If you wanna use Paris transport use ,idi synchronization, MTC so each time
>you pusah play on Paris cubase follows.
>Amother tip is to have paris in LOOP mode for say 4 bars so it will always
>play the wormholed tracks no matter when you push play in Cubase.
>SEPARATE machines !
>No luck on same computer.
>Regards,
>DimitriuosSome things more.
On cubase wormhole instance click the sync button as to be checked, thus
you can have synced intanses.
On Paris wormhole intanse will read:
"receiving from 192.168.0.1- end-instances synced"
Only then you know you are sample accurate syncing.
another tip.
I use for Cuabse computer 192.168.0.1 ethernet address and 192.168.0.2 for
Paris, I find this way extremely stable ethernet connection.
ANOTHER thing that might be important for some of you:
Use the farmostr latency slider on Cubase wormhole (32768) and use instead
of 10.000 5395 in Paris (I managed without clicks at least four tracks ,could
have tried more but no time right now) buffer so as to have audio tracks
on both machines sound at the same time when "play through" is used in CVubase
wormhole intanses.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>
>Hi,
>Brandon and whoever is interested.
>To use wormhole is dead easy !!
>I tried it after some good months in a few minutes really great working.
>
>First I use wormhole in cubase where it is in start mode giving a name like
>track1
>Now on Paris I open wormhole (wrapped from FXpansion 3.3) and I put an EMPTY
>24bit file (although 16 bit could work too but why not have full 24 bits
>at least ?)
>I made this file with wavelab recording silence and copying mulytiole silent
>segments until I got a 5 minute 24 bit empty file.
>PARIS MUST PLAY in order to receive the audio from Cubase.
>In wormhole in Paris you choose from the 'chooser" the track1-end
>where in cubase it is track1-start
>I don't know why you are not getting any results ?
>Oh one thing is PARIS UNDER XP ??? because I think Me or win98 does not
work
>with wormhole,if I remember correctly !
>ALSO
>Do not use wormhole to send to cubase and then back
>In order to wormhole right you have tochoose alatency around 10.000 which
>is big latency so no easy compensation.
>What I SUGGEST is:
>Use any great vst/dx sequncer like Cubase,Nuendo,Samplitude ,DP, Sawstudio,
>or whatever and process natively there without moving the faders in there,
>leave them at 0 !!!
>Then with wormhole send as much as 24 audio tracks (Pentium 4 2.6ghz with
>Paris) in Paris for summong and EDS effects only.
>Native effects do not work under Paris this way and why should ??
>Thats the best way to use Paris !
>Note wormhgole is sending 32bit floating so Paris truncates to 24 bit integer
>(I guess) so better than adat interfacing !
>Works SAMPLE ACCURATE if you ONLY wrap it with FXpansion 3.3 , and I mean
>ONLY !!
>No other wrapper , standalone, can achieve sync !!
>It is fine with me.
>Ther will be a delay in hearing Paris wormhole tracks after you press play
>on Cubase , remember 10000 samples but anyway so what...
>If you wanna use Paris transport use ,idi synchronization, MTC so each time
>you pusah play on Paris cubase follows.
>Amother tip is to have paris in LOOP mode for say 4 bars so it will always
>play the wormholed tracks no matter when you push play in Cubase.
>SEPARATE machines !
>No luck on same computer.
>Regards,
>DimitriuosHi,
I sent a touchy email to them asking for buying or loaning or renting or
whatever you know about Paris.
They thanked me and they emailed that they will not give BECAUSE :
"We may still release PARIS software sometime in the future"
!!!
Thats progress , don't you think ??
Please leave aside any bad feelings about ID.
I encourage anyone sending privately email to them kindly (and I mean that
!) ASKING IF THERE WILL BE ANY UPDATE for Paris.
We may be near !!
Regards,
DimitriosI know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may lead to
blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu folder on
c root.
c:\xxxx
I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make any
difference !!
It makes !!
DO IT !!
Thats for XP of course.
Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
Regards,
DimitriosBullshit, We are not only not "near" (hey the new soon!!!) but we are far.

I emailed ID the same question 2 weeks ago and they said "THERE ARE NO
PLANS FOR ANY FUTURE UPDATES" period.

I love hope but here there is virtually none. Please don't spread this
rumor of hope unless Edmund is going to make a formal statement here.
Heck, I'm selling my Paris system so I'd love to hype it up but it's
just not true.

I would love to see new product from the brilliant Edmund and folks but
my information says this will not happen.

props to Dimitrios !

John

Dimitrios wrote:
> Hi,
> I sent a touchy email to them asking for buying or loaning or renting or
> whatever you know about Paris.
> They thanked me and they emailed that they will not give BECAUSE :
> "We may still release PARIS software sometime in the future"
> !!!
> Thats progress , don't you think ??
> Please leave aside any bad feelings about ID.
> I encourage anyone sending privately email to them kindly (and I mean that
> !) ASKING IF THERE WILL BE ANY UPDATE for Paris.
> We may be near !!
> Regards,
> Dimitrioshttp://www.acondigital.com/us_EffectChainer.html

with screenshots. I haven't tried it but hey, you might. ;-)And apparently there is a great reason to use it.

When you stack remote VSTs in a Sonar bus or track FX bin on your host
machine you get compounded latency in the chain (because it's a 2-way
trip for every efect in the chain), and there's been no simple way to
stack them on the slave machine (short of spending $50 or more for a not
quite perfect solution). Effectchainer solves that problem. Beside
which, you can now use DX effects with FX Teleport, which you couldn't
do before! Did I mention that it's free?

John wrote:
> http://www.acondigital.com/us_EffectChainer.html
>
> with screenshots. I haven't tried it but hey, you might. ;-)Deej, 200 MHz is the core cycle setting ONLY... it's an
internal setting on the CPU, not the CPU speed itself - you can
look at it as kinda like a baseline reference point. It doesn't
mean the normal operating speed of the CPU. Your processor will
run at it's stated speed with this setting.

It's when you get into the settings higher than that that you
start overclocking. Chris is right, get the thing booted up &
stable before you start tweaking with overperformance. Boot it
up & load a heavy project with the settings just as they are...
you'll see, it'll be fine - if the processor itself were only
running @ 200mhz, you'd never be able to load more than a few
tracks & a few plugins.

Neil

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>Chris,
>
>I just want to get it clocked above 200MHZ right now. that's it's default
>and it has the most recent bios already. what would the voltage settings
be
>to get this puppy to 2100 mHZ?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Deej
>
>"Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
>news:453aa792$1@linux...
>> Never mind i saw it in the other post.
>> Before you start toying with over clocking make sure you did these
>> things. They will increase the odds for stability with the Paris and
>> over clocking.
>>
>> 1. Make sure you have the most current BIOS.
>> 2. Use the the newest Nividia motherboard chipset driver s from Nvidias
>> website.
>> 3. Install AMD dual core optimizer driver from AMDs website.
>> Install MIcrosoft CPU Hotfix driver.
>> 4. Install current Nividia video driver
>> 5. Install all the latest xp updates. Use the custom option. "Install
>> the framework 2.0 last"
>> 6. Do XP tweaks
>>
>>
>> Install the Paris stuff and see if it works before you start fooling
>> around. I would also suggest doing a system image before you start over
>> clocking, especially if you get paris working OK. Over clocking to far
>> will some time hose your xp install.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Chris Ludwig wrote:
>>
>> > HI DJ,
>> > Which motherboard was it again?
>> >
>> > Chris
>> >
>> >
>> > DJ wrote:
>> >
>> >> I'm no overclocker (or any kind of clocker I guess). I'm testing a
>mobo,
>> >> getting ready to load Windows on this beast and when the system
>> >> posts, the
>> >> AMD 4200 dual core is showing up at 200mhz. If I boot to the bios
>> >> there are
>> >> clock settings but I'm an idiot and don't know what to set to get tis
>> >> thing
>> >> happening at 2100MHZ........and since I blow stuff up sometimes, I
>> >> want to
>> >> at least get some advice before I fry the CPU. I'll be testing a 3
card
>> >> Paris system on this rig to see how/if it can work with dual core
>> >> CPU's and
>> >> multiple C-16's so so if anyone wants to pitch in, please give me a
>ring
>> >>
>> >> 970-375-7081
>> >>
>> >> Thanks,
>> >>
>> >> Deej
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Chris Ludwig
>> ADK
>> chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
>> www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
>> (859) 635-5762
>
>copy it to create c:\emu ?

and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever I've got
it ;-)

plugins and everything ?

Any idea how this prevents crashes?

Duh-ON

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453b7449$1@linux...
>
> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may lead to
> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu folder on
> c root.
> c:\xxxx
> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make any
> difference !!
> It makes !!
> DO IT !!
> Thats for XP of course.
> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
> Regards,
> DimitriosHI DJ,
200mhz is the proper FSB multiplier settings. If it is above that then
you are over clocking.

The MB Intelligent Tweaker section of the BIOS should running defaults.
CPU Clock Ratio = Auto
CPU Over clock in MHz = 200
AGP Over clock in MHz = 66
All the voltage controls = normal

This will be the default non -over clocked settings.

Chris

DJ wrote:

>Chris,
>
>I just want to get it clocked above 200MHZ right now. that's it's default
>and it has the most recent bios already. what would the voltage settings be
>to get this puppy to 2100 mHZ?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Deej
>
>"Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
>news:453aa792$1@linux...
>
>
>>Never mind i saw it in the other post.
>>Before you start toying with over clocking make sure you did these
>>things. They will increase the odds for stability with the Paris and
>>over clocking.
>>
>>1. Make sure you have the most current BIOS.
>>2. Use the the newest Nividia motherboard chipset driver s from Nvidias
>>website.
>>3. Install AMD dual core optimizer driver from AMDs website.
>>Install MIcrosoft CPU Hotfix driver.
>>4. Install current Nividia video driver
>>5. Install all the latest xp updates. Use the custom option. "Install
>>the framework 2.0 last"
>>6. Do XP tweaks
>>
>>
>>Install the Paris stuff and see if it works before you start fooling
>>around. I would also suggest doing a system image before you start over
>>clocking, especially if you get paris working OK. Over clocking to far
>>will some time hose your xp install.
>>
>>Chris
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Chris Ludwig wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>HI DJ,
>>>Which motherboard was it again?
>>>
>>>Chris
>>>
>>>
>>>DJ wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I'm no overclocker (or any kind of clocker I guess). I'm testing a
>>>>
>>>>
>mobo,
>
>
>>>>getting ready to load Windows on this beast and when the system
>>>>posts, the
>>>>AMD 4200 dual core is showing up at 200mhz. If I boot to the bios
>>>>there are
>>>>clock settings but I'm an idiot and don't know what to set to get tis
>>>>thing
>>>>happening at 2100MHZ........and since I blow stuff up sometimes, I
>>>>want to
>>>>at least get some advice before I fry the CPU. I'll be testing a 3 card
>>>>Paris system on this rig to see how/if it can work with dual core
>>>>CPU's and
>>>>multiple C-16's so so if anyone wants to pitch in, please give me a
>>>>
>>>>
>ring
>
>
>>>>970-375-7081
>>>>
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>
>>>>Deej
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>--
>>Chris Ludwig
>>ADK
>>chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
>>www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
>>(859) 635-5762
>>
>>
>
>
>
>

--
Chris Ludwig
ADK
chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
(859) 635-5762Thad,

I wish I could write a simple vst plug that would mimic what paris does in
a native system, but I can't figure out how to make the (say cubase for example)
meters show anything other than what's really in the signal path.

It would be cool if only to see if it made any kind of difference in a native
mix.

Chuck

"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>Hey Chuck,
>
>I still can't find the original post you're talking about, but thanks so
>much for piping in. That's REALLY interesting. I must needs try some new
>things with the native systems I use. Wow. Funny stuff. I've got mean things
>on my mind . . .
>
>TCB
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just the
>source
>>code for the mixer.
>>
>>Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the individual
>>channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master. That's
>why
>>you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'. This
>>is what many analog consoles do.
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the

>>>Submix masters ?
>>>
>>>DJ wrote:
>>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and it
>still
>>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
>it
>>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders that
>>are
>>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
>>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal DAW
>>would
>>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>>
>>>> ;o)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966 Thunderbird
>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>>> the
>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>>was
>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
>the
>>>> master
>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>> Keep
>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
>to
>>>> design
>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert effect
to post fader, post meter in cubase?

Does the resistor on a channel prior to summing in an analog console change
the sonic characteristcs at all? If it does it would probably be fairly
simple to model dontcha think?

Chuck
"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>Thad,
>
>I wish I could write a simple vst plug that would mimic what paris does
in
>a native system, but I can't figure out how to make the (say cubase for
example)
>meters show anything other than what's really in the signal path.
>
>It would be cool if only to see if it made any kind of difference in a native
>mix.
>
>Chuck
>
>
>
>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>Hey Chuck,
>>
>>I still can't find the original post you're talking about, but thanks so
>>much for piping in. That's REALLY interesting. I must needs try some new
>>things with the native systems I use. Wow. Funny stuff. I've got mean things
>>on my mind . . .
>>
>>TCB
>>
>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just the
>>source
>>>code for the mixer.
>>>
>>>Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the individual
>>>channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master. That's
>>why
>>>you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'. This
>>>is what many analog consoles do.
>>>
>>>Chuck
>>>
>>>John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the
>
>>>>Submix masters ?
>>>>
>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and it
>>still
>>>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
>>it
>>>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders that
>>>are
>>>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
>>>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal DAW
>>>would
>>>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>>>
>>>>> ;o)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966 Thunderbird
>>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>>>> the
>>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>>>was
>>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
>>the
>>>>> master
>>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>>> Keep
>>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
>>to
>>>>> design
>>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert effect
>to post fader, post meter in cubase?

I don't believe there is, Chuck - I just checked to make sure &
I couldn't find a way to do it. Is there any way to enter a
prompt line in the plugin code to show the metering as being
higher than the actual level?

NeilI had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all the plugs
for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED TIMES.
Who knew....

ChuckNeil,

AFAIK the meters are driven by directly reading samples from the buffer.
I don't know how to drive the channel meters any other way.

Chuck

"Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert effect
>>to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>
>I don't believe there is, Chuck - I just checked to make sure &
>I couldn't find a way to do it. Is there any way to enter a
>prompt line in the plugin code to show the metering as being
>higher than the actual level?
>
>NeilTake the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in root c:\
I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or cahnging
projects.
Now solid !!
It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this so decided
to try so voila !
I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better priority
,don't know....
The essential part is that it works.
Try this.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>copy it to create c:\emu ?
>
>and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever I've
got
>it ;-)
>
>plugins and everything ?
>
>Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>
>Duh-ON
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>
>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may lead
to
>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu folder
on
>> c root.
>> c:\xxxx
>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make any
>> difference !!
>> It makes !!
>> DO IT !!
>> Thats for XP of course.
>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>
>Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
out here ?

Morgan :)

chuck duffy wrote:
> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all the plugs
> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED TIMES.
> Who knew....
>
> ChuckNo, 397 of those downloads were Deej having to go back & get
all his various software packages again after multiple
reformats & reinstalls of everything.

:)

Morgan <morganp@ntplx.net> wrote:
>Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
>out here ?
>
>Morgan :)
>
>
>
>chuck duffy wrote:
>> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all the
plugs
>> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED TIMES.
>> Who knew....
>>
>> Chuck
>OK, then how about this... (and I don't even know if this is
possible, as I'm no codehead, but...) can you make part of that
plugin's GUI package a separate meter that overlays the Cubase
channel meter, permanently/constantly, when that plugin is
installed & that particular view for the channel is selected? If
so, then you can make that meter read 22 db higher than the
actual Cubase meter and voila'!

And make it that nice pretty Paris gold color, too, so that
when they just look at the channel itself they'll know if that
plugin is inserted without having to go to the "inserts" menu.

Neil

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>Neil,
>
>AFAIK the meters are driven by directly reading samples from the buffer.
> I don't know how to drive the channel meters any other way.
>
>Chuck
>
>"Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>
>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert effect
>>>to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>>
>>I don't believe there is, Chuck - I just checked to make sure &
>>I couldn't find a way to do it. Is there any way to enter a
>>prompt line in the plugin code to show the metering as being
>>higher than the actual level?
>>
>>Neil
>OK then guys. Thanks for the help.

;o)

"Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
news:453b8917$1@linux...
> HI DJ,
> 200mhz is the proper FSB multiplier settings. If it is above that then
> you are over clocking.
>
> The MB Intelligent Tweaker section of the BIOS should running defaults.
> CPU Clock Ratio = Auto
> CPU Over clock in MHz = 200
> AGP Over clock in MHz = 66
> All the voltage controls = normal
>
> This will be the default non -over clocked settings.
>
>
> Chris
>
>
> DJ wrote:
>
> >Chris,
> >
> >I just want to get it clocked above 200MHZ right now. that's it's default
> >and it has the most recent bios already. what would the voltage settings
be
> >to get this puppy to 2100 mHZ?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >
> >Deej
> >
> >"Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
> >news:453aa792$1@linux...
> >
> >
> >>Never mind i saw it in the other post.
> >>Before you start toying with over clocking make sure you did these
> >>things. They will increase the odds for stability with the Paris and
> >>over clocking.
> >>
> >>1. Make sure you have the most current BIOS.
> >>2. Use the the newest Nividia motherboard chipset driver s from Nvidias
> >>website.
> >>3. Install AMD dual core optimizer driver from AMDs website.
> >>Install MIcrosoft CPU Hotfix driver.
> >>4. Install current Nividia video driver
> >>5. Install all the latest xp updates. Use the custom option. "Install
> >>the framework 2.0 last"
> >>6. Do XP tweaks
> >>
> >>
> >>Install the Paris stuff and see if it works before you start fooling
> >>around. I would also suggest doing a system image before you start over
> >>clocking, especially if you get paris working OK. Over clocking to far
> >>will some time hose your xp install.
> >>
> >>Chris
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Chris Ludwig wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>HI DJ,
> >>>Which motherboard was it again?
> >>>
> >>>Chris
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>DJ wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>I'm no overclocker (or any kind of clocker I guess). I'm testing a
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >mobo,
> >
> >
> >>>>getting ready to load Windows on this beast and when the system
> >>>>posts, the
> >>>>AMD 4200 dual core is showing up at 200mhz. If I boot to the bios
> >>>>there are
> >>>>clock settings but I'm an idiot and don't know what to set to get tis
> >>>>thing
> >>>>happening at 2100MHZ........and since I blow stuff up sometimes, I
> >>>>want to
> >>>>at least get some advice before I fry the CPU. I'll be testing a 3
card
> >>>>Paris system on this rig to see how/if it can work with dual core
> >>>>CPU's and
> >>>>multiple C-16's so so if anyone wants to pitch in, please give me a
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >ring
> >
> >
> >>>>970-375-7081
> >>>>
> >>>>Thanks,
> >>>>
> >>>>Deej
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>--
> >>Chris Ludwig
> >>ADK
> >>chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
> >>www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
> >>(859) 635-5762
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Chris Ludwig
> ADK
> chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
> www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
> (859) 635-5762Where's my coffee. When I don't drink enough coffee, my memory gets so bad
that I can't remember how to make coffee.

"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1kemj293sbgrm9us08ffm7bdne3di11cu7@4ax.com...
> it's mr. footballhead mr. memory...
>
>
>
> On Sat, 21 Oct 2006 09:36:28 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>
> >OK then Mr. Banjohead,
> >
> >Click on Weeeeee!!!!!!!!
> >http://squealpiggie.ytmnd.com/
> > http://www.funnyjunk.com/funny_pictures/788/Squeal+like+a+pi g
> >
> >;o)
> >
> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:3fmjj2pgqi41jgp10rlv9u78qd65pd90j4@4ax.com...
> >> i'm tooo pretty for the big house. ;o)
> >>
> >> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 14:47:26 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> >are we gonna go to Tuscon and get arrested? I never got a confirmation
on
> >> >that.
> >> >
> >> >;o)
> >> >
> >> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >> >news:vr3ij296k8e9cfraagtkc1e7coeklfpb7q@4ax.com...
> >> >> yup.
> >> >>
> >> >> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 10:30:40 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >Well, this is pretty cool then. To get rid of these errors, all
I've
> >got
> >> >to
> >> >> >do is change the default settings in WL.........right?
> >> >> >
> >> >> >;o)
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >> >> >news:tr2hj2hpp391cn4kj5p2ktere5bmpcc77o@4ax.com...
> >> >> >> at it's default setting wavelab will show 1000's of errors per
> >second.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> On 20 Oct 2006 04:56:18 +1000, "Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com>
> >wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >"DJ" <no@way.jack> wrote:
> >> >> >> >>The other day I posted about my bounces having literally
millions
> >of
> >> >> >errors
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>showing up in Wavelab. They were inaudible but it was bothering
> >the
> >> >hell
> >> >> >> >out
> >> >> >> >>of me that they were there. Well, I just ripped some commercial
CD
> >> >> >tracks
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>(New Favorite-Allison Krause and Wide Open Spaces-Dixie Chicks)
> >and
> >> >ran
> >> >> >> >the
> >> >> >> >>same analysis on them. They are the same. Millions of
(inaudible
> >> >errors)
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>digital errors. Also, the click detection shows as many or more
of
> >> >these
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>than my mixes do. I was thinking my ears might be going south
on
> >me
> >> >and
> >> >> >> >that
> >> >> >> >>my mix method using Cubase -into-Paris whil'st insanely clocked
> >was
> >> >> >creating
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>a mess that I just wasn't hearing but that would be rejected if
I
> >> >ever
> >> >> >sent
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>a mix out of here to a third party mastering house. Well, if
> >> >anything,
> >> >> >my
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>mixes are the same or less error prone than the ones I'm seeing
> >here.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>Just another reason to trust the ears, not the
eyes...............
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>Deej
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >I have to look into this further, but my recent mixes (CD
> >> >masters),done
> >> >> >via
> >> >> >> >lightpipe to Paris, have been checked in PlexTools for errors
and
> >have
> >> >
> >> >> >come
> >> >> >> >up 100% clean.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >Gene
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >
> >>
> >
>Nope. Only once for me. I've got a big Paris folder on my office machine and
I source everything from that when I reinstall 6732674327826 times.

;o)

"Neil" <OIUOI@OIU.com> wrote in message news:453ba3ba$1@linux...
>
> No, 397 of those downloads were Deej having to go back & get
> all his various software packages again after multiple
> reformats & reinstalls of everything.
>
> :)
>
> Morgan <morganp@ntplx.net> wrote:
> >Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
> >out here ?
> >
> >Morgan :)
> >
> >
> >
> >chuck duffy wrote:
> >> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all
the
> plugs
> >> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED
TIMES.
> >> Who knew....
> >>
> >> Chuck
> >
>Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory, or do
you cut it and paste it to the C:\

Thanks,

Deej

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>
> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in root
c:\
> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or cahnging
> projects.
> Now solid !!
> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this so
decided
> to try so voila !
> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
priority
> ,don't know....
> The essential part is that it works.
> Try this.
> Regards,
> Dimitrios
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
> >copy it to create c:\emu ?
> >
> >and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever I've
> got
> >it ;-)
> >
> >plugins and everything ?
> >
> >Any idea how this prevents crashes?
> >
> >Duh-ON
> >
> >"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
news:453b7449$1@linux...
> >>
> >> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
> >> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may lead
> to
> >> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu folder
> on
> >> c root.
> >> c:\xxxx
> >> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make
any
> >> difference !!
> >> It makes !!
> >> DO IT !!
> >> Thats for XP of course.
> >> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
> >> Regards,
> >> Dimitrios
> >
> >
>Dimitrios,

Thanks for all the info.
I was not using a silent track and I was not pushing PLAY in PARIS.
Also, I am trying it on one computer.
You are saying you couldnt get it to work between apps on one computer?
What did you try?
This is my only option right now so I have to get it to work.
I will let you know what I come up with.

Thx,
B

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>
>Some things more.
>On cubase wormhole instance click the sync button as to be checked, thus
>you can have synced intanses.
>On Paris wormhole intanse will read:
>"receiving from 192.168.0.1- end-instances synced"
>Only then you know you are sample accurate syncing.
>another tip.
>I use for Cuabse computer 192.168.0.1 ethernet address and 192.168.0.2 for
>Paris, I find this way extremely stable ethernet connection.
>ANOTHER thing that might be important for some of you:
>Use the farmostr latency slider on Cubase wormhole (32768) and use instead
>of 10.000 5395 in Paris (I managed without clicks at least four tracks ,could
>have tried more but no time right now) buffer so as to have audio tracks
>on both machines sound at the same time when "play through" is used in CVubase
>wormhole intanses.
>Regards,
>Dimitrios
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>
>>Hi,
>>Brandon and whoever is interested.
>>To use wormhole is dead easy !!
>>I tried it after some good months in a few minutes really great working.
>>
>>First I use wormhole in cubase where it is in start mode giving a name
like
>>track1
>>Now on Paris I open wormhole (wrapped from FXpansion 3.3) and I put an
EMPTY
>>24bit file (although 16 bit could work too but why not have full 24 bits
>>at least ?)
>>I made this file with wavelab recording silence and copying mulytiole silent
>>segments until I got a 5 minute 24 bit empty file.
>>PARIS MUST PLAY in order to receive the audio from Cubase.
>>In wormhole in Paris you choose from the 'chooser" the track1-end
>>where in cubase it is track1-start
>>I don't know why you are not getting any results ?
>>Oh one thing is PARIS UNDER XP ??? because I think Me or win98 does not
>work
>>with wormhole,if I remember correctly !
>>ALSO
>>Do not use wormhole to send to cubase and then back
>>In order to wormhole right you have tochoose alatency around 10.000 which
>>is big latency so no easy compensation.
>>What I SUGGEST is:
>>Use any great vst/dx sequncer like Cubase,Nuendo,Samplitude ,DP, Sawstudio,
>>or whatever and process natively there without moving the faders in there,
>>leave them at 0 !!!
>>Then with wormhole send as much as 24 audio tracks (Pentium 4 2.6ghz with
>>Paris) in Paris for summong and EDS effects only.
>>Native effects do not work under Paris this way and why should ??
>>Thats the best way to use Paris !
>>Note wormhgole is sending 32bit floating so Paris truncates to 24 bit integer
>>(I guess) so better than adat interfacing !
>>Works SAMPLE ACCURATE if you ONLY wrap it with FXpansion 3.3 , and I mean
>>ONLY !!
>>No other wrapper , standalone, can achieve sync !!
>>It is fine with me.
>>Ther will be a delay in hearing Paris wormhole tracks after you press play
>>on Cubase , remember 10000 samples but anyway so what...
>>If you wanna use Paris transport use ,idi synchronization, MTC so each
time
>>you pusah play on Paris cubase follows.
>>Amother tip is to have paris in LOOP mode for say 4 bars so it will always
>>play the wormholed tracks no matter when you push play in Cubase.
>>SEPARATE machines !
>>No luck on same computer.
>>Regards,
>>Dimitriuos
>Dimitrios,

Also, is musurgio@otenet.gr a valid email address?

THX,B

"Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote:
>
>Dimitrios,
>
>Thanks for all the info.
>I was not using a silent track and I was not pushing PLAY in PARIS.
>Also, I am trying it on one computer.
>You are saying you couldnt get it to work between apps on one computer?
>What did you try?
>This is my only option right now so I have to get it to work.
>I will let you know what I come up with.
>
>Thx,
>B
>
>
>
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>
>>Some things more.
>>On cubase wormhole instance click the sync button as to be checked, thus
>>you can have synced intanses.
>>On Paris wormhole intanse will read:
>>"receiving from 192.168.0.1- end-instances synced"
>>Only then you know you are sample accurate syncing.
>>another tip.
>>I use for Cuabse computer 192.168.0.1 ethernet address and 192.168.0.2
for
>>Paris, I find this way extremely stable ethernet connection.
>>ANOTHER thing that might be important for some of you:
>>Use the farmostr latency slider on Cubase wormhole (32768) and use instead
>>of 10.000 5395 in Paris (I managed without clicks at least four tracks
,could
>>have tried more but no time right now) buffer so as to have audio tracks
>>on both machines sound at the same time when "play through" is used in
CVubase
>>wormhole intanses.
>>Regards,
>>Dimitrios
>>
>>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>>
>>>Hi,
>>>Brandon and whoever is interested.
>>>To use wormhole is dead easy !!
>>>I tried it after some good months in a few minutes really great working.
>>>
>>>First I use wormhole in cubase where it is in start mode giving a name
>like
>>>track1
>>>Now on Paris I open wormhole (wrapped from FXpansion 3.3) and I put an
>EMPTY
>>>24bit file (although 16 bit could work too but why not have full 24 bits
>>>at least ?)
>>>I made this file with wavelab recording silence and copying mulytiole
silent
>>>segments until I got a 5 minute 24 bit empty file.
>>>PARIS MUST PLAY in order to receive the audio from Cubase.
>>>In wormhole in Paris you choose from the 'chooser" the track1-end
>>>where in cubase it is track1-start
>>>I don't know why you are not getting any results ?
>>>Oh one thing is PARIS UNDER XP ??? because I think Me or win98 does not
>>work
>>>with wormhole,if I remember correctly !
>>>ALSO
>>>Do not use wormhole to send to cubase and then back
>>>In order to wormhole right you have tochoose alatency around 10.000 which
>>>is big latency so no easy compensation.
>>>What I SUGGEST is:
>>>Use any great vst/dx sequncer like Cubase,Nuendo,Samplitude ,DP, Sawstudio,
>>>or whatever and process natively there without moving the faders in there,
>>>leave them at 0 !!!
>>>Then with wormhole send as much as 24 audio tracks (Pentium 4 2.6ghz with
>>>Paris) in Paris for summong and EDS effects only.
>>>Native effects do not work under Paris this way and why should ??
>>>Thats the best way to use Paris !
>>>Note wormhgole is sending 32bit floating so Paris truncates to 24 bit
integer
>>>(I guess) so better than adat interfacing !
>>>Works SAMPLE ACCURATE if you ONLY wrap it with FXpansion 3.3 , and I mean
>>>ONLY !!
>>>No other wrapper , standalone, can achieve sync !!
>>>It is fine with me.
>>>Ther will be a delay in hearing Paris wormhole tracks after you press
play
>>>on Cubase , remember 10000 samples but anyway so what...
>>>If you wanna use Paris transport use ,idi synchronization, MTC so each
>time
>>>you pusah play on Paris cubase follows.
>>>Amother tip is to have paris in LOOP mode for say 4 bars so it will always
>>>play the wormholed tracks no matter when you push play in Cubase.
>>>SEPARATE machines !
>>>No luck on same computer.
>>>Regards,
>>>Dimitriuos
>>
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/helpandsupport/lear nmore/appcompat.
mspx

I'm wondering if this might enhance the way Paris functions on Win XP and/or
even allow for multiple ADAT modules per MEC.

I'm going to give it a try in the next week or so, but if anyone wants to
Ghost their OS and go for it, I would reluctantly forego the pain.

;o)What if we just drop the levels of tracks 20db in cubase and crank our
mixer out and power amps up 20db in total?

Would that do it ?

chuck duffy wrote:
> Thad,
>
> I wish I could write a simple vst plug that would mimic what paris does in
> a native system, but I can't figure out how to make the (say cubase for example)
> meters show anything other than what's really in the signal path.
>
> It would be cool if only to see if it made any kind of difference in a native
> mix.
>
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
>
> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>> Hey Chuck,
>>
>> I still can't find the original post you're talking about, but thanks so
>> much for piping in. That's REALLY interesting. I must needs try some new
>> things with the native systems I use. Wow. Funny stuff. I've got mean things
>> on my mind . . .
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>> Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just the
>> source
>>> code for the mixer.
>>>
>>> Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the individual
>>> channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master. That's
>> why
>>> you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'. This
>>> is what many analog consoles do.
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>>
>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>> How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the
>
>>>> Submix masters ?
>>>>
>>>> DJ wrote:
>>>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and it
>> still
>>>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
>> it
>>>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders that
>>> are
>>>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
>>>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal DAW
>>> would
>>>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>>>
>>>>> ;o)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966 Thunderbird
>>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>>>> the
>>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>>> was
>>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
>> the
>>>>> master
>>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>>> Keep
>>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
>> to
>>>>> design
>>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>
>can you put plugs on totalmix on an hdsp9652 and send it back in on two
more tracks ? now I"m just rambling. hehe

chuck duffy wrote:
> duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert effect
> to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>
> Does the resistor on a channel prior to summing in an analog console change
> the sonic characteristcs at all? If it does it would probably be fairly
> simple to model dontcha think?
>
> Chuck
> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>> Thad,
>>
>> I wish I could write a simple vst plug that would mimic what paris does
> in
>> a native system, but I can't figure out how to make the (say cubase for
> example)
>> meters show anything other than what's really in the signal path.
>>
>> It would be cool if only to see if it made any kind of difference in a native
>> mix.
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>> Hey Chuck,
>>>
>>> I still can't find the original post you're talking about, but thanks so
>>> much for piping in. That's REALLY interesting. I must needs try some new
>>> things with the native systems I use. Wow. Funny stuff. I've got mean things
>>> on my mind . . .
>>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>> Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just the
>>> source
>>>> code for the mixer.
>>>>
>>>> Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the individual
>>>> channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master. That's
>>> why
>>>> you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'. This
>>>> is what many analog consoles do.
>>>>
>>>> Chuck
>>>>
>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>> How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the
>>>>> Submix masters ?
>>>>>
>>>>> DJ wrote:
>>>>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and it
>>> still
>>>>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
>>> it
>>>>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders that
>>>> are
>>>>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
>>>>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal DAW
>>>> would
>>>>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ;o)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966 Thunderbird
>>>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>>>> was
>>>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
>>> the
>>>>>> master
>>>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>>>> Keep
>>>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
>>> to
>>>>>> design
>>>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>
>The thing is, if there are 400 users that threw $200 at paris, all of a
sudden you probably got enough for a new version of software if someone
had all the source code, They could probably even figure out a way to
get rid of submixes and put all the tracks in one window and more.
$80,000 should be enough money to get something going.

Morgan wrote:
> Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
> out here ?
>
> Morgan :)
>
>
>
> chuck duffy wrote:
>> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all
>> the plugs
>> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED
>> TIMES.
>> Who knew....
>>
>> Chuck
>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just stupid!

John

DJ wrote:
> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory, or do
> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>
> Thanks,
>
> Deej
>
> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in root
> c:\
>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or cahnging
>> projects.
>> Now solid !!
>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this so
> decided
>> to try so voila !
>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
> priority
>> ,don't know....
>> The essential part is that it works.
>> Try this.
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>>
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>
>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever I've
>> got
>>> it ;-)
>>>
>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>
>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>
>>> Duh-ON
>>>
>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may lead
>> to
>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu folder
>> on
>>>> c root.
>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make
> any
>>>> difference !!
>>>> It makes !!
>>>> DO IT !!
>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dimitrios
>>>
>
>If they just put it out in the open source community it wouldn't take any
money :-)

Chuck

John <no@no.com> wrote:
>The thing is, if there are 400 users that threw $200 at paris, all of a

>sudden you probably got enough for a new version of software if someone

>had all the source code, They could probably even figure out a way to
>get rid of submixes and put all the tracks in one window and more.
>$80,000 should be enough money to get something going.
>
>Morgan wrote:
>> Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
>> out here ?
>>
>> Morgan :)
>>
>>
>>
>> chuck duffy wrote:
>>> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all

>>> the plugs
>>> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED

>>> TIMES.
>>> Who knew....
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>Hi John,

A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe from the application
folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number of crashes.
I posted this way back when we first started using the xp driver.

I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when nothing else seems
to.

Chuck

John <no@no.com> wrote:
>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just stupid!
>
>John
>
>DJ wrote:
>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory, or
do
>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Deej
>>
>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in root
>> c:\
>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or cahnging
>>> projects.
>>> Now solid !!
>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this so
>> decided
>>> to try so voila !
>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>> priority
>>> ,don't know....
>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>> Try this.
>>> Regards,
>>> Dimitrios
>>>
>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>
>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever
I've
>>> got
>>>> it ;-)
>>>>
>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>
>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>
>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>
>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may lead
>>> to
>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu folder
>>> on
>>>>> c root.
>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make
>> any
>>>>> difference !!
>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>
>>
>>Just move it and make the shortcut from the new destination.
Hours and hours with no crash after exiting and or changing projects.
Love it !
Regards,
Dimitrios

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory, or
do
>you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>
>Thanks,
>
>Deej
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>
>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in root
>c:\
>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or cahnging
>> projects.
>> Now solid !!
>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this so
>decided
>> to try so voila !
>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>priority
>> ,don't know....
>> The essential part is that it works.
>> Try this.
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>>
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>> >copy it to create c:\emu ?
>> >
>> >and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever I've
>> got
>> >it ;-)
>> >
>> >plugins and everything ?
>> >
>> >Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>> >
>> >Duh-ON
>> >
>> >"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>news:453b7449$1@linux...
>> >>
>> >> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>> >> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may lead
>> to
>> >> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu folder
>> on
>> >> c root.
>> >> c:\xxxx
>> >> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make
>any
>> >> difference !!
>> >> It makes !!
>> >> DO IT !!
>> >> Thats for XP of course.
>> >> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>> >> Regards,
>> >> Dimitrios
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>Yes

"brandon" <a@a.com> wrote:
>
>Dimitrios,
>
>Also, is musurgio@otenet.gr a valid email address?
>
>THX,B
>
>"Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote:
>>
>>Dimitrios,
>>
>>Thanks for all the info.
>>I was not using a silent track and I was not pushing PLAY in PARIS.
>>Also, I am trying it on one computer.
>>You are saying you couldnt get it to work between apps on one computer?
>>What did you try?
>>This is my only option right now so I have to get it to work.
>>I will let you know what I come up with.
>>
>>Thx,
>>B
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>>
>>>Some things more.
>>>On cubase wormhole instance click the sync button as to be checked, thus
>>>you can have synced intanses.
>>>On Paris wormhole intanse will read:
>>>"receiving from 192.168.0.1- end-instances synced"
>>>Only then you know you are sample accurate syncing.
>>>another tip.
>>>I use for Cuabse computer 192.168.0.1 ethernet address and 192.168.0.2
>for
>>>Paris, I find this way extremely stable ethernet connection.
>>>ANOTHER thing that might be important for some of you:
>>>Use the farmostr latency slider on Cubase wormhole (32768) and use instead
>>>of 10.000 5395 in Paris (I managed without clicks at least four tracks
>,could
>>>have tried more but no time right now) buffer so as to have audio tracks
>>>on both machines sound at the same time when "play through" is used in
>CVubase
>>>wormhole intanses.
>>>Regards,
>>>Dimitrios
>>>
>>>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Hi,
>>>>Brandon and whoever is interested.
>>>>To use wormhole is dead easy !!
>>>>I tried it after some good months in a few minutes really great working.
>>>>
>>>>First I use wormhole in cubase where it is in start mode giving a name
>>like
>>>>track1
>>>>Now on Paris I open wormhole (wrapped from FXpansion 3.3) and I put an
>>EMPTY
>>>>24bit file (although 16 bit could work too but why not have full 24 bits
>>>>at least ?)
>>>>I made this file with wavelab recording silence and copying mulytiole
>silent
>>>>segments until I got a 5 minute 24 bit empty file.
>>>>PARIS MUST PLAY in order to receive the audio from Cubase.
>>>>In wormhole in Paris you choose from the 'chooser" the track1-end
>>>>where in cubase it is track1-start
>>>>I don't know why you are not getting any results ?
>>>>Oh one thing is PARIS UNDER XP ??? because I think Me or win98 does not
>>>work
>>>>with wormhole,if I remember correctly !
>>>>ALSO
>>>>Do not use wormhole to send to cubase and then back
>>>>In order to wormhole right you have tochoose alatency around 10.000 which
>>>>is big latency so no easy compensation.
>>>>What I SUGGEST is:
>>>>Use any great vst/dx sequncer like Cubase,Nuendo,Samplitude ,DP, Sawstudio,
>>>>or whatever and process natively there without moving the faders in there,
>>>>leave them at 0 !!!
>>>>Then with wormhole send as much as 24 audio tracks (Pentium 4 2.6ghz
with
>>>>Paris) in Paris for summong and EDS effects only.
>>>>Native effects do not work under Paris this way and why should ??
>>>>Thats the best way to use Paris !
>>>>Note wormhgole is sending 32bit floating so Paris truncates to 24 bit
>integer
>>>>(I guess) so better than adat interfacing !
>>>>Works SAMPLE ACCURATE if you ONLY wrap it with FXpansion 3.3 , and I
mean
>>>>ONLY !!
>>>>No other wrapper , standalone, can achieve sync !!
>>>>It is fine with me.
>>>>Ther will be a delay in hearing Paris wormhole tracks after you press
>play
>>>>on Cubase , remember 10000 samples but anyway so what...
>>>>If you wanna use Paris transport use ,idi synchronization, MTC so each
>>time
>>>>you pusah play on Paris cubase follows.
>>>>Amother tip is to have paris in LOOP mode for say 4 bars so it will always
>>>>play the wormholed tracks no matter when you push play in Cubase.
>>>>SEPARATE machines !
>>>>No luck on same computer.
>>>>Regards,
>>>>Dimitriuos
>>>
>>
>Interesting...wonder why?

D

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
>
> Hi John,
>
> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe from the
> application
> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number of crashes.
> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp driver.
>
> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when nothing else
> seems
> to.
>
> Chuck
>
> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just stupid!
>>
>>John
>>
>>DJ wrote:
>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory, or
> do
>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Deej
>>>
>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in
>>>> root
>>> c:\
>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or
>>>> cahnging
>>>> projects.
>>>> Now solid !!
>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this so
>>> decided
>>>> to try so voila !
>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>>> priority
>>>> ,don't know....
>>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>>> Try this.
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>
>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>>
>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever
> I've
>>>> got
>>>>> it ;-)
>>>>>
>>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>>
>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>>
>>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>>
>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may
>>>>>> lead
>>>> to
>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu
>>>>>> folder
>>>> on
>>>>>> c root.
>>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make
>>> any
>>>>>> difference !!
>>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>I had every intention of doing that this week but our house got hit with the
flu big time...me included...still have every intention ASAP

Don

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453bb906@linux...
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/helpandsupport/lear nmore/appcompat.
> mspx
>
> I'm wondering if this might enhance the way Paris functions on Win XP
> and/or
> even allow for multiple ADAT modules per MEC.
>
> I'm going to give it a try in the next week or so, but if anyone wants to
> Ghost their OS and go for it, I would reluctantly forego the pain.
>
> ;o)
>
>
>Yeah, but are there enough to make it worth creating an OS 10 version?

Gantt

John <no@no.com> wrote:
>The thing is, if there are 400 users that threw $200 at paris, all of a

>sudden you probably got enough for a new version of software if someone

>had all the source code, They could probably even figure out a way to
>get rid of submixes and put all the tracks in one window and more.
>$80,000 should be enough money to get something going.
>
>Morgan wrote:
>> Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
>> out here ?
>>
>> Morgan :)
>>
>>
>>
>> chuck duffy wrote:
>>> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all

>>> the plugs
>>> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED

>>> TIMES.
>>> Who knew....
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>They really need to do that. It's not right for them to be making money
off something they are not supporting and it's just the right thing to
do unless they are going to commit to something that uses this source
code (FBI / NSA / IRS? ), hehe

John

chuck duffy wrote:
> If they just put it out in the open source community it wouldn't take any
> money :-)
>
> Chuck
>
> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>> The thing is, if there are 400 users that threw $200 at paris, all of a
>
>> sudden you probably got enough for a new version of software if someone
>
>> had all the source code, They could probably even figure out a way to
>> get rid of submixes and put all the tracks in one window and more.
>> $80,000 should be enough money to get something going.
>>
>> Morgan wrote:
>>> Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
>>> out here ?
>>>
>>> Morgan :)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> chuck duffy wrote:
>>>> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all
>
>>>> the plugs
>>>> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED
>
>>>> TIMES.
>>>> Who knew....
>>>>
>>>> Chuck
>The answer is no. When WinXP first came out I went through this. As I was
beta testing the driver, I was using this and it did help back then, but on
the release driver it made no difference that I saw.

AA

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453bb906@linux...
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/helpandsupport/lear nmore/appcompat.
> mspx
>
> I'm wondering if this might enhance the way Paris functions on Win XP
> and/or
> even allow for multiple ADAT modules per MEC.
>
> I'm going to give it a try in the next week or so, but if anyone wants to
> Ghost their OS and go for it, I would reluctantly forego the pain.
>
> ;o)
>
>
>oops. meant to say "Yeah, but are there enough MAC USERS to make it worth
creating an OS 10 version?"

Gantt

"Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>Yeah, but are there enough to make it worth creating an OS 10 version?
>
>Gantt
>
>John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>The thing is, if there are 400 users that threw $200 at paris, all of a
>
>>sudden you probably got enough for a new version of software if someone
>
>>had all the source code, They could probably even figure out a way to
>>get rid of submixes and put all the tracks in one window and more.
>>$80,000 should be enough money to get something going.
>>
>>Morgan wrote:
>>> Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
>>> out here ?
>>>
>>> Morgan :)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> chuck duffy wrote:
>>>> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all
>
>>>> the plugs
>>>> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED
>
>>>> TIMES.
>>>> Who knew....
>>>>
>>>> Chuck
>>>
>You saying if they came up with a new version you wouldn't consider
throwing a $500 PC in the corner?

Gantt Kushner wrote:
> oops. meant to say "Yeah, but are there enough MAC USERS to make it worth
> creating an OS 10 version?"
>
> Gantt
>
> "Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net> wrote:
>> Yeah, but are there enough to make it worth creating an OS 10 version?
>>
>> Gantt
>>
>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>> The thing is, if there are 400 users that threw $200 at paris, all of a
>>> sudden you probably got enough for a new version of software if someone
>>> had all the source code, They could probably even figure out a way to
>>> get rid of submixes and put all the tracks in one window and more.
>>> $80,000 should be enough money to get something going.
>>>
>>> Morgan wrote:
>>>> Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
>>>> out here ?
>>>>
>>>> Morgan :)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> chuck duffy wrote:
>>>>> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all
>>>>> the plugs
>>>>> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED
>>>>> TIMES.
>>>>> Who knew....
>>>>>
>>>>> Chuck
>Oh, man... the learning curve. What is a BIOS, anyway?

Gantt

John <no@no.com> wrote:
>You saying if they came up with a new version you wouldn't consider
>throwing a $500 PC in the corner?
>
>Gantt Kushner wrote:
>> oops. meant to say "Yeah, but are there enough MAC USERS to make it worth
>> creating an OS 10 version?"
>>
>> Gantt
>>
>> "Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net> wrote:
>>> Yeah, but are there enough to make it worth creating an OS 10 version?
>>>
>>> Gantt
>>>
>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>> The thing is, if there are 400 users that threw $200 at paris, all of
a
>>>> sudden you probably got enough for a new version of software if someone
>>>> had all the source code, They could probably even figure out a way to

>>>> get rid of submixes and put all the tracks in one window and more.
>>>> $80,000 should be enough money to get something going.
>>>>
>>>> Morgan wrote:
>>>>> Wow - Are there really 400 Paris Users still
>>>>> out here ?
>>>>>
>>>>> Morgan :)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> chuck duffy wrote:
>>>>>> I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all
>>>>>> the plugs
>>>>>> for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED
>>>>>> TIMES.
>>>>>> Who knew....
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chuck
>>I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can clock
these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were only two
of these available in North America and since these are rare and apparently
abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi I/O, the
other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie allows
the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes an
unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card has 7 x
SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of third
party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32 I/O of
the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT modules
across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)* DSP based
processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and hardware
DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some analog
interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX along
with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far into it.
I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've ever
wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I never use
midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX. I just
hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't expect
them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of vibe.

Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an AES to
ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4 x Paris
submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME box,
chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and returning
the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs to
complete the loop.

If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and UAD-1 cards
outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.

DeejHi Chuck,
Here is the signal flow for the inserts in Cubase/Nuendo.

insert audio path

Chris

chuck duffy wrote:

>duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert effect
>to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>
>Does the resistor on a channel prior to summing in an analog console change
>the sonic characteristcs at all? If it does it would probably be fairly
>simple to model dontcha think?
>
>Chuck
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Thad,
>>
>>I wish I could write a simple vst plug that would mimic what paris does
>>
>>
>in
>
>
>>a native system, but I can't figure out how to make the (say cubase for
>>
>>
>example)
>
>
>>meters show anything other than what's really in the signal path.
>>
>>It would be cool if only to see if it made any kind of difference in a native
>>mix.
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Hey Chuck,
>>>
>>>I still can't find the original post you're talking about, but thanks so
>>>much for piping in. That's REALLY interesting. I must needs try some new
>>>things with the native systems I use. Wow. Funny stuff. I've got mean things
>>>on my mind . . .
>>>
>>>TCB
>>>
>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>source
>>>
>>>
>>>>code for the mixer.
>>>>
>>>>Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the individual
>>>>channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master. That's
>>>>
>>>>
>>>why
>>>
>>>
>>>>you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'. This
>>>>is what many analog consoles do.
>>>>
>>>>Chuck
>>>>
>>>>John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Submix masters ?
>>>>>
>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and it
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>still
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>it
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>are
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
>>>>>>fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal DAW
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>would
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>;o)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966 Thunderbird
>>>>>>>is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But, during
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native there
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>was
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>the
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>master
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater detail?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>Keep
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>to
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>design
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>TCB
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>
>
>

--
Chris Ludwig
ADK
chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
(859) 635-5762I tried that. I also tried creating busses, attenuating them by 20dB and
then applying various optomizers there, also tried lowering the main mix bus
and applying various gain makeup plugins there and all sorts of combinations
of the above on the busses and individual channels. Some of them sounded
very good actually and if I was mixing a lot of pop/rock/metal music which
lent itself well to this kind of processing, I wouldn't even think twice
about it. I liked it a lot. the thing about it that didn't work for me is
that what we do the most of here involves recording acoustic instruments
into microphones and mixing them. I need an unprocessed palate to start from
for what I do and the Paris mix bus works better for this than any
combination of stuff I tried in SX. Adding processing to make the bus(ses)
sound bigger, worked, but it also made the mix sound processed. I'm not
saying that it's not possible to get there though and I'm going to continue
plugging away at it in Cubase in my spare time. If Chuck/Skunkworks could
code a plugin that is colorless, it might be the magic bullet. I'm hoping to
find something like that in the Scope platform.

Deej

Deej

"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:453bbcfd@linux...
> What if we just drop the levels of tracks 20db in cubase and crank our
> mixer out and power amps up 20db in total?
>
> Would that do it ?
>
> chuck duffy wrote:
> > Thad,
> >
> > I wish I could write a simple vst plug that would mimic what paris does
in
> > a native system, but I can't figure out how to make the (say cubase for
example)
> > meters show anything other than what's really in the signal path.
> >
> > It would be cool if only to see if it made any kind of difference in a
native
> > mix.
> >
> > Chuck
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
> >> Hey Chuck,
> >>
> >> I still can't find the original post you're talking about, but thanks
so
> >> much for piping in. That's REALLY interesting. I must needs try some
new
> >> things with the native systems I use. Wow. Funny stuff. I've got mean
things
> >> on my mind . . .
> >>
> >> TCB
> >>
> >> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
> >>> Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope, just
the
> >> source
> >>> code for the mixer.
> >>>
> >>> Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping the
individual
> >>> channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master.
That's
> >> why
> >>> you can push the individual channels so hard and make things 'gel'.
This
> >>> is what many analog consoles do.
> >>>
> >>> Chuck
> >>>
> >>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
> >>>> How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on the
> >
> >>>> Submix masters ?
> >>>>
> >>>> DJ wrote:
> >>>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it and it
> >> still
> >>>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that since
> >> it
> >>>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix faders
that
> >>> are
> >>>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the global
> >>>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a normal
DAW
> >>> would
> >>>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ;o)
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
> >>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966
Thunderbird
> >>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit. But,
during
> >>>>> the
> >>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go native
there
> >>> was
> >>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from channels/busses to
> >> the
> >>>>> master
> >>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater
detail?
> >>>>> Keep
> >>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about how
> >> to
> >>>>> design
> >>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> TCB
> >>>>>
> >This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------070402030407090602030907
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

ok lets try this with an attached image instead.

Chris Ludwig wrote:

> Hi Chuck,
> Here is the signal flow for the inserts in Cubase/Nuendo.
>
>
> insert audio path
>
>
>
> Chris
>
> chuck duffy wrote:
>
>> duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert
>> effect
>> to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>>
>> Does the resistor on a channel prior to summing in an analog console
>> change
>> the sonic characteristcs at all? If it does it would probably be
>> fairly
>> simple to model dontcha think?
>>
>> Chuck
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Thad,
>>>
>>> I wish I could write a simple vst plug that would mimic what paris does
>>>
>>
>> in
>>
>>
>>> a native system, but I can't figure out how to make the (say cubase for
>>>
>>
>> example)
>>
>>
>>> meters show anything other than what's really in the signal path.
>>> It would be cool if only to see if it made any kind of difference in
>>> a native
>>> mix.
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hey Chuck,
>>>>
>>>> I still can't find the original post you're talking about, but
>>>> thanks so
>>>> much for piping in. That's REALLY interesting. I must needs try
>>>> some new
>>>> things with the native systems I use. Wow. Funny stuff. I've got
>>>> mean things
>>>> on my mind . . .
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Find my post that explains it. I wasn't using an oscilliscope,
>>>>> just the
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> source
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> code for the mixer.
>>>>>
>>>>> Behind the scenes, and without your knowledge, paris is dipping
>>>>> the individual
>>>>> channels by 22 db. Then it applies 22 db makeup on the master.
>>>>> That's
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> why
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> you can push the individual channels so hard and make things
>>>>> 'gel'. This
>>>>> is what many analog consoles do.
>>>>>
>>>>> Chuck
>>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> How do you know that is true? Are you putting an oscilloscope on
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Submix masters ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DJ wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Everything is attenuated by -22dB but it doesn't look like it
>>>>>>> and it
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> still
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> sounds like it's at normal levels, which it isn't, except that
>>>>>>> since
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> it
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> sounds like it so when you are seeing levels at the submix
>>>>>>> faders that
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> are
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> at 0 zero dB, they really aren't, they are -22dB lower at the
>>>>>>> global
>>>>>>> fader.........except that they will have the same SPL as a
>>>>>>> normal DAW
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> would
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> at zero dB.......now explain that one.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ;o)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:45392dd8$1@linux...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OK, I've been too busy working on my job and my car (new 1966
>>>>>>>> Thunderbird
>>>>>>>> is the ride, and she's lovely) and haven't posted in a bit.
>>>>>>>> But, during
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 35 seconds when Deej was going to simplify his rig and go
>>>>>>>> native there
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>> was
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> discussion about the way levels are managed from
>>>>>>>> channels/busses to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> master
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> output in PARIS. Can someone explain this to me in much greater
>>>>>>>> detail?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Keep
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> in mind I know my digital stuff just fine but I know less about
>>>>>>>> how
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> design
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> a console than I do how to make and anti-gravity machine.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>
>>
>>
>

--
Chris Ludwig
ADK
chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
(859) 635-5762

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--------------070402030407090602030907--<bump>
Chuck did you see this (below), would this work?

Neil

"Neil" <IUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>
>OK, then how about this... (and I don't even know if this is
>possible, as I'm no codehead, but...) can you make part of that
>plugin's GUI package a separate meter that overlays the Cubase
>channel meter, permanently/constantly, when that plugin is
>installed & that particular view for the channel is selected? If
>so, then you can make that meter read 22 db higher than the
>actual Cubase meter and voila'!
>
>And make it that nice pretty Paris gold color, too, so that
>when they just look at the channel itself they'll know if that
>plugin is inserted without having to go to the "inserts" menu.
>
>Neil
>
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>Neil,
>>
>>AFAIK the meters are driven by directly reading samples from the buffer.
>> I don't know how to drive the channel meters any other way.
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>"Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert effect
>>>>to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>>>
>>>I don't believe there is, Chuck - I just checked to make sure &
>>>I couldn't find a way to do it. Is there any way to enter a
>>>prompt line in the plugin code to show the metering as being
>>>higher than the actual level?
>>>
>>>Neil
>>
>BTW - Nuendo/Cubase meters can be pre and post fader.

Dedric

On 10/22/06 6:35 PM, in article 453c0e59$1@linux, "Neil" <OIUOI@OI.com>
wrote:

>
> <bump>
> Chuck did you see this (below), would this work?
>
> Neil
>
> "Neil" <IUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>
>> OK, then how about this... (and I don't even know if this is
>> possible, as I'm no codehead, but...) can you make part of that
>> plugin's GUI package a separate meter that overlays the Cubase
>> channel meter, permanently/constantly, when that plugin is
>> installed & that particular view for the channel is selected? If
>> so, then you can make that meter read 22 db higher than the
>> actual Cubase meter and voila'!
>>
>> And make it that nice pretty Paris gold color, too, so that
>> when they just look at the channel itself they'll know if that
>> plugin is inserted without having to go to the "inserts" menu.
>>
>> Neil
>>
>>
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Neil,
>>>
>>> AFAIK the meters are driven by directly reading samples from the buffer.
>>> I don't know how to drive the channel meters any other way.
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>>
>>> "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert effect
>>>>> to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>>>>
>>>> I don't believe there is, Chuck - I just checked to make sure &
>>>> I couldn't find a way to do it. Is there any way to enter a
>>>> prompt line in the plugin code to show the metering as being
>>>> higher than the actual level?
>>>>
>>>> Neil
>>>
>>
>Spappy,

Don't know if this applies, but I had a similar effect pulling up
projects that hadn't been saved since I added a word clock. If this
could apply, double check your clock and sample rate settings.

Hope this helps,

Jeff

Spappy wrote:
> When I load a project that was originally started on a different Paris
> system, it seems to get this pulsating feedback loop going on whichever
> effect is on Aux 1. I have tried removing the effect and it stops, but even
> if I assign the same effect to another aux (like aux 3 for instance) it
> still does it. So it seems to be corrupting the effect. Doesn't matter which
> effect it is.
>
> How can I fix this?
>
> Spappy
>
>Really?!?

We did a role call here a way back and got something close to 200 names on
the list over a period of a couple of weeks, though many of those no longer
use Paris.

400 people... that's a lot...

Cheers,
Kim.

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>I had not checked server logs for a long time. Since I released all the
plugs
>for free download the PC value pack has been downloaded FOUR HUNDRED TIMES.
> Who knew....
>
>ChuckIt was a really wierd problem. But I replaced EDS card and problem went
away. Still trying to figure out what the deal is on that.

Spappy

"Jeff hoover" <jkhoover@excite.com> wrote in message news:453c541b@linux...
> Spappy,
>
> Don't know if this applies, but I had a similar effect pulling up projects
> that hadn't been saved since I added a word clock. If this could apply,
> double check your clock and sample rate settings.
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Jeff
>
> Spappy wrote:
>> When I load a project that was originally started on a different Paris
>> system, it seems to get this pulsating feedback loop going on whichever
>> effect is on Aux 1. I have tried removing the effect and it stops, but
>> even if I assign the same effect to another aux (like aux 3 for instance)
>> it still does it. So it seems to be corrupting the effect. Doesn't matter
>> which effect it is.
>>
>> How can I fix this?
>>
>> Spappyokay then, all is forgiven...who ever you are.

On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 12:20:17 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:

>Where's my coffee. When I don't drink enough coffee, my memory gets so bad
>that I can't remember how to make coffee.
>
>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1kemj293sbgrm9us08ffm7bdne3di11cu7@4ax.com...
>> it's mr. footballhead mr. memory...
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 21 Oct 2006 09:36:28 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>>
>> >OK then Mr. Banjohead,
>> >
>> >Click on Weeeeee!!!!!!!!
>> >http://squealpiggie.ytmnd.com/
>> > http://www.funnyjunk.com/funny_pictures/788/Squeal+like+a+pi g
>> >
>> >;o)
>> >
>> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >news:3fmjj2pgqi41jgp10rlv9u78qd65pd90j4@4ax.com...
>> >> i'm tooo pretty for the big house. ;o)
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 14:47:26 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >are we gonna go to Tuscon and get arrested? I never got a confirmation
>on
>> >> >that.
>> >> >
>> >> >;o)
>> >> >
>> >> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >> >news:vr3ij296k8e9cfraagtkc1e7coeklfpb7q@4ax.com...
>> >> >> yup.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 10:30:40 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >Well, this is pretty cool then. To get rid of these errors, all
>I've
>> >got
>> >> >to
>> >> >> >do is change the default settings in WL.........right?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >;o)
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >> >> >news:tr2hj2hpp391cn4kj5p2ktere5bmpcc77o@4ax.com...
>> >> >> >> at it's default setting wavelab will show 1000's of errors per
>> >second.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> On 20 Oct 2006 04:56:18 +1000, "Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSP.com>
>> >wrote:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >"DJ" <no@way.jack> wrote:
>> >> >> >> >>The other day I posted about my bounces having literally
>millions
>> >of
>> >> >> >errors
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >>showing up in Wavelab. They were inaudible but it was bothering
>> >the
>> >> >hell
>> >> >> >> >out
>> >> >> >> >>of me that they were there. Well, I just ripped some commercial
>CD
>> >> >> >tracks
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >>(New Favorite-Allison Krause and Wide Open Spaces-Dixie Chicks)
>> >and
>> >> >ran
>> >> >> >> >the
>> >> >> >> >>same analysis on them. They are the same. Millions of
>(inaudible
>> >> >errors)
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >>digital errors. Also, the click detection shows as many or more
>of
>> >> >these
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >>than my mixes do. I was thinking my ears might be going south
>on
>> >me
>> >> >and
>> >> >> >> >that
>> >> >> >> >>my mix method using Cubase -into-Paris whil'st insanely clocked
>> >was
>> >> >> >creating
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >>a mess that I just wasn't hearing but that would be rejected if
>I
>> >> >ever
>> >> >> >sent
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >>a mix out of here to a third party mastering house. Well, if
>> >> >anything,
>> >> >> >my
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >>mixes are the same or less error prone than the ones I'm seeing
>> >here.
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >>Just another reason to trust the ears, not the
>eyes...............
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >>Deej
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >I have to look into this further, but my recent mixes (CD
>> >> >masters),done
>> >> >> >via
>> >> >> >> >lightpipe to Paris, have been checked in PlexTools for errors
>and
>> >have
>> >> >
>> >> >> >come
>> >> >> >> >up 100% clean.
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >Gene
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >
>>
>now my stomach hurts...

On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:34 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:

>I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can clock
>these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were only two
>of these available in North America and since these are rare and apparently
>abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi I/O, the
>other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie allows
>the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes an
>unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card has 7 x
>SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of third
>party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
>think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32 I/O of
>the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT modules
>across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)* DSP based
>processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and hardware
>DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some analog
>interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX along
>with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
>everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far into it.
>I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've ever
>wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I never use
>midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX. I just
>hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't expect
>them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of vibe.
>
>Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an AES to
>ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4 x Paris
>submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME box,
>chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and returning
>the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs to
>complete the loop.
>
>If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and UAD-1 cards
>outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
>
>Deej
>"Hello, is this the Sheriff's Office?"
"Yes. What can I do for you?"
"I'm calling to report 'bout my neighbor Virgil
Smith....He's hidin' marijuana inside his firewood!
Don't quite know how he gets it inside them logs,
but he's hidin' it there."
"Thank you very much for the call, sir."
The next day, the Sheriff's Deputies descend on Virgil's
house. They search the shed where the firewood is kept.
Using axes, they bust open every piece of wood, but
find no marijuana. They sneer at Virgil and leave.
Shortly, the phone rings at Virgil's house.
"Hey, Virgil! This here's Floyd....Did the Sheriff come?"
"Yeah!"
"Did they chop your firewood?"
"Yep!"
"Happy Birthday, buddy!".I would need a post fader, post meter insert.

Chuck

Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>BTW - Nuendo/Cubase meters can be pre and post fader.
>
>Dedric
>
>On 10/22/06 6:35 PM, in article 453c0e59$1@linux, "Neil" <OIUOI@OI.com>
>wrote:
>
>>
>> <bump>
>> Chuck did you see this (below), would this work?
>>
>> Neil
>>
>> "Neil" <IUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> OK, then how about this... (and I don't even know if this is
>>> possible, as I'm no codehead, but...) can you make part of that
>>> plugin's GUI package a separate meter that overlays the Cubase
>>> channel meter, permanently/constantly, when that plugin is
>>> installed & that particular view for the channel is selected? If
>>> so, then you can make that meter read 22 db higher than the
>>> actual Cubase meter and voila'!
>>>
>>> And make it that nice pretty Paris gold color, too, so that
>>> when they just look at the channel itself they'll know if that
>>> plugin is inserted without having to go to the "inserts" menu.
>>>
>>> Neil
>>>
>>>
>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Neil,
>>>>
>>>> AFAIK the meters are driven by directly reading samples from the buffer.
>>>> I don't know how to drive the channel meters any other way.
>>>>
>>>> Chuck
>>>>
>>>> "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert
effect
>>>>>> to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't believe there is, Chuck - I just checked to make sure &
>>>>> I couldn't find a way to do it. Is there any way to enter a
>>>>> prompt line in the plugin code to show the metering as being
>>>>> higher than the actual level?
>>>>>
>>>>> Neil
>>>>
>>>
>>
>It probably has something to do with the way some portion of the effects subsystem
deals with long paths. Have you ever seen the way a long path gets converted
for dos compatibility?

Chuck

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>Interesting...wonder why?
>
>D
>
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
>>
>> Hi John,
>>
>> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe from the
>> application
>> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number of crashes.
>> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp driver.
>>
>> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when nothing else

>> seems
>> to.
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
>>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just stupid!
>>>
>>>John
>>>
>>>DJ wrote:
>>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory,
or
>> do
>>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Deej
>>>>
>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in

>>>>> root
>>>> c:\
>>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or
>>>>> cahnging
>>>>> projects.
>>>>> Now solid !!
>>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this
so
>>>> decided
>>>>> to try so voila !
>>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>>>> priority
>>>>> ,don't know....
>>>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>>>> Try this.
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>
>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever
>> I've
>>>>> got
>>>>>> it ;-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may

>>>>>>> lead
>>>>> to
>>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu
>>>>>>> folder
>>>>> on
>>>>>>> c root.
>>>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could make
>>>> any
>>>>>>> difference !!
>>>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>
>Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>BTW - Nuendo/Cubase meters can be pre and post fader.

Yeah, but if I were to switch to pre-fader metering, then
everything just shows +5 all the time.

:DHey Deej,

Keep us posted, if you can get this stuff working I'll take a serious look
at Pulsar again.

And, by the way, you're sick.

TCB

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can clock
>these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were only two
>of these available in North America and since these are rare and apparently
>abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi I/O, the
>other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie allows
>the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes an
>unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card has 7
x
>SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of third
>party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
>think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32 I/O
of
>the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT modules
>across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)* DSP based
>processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and hardware
>DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some analog
>interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX along
>with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
>everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far into
it.
>I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've ever
>wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I never use
>midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX. I just
>hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't expect
>them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of vibe.
>
>Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an AES
to
>ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4 x Paris
>submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME box,
>chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and returning
>the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs to
>complete the loop.
>
>If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and UAD-1 cards
>outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
>
>Deej
>
>Interesting.
So maybe VST doesn't work that fine maybe because it is normally:
c:\Program files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder.
So if we install all vst on say:
c:\vst that could help...
I will try :)
Regards,
Dimitrios

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>It probably has something to do with the way some portion of the effects
subsystem
>deals with long paths. Have you ever seen the way a long path gets converted
>for dos compatibility?
>
>Chuck
>
>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>Interesting...wonder why?
>>
>>D
>>
>>
>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Hi John,
>>>
>>> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe from the

>>> application
>>> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number of crashes.
>>> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp driver.
>>>
>>> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when nothing else
>
>>> seems
>>> to.
>>>
>>> Chuck
>>>
>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
>>>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just stupid!
>>>>
>>>>John
>>>>
>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory,
>or
>>> do
>>>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Deej
>>>>>
>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in
>
>>>>>> root
>>>>> c:\
>>>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or
>>>>>> cahnging
>>>>>> projects.
>>>>>> Now solid !!
>>>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this
>so
>>>>> decided
>>>>>> to try so voila !
>>>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>>>>> priority
>>>>>> ,don't know....
>>>>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>>>>> Try this.
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever
>>> I've
>>>>>> got
>>>>>>> it ;-)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may
>
>>>>>>>> lead
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu

>>>>>>>> folder
>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> c root.
>>>>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could
make
>>>>> any
>>>>>>>> difference !!
>>>>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>FWIW my paths are C:\Paris3 and C:\vst and I don't have problems.Note there
is no space in my 8.3 friendly naming, straight up DOS happy.

AA

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453ccc1f$1@linux...
>
> Interesting.
> So maybe VST doesn't work that fine maybe because it is normally:
> c:\Program files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder.
> So if we install all vst on say:
> c:\vst that could help...
> I will try :)
> Regards,
> Dimitrios
>
> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>It probably has something to do with the way some portion of the effects
> subsystem
>>deals with long paths. Have you ever seen the way a long path gets
>>converted
>>for dos compatibility?
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>Interesting...wonder why?
>>>
>>>D
>>>
>>>
>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Hi John,
>>>>
>>>> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe from the
>
>>>> application
>>>> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number of
>>>> crashes.
>>>> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp driver.
>>>>
>>>> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when nothing else
>>
>>>> seems
>>>> to.
>>>>
>>>> Chuck
>>>>
>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
>>>>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just
>>>>>stupid!
>>>>>
>>>>>John
>>>>>
>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory,
>>or
>>>> do
>>>>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Deej
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>>>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it in
>>
>>>>>>> root
>>>>>> c:\
>>>>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or
>>>>>>> cahnging
>>>>>>> projects.
>>>>>>> Now solid !!
>>>>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this
>>so
>>>>>> decided
>>>>>>> to try so voila !
>>>>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>>>>>> priority
>>>>>>> ,don't know....
>>>>>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>>>>>> Try this.
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where ever
>>>> I've
>>>>>>> got
>>>>>>>> it ;-)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that may
>>
>>>>>>>>> lead
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu
>
>>>>>>>>> folder
>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>> c root.
>>>>>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could
> make
>>>>>> any
>>>>>>>>> difference !!
>>>>>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>OK, will do and yes, I know.

;o)

"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:453cc0b8$1@linux...
>
> Hey Deej,
>
> Keep us posted, if you can get this stuff working I'll take a serious look
> at Pulsar again.
>
> And, by the way, you're sick.
>
> TCB
>
> "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
> >I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can clock
> >these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were only
two
> >of these available in North America and since these are rare and
apparently
> >abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi I/O, the
> >other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie
allows
> >the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes an
> >unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card has 7
> x
> >SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of
third
> >party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
> >think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32 I/O
> of
> >the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT modules
> >across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)* DSP
based
> >processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and
hardware
> >DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some analog
> >interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX along
> >with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
> >everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far into
> it.
> >I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've ever
> >wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I never
use
> >midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX. I
just
> >hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't expect
> >them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of vibe.
> >
> >Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an AES
> to
> >ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4 x
Paris
> >submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME box,
> >chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and
returning
> >the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs to
> >complete the loop.
> >
> >If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and UAD-1
cards
> >outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
> >
> >Deej
> >
> >
>Uncle Ricky, his will actually be much *simpler* than what I'm doing now.
MUCH simpler (well, at least, at first.....;o)

;o)

"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:m80pj29e48oh6kg3glt9lnj26agjtqgqfr@4ax.com...
> now my stomach hurts...
>
>
>
> On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:34 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>
> >I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can clock
> >these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were only
two
> >of these available in North America and since these are rare and
apparently
> >abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi I/O, the
> >other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie
allows
> >the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes an
> >unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card has 7 x
> >SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of
third
> >party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
> >think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32 I/O
of
> >the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT modules
> >across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)* DSP
based
> >processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and
hardware
> >DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some analog
> >interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX along
> >with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
> >everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far into
it.
> >I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've ever
> >wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I never
use
> >midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX. I
just
> >hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't expect
> >them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of vibe.
> >
> >Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an AES
to
> >ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4 x
Paris
> >submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME box,
> >chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and
returning
> >the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs to
> >complete the loop.
> >
> >If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and UAD-1
cards
> >outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
> >
> >Deej
> >
>I'm getting dizzy ! hehe

DJ wrote:
> Uncle Ricky, his will actually be much *simpler* than what I'm doing now.
> MUCH simpler (well, at least, at first.....;o)
>
> ;o)
>
> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:m80pj29e48oh6kg3glt9lnj26agjtqgqfr@4ax.com...
>> now my stomach hurts...
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:34 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>>
>>> I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can clock
>>> these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were only
> two
>>> of these available in North America and since these are rare and
> apparently
>>> abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi I/O, the
>>> other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie
> allows
>>> the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes an
>>> unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card has 7 x
>>> SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of
> third
>>> party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
>>> think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32 I/O
> of
>>> the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT modules
>>> across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)* DSP
> based
>>> processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and
> hardware
>>> DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some analog
>>> interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX along
>>> with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
>>> everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far into
> it.
>>> I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've ever
>>> wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I never
> use
>>> midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX. I
> just
>>> hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't expect
>>> them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of vibe.
>>>
>>> Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an AES
> to
>>> ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4 x
> Paris
>>> submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME box,
>>> chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and
> returning
>>> the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs to
>>> complete the loop.
>>>
>>> If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and UAD-1
> cards
>>> outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
>>>
>>> Deej
>>>
>
>Hi all

Here is the itunes page for PSW's CaPE IV song writting, recording project

All money generated will be donated to Oxfam

Please check it out and pass it along to any other forums you feel might be
interested

I was on Team Synergy

thanks

Don

go to http://tinyurl.com/ym7n38Sorry guys my mistake...this was last year's CaPE III unfortunately I
didn't participate on this one

here's a link to CDBaby which has some audio files
http://cdbaby.com/cd/capeiii

Don

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:453ce1ad@linux...
> Hi all
>
> Here is the itunes page for PSW's CaPE IV song writting, recording project
>
> All money generated will be donated to Oxfam
>
> Please check it out and pass it along to any other forums you feel might
> be
> interested
>
> I was on Team Synergy
>
> thanks
>
> Don
>
> go to http://tinyurl.com/ym7n38
>
>
>I tried cut and copy to C:\ and the paf and ppj icons show up as generic.
It did open for me, but I changed it back as I'm in the middle of something
and don't really want to mess things up.
Should I do an unstall of the app and the sub system and re-install, or cut
copy the Paris exe and re-install the subsystem, pointing it toward the C:\
or what?
Rod
"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>FWIW my paths are C:\Paris3 and C:\vst and I don't have problems.Note there

>is no space in my 8.3 friendly naming, straight up DOS happy.
>
>AA
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453ccc1f$1@linux...
>>
>> Interesting.
>> So maybe VST doesn't work that fine maybe because it is normally:
>> c:\Program files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder.
>> So if we install all vst on say:
>> c:\vst that could help...
>> I will try :)
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>>
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>It probably has something to do with the way some portion of the effects
>> subsystem
>>>deals with long paths. Have you ever seen the way a long path gets
>>>converted
>>>for dos compatibility?
>>>
>>>Chuck
>>>
>>>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>Interesting...wonder why?
>>>>
>>>>D
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi John,
>>>>>
>>>>> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe from the
>>
>>>>> application
>>>>> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number of
>>>>> crashes.
>>>>> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp driver.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when nothing else
>>>
>>>>> seems
>>>>> to.
>>>>>
>>>>> Chuck
>>>>>
>>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
>>>>>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just

>>>>>>stupid!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>John
>>>>>>
>>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files Directory,
>>>or
>>>>> do
>>>>>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Deej
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it
in
>>>
>>>>>>>> root
>>>>>>> c:\
>>>>>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or
>>>>>>>> cahnging
>>>>>>>> projects.
>>>>>>>> Now solid !!
>>>>>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading this
>>>so
>>>>>>> decided
>>>>>>>> to try so voila !
>>>>>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>>>>>>> priority
>>>>>>>> ,don't know....
>>>>>>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>>>>>>> Try this.
>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where
ever
>>>>> I've
>>>>>>>> got
>>>>>>>>> it ;-)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>>>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that
may
>>>
>>>>>>>>>> lead
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu
>>
>>>>>>>>>> folder
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>> c root.
>>>>>>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could
>> make
>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>>>>> difference !!
>>>>>>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>>>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
>I'm using a dual 1GHz G4 Quicksilver, but PARIS doesn't take advantage of
the extra processor. Be careful of the very last OS 9 G4, I think it was a
1.25 GHz as someone here had major problems using it with PARIS (Rick?). I
think they early 1.25GHz were ok.

Tony

"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4539a168$1@linux...
>
> So what's the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not
> classic
> of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867 Mhz
> machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to indicate
> that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn't specify
> whether
> it's classic or not.
>
> Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an
> accelerator
> (say, Sonnet)?
>
> Thanks,
> DaleIt could be that your daughtercard has gone south.

I had a card with a bad daughtercard, and it would make weird noises when trying to use the effects.

If it passes audio otherwise, I would guess that to be the problem.

Cheers,

TC

Spappy wrote:
> It was a really wierd problem. But I replaced EDS card and problem went
> away. Still trying to figure out what the deal is on that.
>
> Spappy
>
>
>
> "Jeff hoover" <jkhoover@excite.com> wrote in message news:453c541b@linux...
>> Spappy,
>>
>> Don't know if this applies, but I had a similar effect pulling up projects
>> that hadn't been saved since I added a word clock. If this could apply,
>> double check your clock and sample rate settings.
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>> Spappy wrote:
>>> When I load a project that was originally started on a different Paris
>>> system, it seems to get this pulsating feedback loop going on whichever
>>> effect is on Aux 1. I have tried removing the effect and it stops, but
>>> even if I assign the same effect to another aux (like aux 3 for instance)
>>> it still does it. So it seems to be corrupting the effect. Doesn't matter
>>> which effect it is.
>>>
>>> How can I fix this?
>>>
>>> Spappy
>
>I installed up front into C:\Paris22 and C:\Paris3 for each version. I set
all my VST plugs to hit C:\vst. Not sure in your situation what is
appropriate, but feel safe to say a reinstall would do the trick. Copy/Paste
I'm not to sure about that one becuase of the XP subsystem paths.
AA

"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:453cf05e$1@linux...
>
> I tried cut and copy to C:\ and the paf and ppj icons show up as generic.
> It did open for me, but I changed it back as I'm in the middle of
> something
> and don't really want to mess things up.
> Should I do an unstall of the app and the sub system and re-install, or
> cut
> copy the Paris exe and re-install the subsystem, pointing it toward the
> C:\
> or what?
> Rod
> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>FWIW my paths are C:\Paris3 and C:\vst and I don't have problems.Note
>>there
>
>>is no space in my 8.3 friendly naming, straight up DOS happy.
>>
>>AA
>>
>>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453ccc1f$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Interesting.
>>> So maybe VST doesn't work that fine maybe because it is normally:
>>> c:\Program files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder.
>>> So if we install all vst on say:
>>> c:\vst that could help...
>>> I will try :)
>>> Regards,
>>> Dimitrios
>>>
>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>It probably has something to do with the way some portion of the effects
>>> subsystem
>>>>deals with long paths. Have you ever seen the way a long path gets
>>>>converted
>>>>for dos compatibility?
>>>>
>>>>Chuck
>>>>
>>>>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>Interesting...wonder why?
>>>>>
>>>>>D
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi John,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe from the
>>>
>>>>>> application
>>>>>> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number of
>>>>>> crashes.
>>>>>> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp driver.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when nothing else
>>>>
>>>>>> seems
>>>>>> to.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chuck
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
>>>>>>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just
>
>>>>>>>stupid!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>John
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files
>>>>>>>> Directory,
>>>>or
>>>>>> do
>>>>>>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Deej
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put it
> in
>>>>
>>>>>>>>> root
>>>>>>>> c:\
>>>>>>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or
>>>>>>>>> cahnging
>>>>>>>>> projects.
>>>>>>>>> Now solid !!
>>>>>>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading
>>>>>>>>> this
>>>>so
>>>>>>>> decided
>>>>>>>>> to try so voila !
>>>>>>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>>>>>>>> priority
>>>>>>>>> ,don't know....
>>>>>>>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>>>>>>>> Try this.
>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where
> ever
>>>>>> I've
>>>>>>>>> got
>>>>>>>>>> it ;-)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>>>>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that
> may
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> lead
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you emu
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> folder
>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>> c root.
>>>>>>>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>>>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could
>>> make
>>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>> difference !!
>>>>>>>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>>>>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>>>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>>>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>Hi,
It doesn't have to do with reinstalling or not.
As Chuck said it may be something with long strings.
So I took it further for smoother plugin work with Paris !!
I reintalled all my VST at:
c:\vst
AND ALL my DX (yes DX) at:
c:\DX
ALSO I put the the content of the Paris folder DIRECTLY at:
c:\
I mean NOT the EMU folder but the content of it !

Paris runs super fast with plugins , even vst plugz not showingh before in
Chainer like waves are shown now although still not working.
I am sure as you will see that there is a big difference.
Not a single crash putting in and out dx plugins while paris running vst
andothers and quitting Paris while in play mode.
NO CRASH.
I encourage you to try after you make a ghost backup just in case.
I would love your input here.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>I installed up front into C:\Paris22 and C:\Paris3 for each version. I set

>all my VST plugs to hit C:\vst. Not sure in your situation what is
>appropriate, but feel safe to say a reinstall would do the trick. Copy/Paste

>I'm not to sure about that one becuase of the XP subsystem paths.
>AA
>
>
>"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message
>news:453cf05e$1@linux...
>>
>> I tried cut and copy to C:\ and the paf and ppj icons show up as generic.
>> It did open for me, but I changed it back as I'm in the middle of
>> something
>> and don't really want to mess things up.
>> Should I do an unstall of the app and the sub system and re-install, or

>> cut
>> copy the Paris exe and re-install the subsystem, pointing it toward the

>> C:\
>> or what?
>> Rod
>> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>FWIW my paths are C:\Paris3 and C:\vst and I don't have problems.Note

>>>there
>>
>>>is no space in my 8.3 friendly naming, straight up DOS happy.
>>>
>>>AA
>>>
>>>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453ccc1f$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Interesting.
>>>> So maybe VST doesn't work that fine maybe because it is normally:
>>>> c:\Program files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder.
>>>> So if we install all vst on say:
>>>> c:\vst that could help...
>>>> I will try :)
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>
>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>It probably has something to do with the way some portion of the effects
>>>> subsystem
>>>>>deals with long paths. Have you ever seen the way a long path gets
>>>>>converted
>>>>>for dos compatibility?
>>>>>
>>>>>Chuck
>>>>>
>>>>>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>Interesting...wonder why?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>D
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi John,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe from
the
>>>>
>>>>>>> application
>>>>>>> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number of
>>>>>>> crashes.
>>>>>>> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp driver.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when nothing
else
>>>>>
>>>>>>> seems
>>>>>>> to.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chuck
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a fresh
>>>>>>>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's just
>>
>>>>>>>>stupid!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>John
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files
>>>>>>>>> Directory,
>>>>>or
>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Deej
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and put
it
>> in
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> root
>>>>>>>>> c:\
>>>>>>>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by quitting or
>>>>>>>>>> cahnging
>>>>>>>>>> projects.
>>>>>>>>>> Now solid !!
>>>>>>>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered reading

>>>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>so
>>>>>>>>> decided
>>>>>>>>>> to try so voila !
>>>>>>>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets better
>>>>>>>>> priority
>>>>>>>>>> ,don't know....
>>>>>>>>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>>>>>>>>> Try this.
>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or where
>> ever
>>>>>>> I've
>>>>>>>>>> got
>>>>>>>>>>> it ;-)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read it.
>>>>>>>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects that
>> may
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> lead
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY you
emu
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> folder
>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>>> c root.
>>>>>>>>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this could
>>>> make
>>>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>> difference !!
>>>>>>>>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>>>>>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>Thanks Don. Very cool.

Tony

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:453a977d$1@linux...
> http://www.recordproduction.com/jason-miles.html
>Hi,
I bought and waiting for a mytel digital clock device that can output 6+2
WORDCLOCK OUTS and a AES/EBU clock out.
The question is what would you do if you had 10 devices to hookup ?
Please don't tell me to buy a distributor for a couple of more destinations.
Regards,
DimitrioaPull the daughterboard off and clean the contacts with a nice de-oxit
type cleaner.

JOhn

TC wrote:
> It could be that your daughtercard has gone south.
> I had a card with a bad daughtercard, and it would make weird noises
> when trying to use the effects.
>
> If it passes audio otherwise, I would guess that to be the problem.
>
> Cheers,
>
> TC
>
> Spappy wrote:
>> It was a really wierd problem. But I replaced EDS card and problem
>> went away. Still trying to figure out what the deal is on that.
>>
>> Spappy
>>
>>
>>
>> "Jeff hoover" <jkhoover@excite.com> wrote in message
>> news:453c541b@linux...
>>> Spappy,
>>>
>>> Don't know if this applies, but I had a similar effect pulling up
>>> projects that hadn't been saved since I added a word clock. If this
>>> could apply, double check your clock and sample rate settings.
>>>
>>> Hope this helps,
>>>
>>> Jeff
>>>
>>> Spappy wrote:
>>>> When I load a project that was originally started on a different
>>>> Paris system, it seems to get this pulsating feedback loop going on
>>>> whichever effect is on Aux 1. I have tried removing the effect and
>>>> it stops, but even if I assign the same effect to another aux (like
>>>> aux 3 for instance) it still does it. So it seems to be corrupting
>>>> the effect. Doesn't matter which effect it is.
>>>>
>>>> How can I fix this?
>>>>
>>>> Spappy
>>
>>Here's the problem I see happening...you're not going to want to part with
those UAD cards

And that'll mean.....

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453ccf13@linux...
> Uncle Ricky, his will actually be much *simpler* than what I'm doing now.
> MUCH simpler (well, at least, at first.....;o)
>
> ;o)
>
> "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:m80pj29e48oh6kg3glt9lnj26agjtqgqfr@4ax.com...
>> now my stomach hurts...
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:34 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>>
>> >I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can
>> >clock
>> >these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were only
> two
>> >of these available in North America and since these are rare and
> apparently
>> >abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi I/O,
>> >the
>> >other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie
> allows
>> >the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes an
>> >unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card has 7
>> >x
>> >SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of
> third
>> >party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
>> >think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32 I/O
> of
>> >the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT modules
>> >across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)* DSP
> based
>> >processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and
> hardware
>> >DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some analog
>> >interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX along
>> >with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
>> >everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far into
> it.
>> >I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've
>> >ever
>> >wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I never
> use
>> >midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX. I
> just
>> >hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't expect
>> >them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of vibe.
>> >
>> >Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an AES
> to
>> >ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4 x
> Paris
>> >submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME box,
>> >chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and
> returning
>> >the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs to
>> >complete the loop.
>> >
>> >If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and UAD-1
> cards
>> >outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
>> >
>> >Deej
>> >
>>
>
>Anyone selling or part trading a mytek 48 khz version converter ?
As a matter of fact any very good only converter that does only 44.1/48khz
might do.
Regards,
DimitriosDimitrios,

What model is it?

Deej

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453d049c$1@linux...
>
> Anyone selling or part trading a mytek 48 khz version converter ?
> As a matter of fact any very good only converter that does only 44.1/48khz
> might do.
> Regards,
> DimitriosThat's going to be a tough one all right.

"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:453d02d8@linux...
> Here's the problem I see happening...you're not going to want to part with
> those UAD cards
>
> And that'll mean.....
>
>
> "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453ccf13@linux...
> > Uncle Ricky, his will actually be much *simpler* than what I'm doing
now.
> > MUCH simpler (well, at least, at first.....;o)
> >
> > ;o)
> >
> > "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:m80pj29e48oh6kg3glt9lnj26agjtqgqfr@4ax.com...
> >> now my stomach hurts...
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:34 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> >I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can
> >> >clock
> >> >these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were only
> > two
> >> >of these available in North America and since these are rare and
> > apparently
> >> >abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi I/O,
> >> >the
> >> >other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie
> > allows
> >> >the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes an
> >> >unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card has
7
> >> >x
> >> >SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of
> > third
> >> >party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
> >> >think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32
I/O
> > of
> >> >the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT
modules
> >> >across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)* DSP
> > based
> >> >processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and
> > hardware
> >> >DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some analog
> >> >interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX
along
> >> >with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
> >> >everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far
into
> > it.
> >> >I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've
> >> >ever
> >> >wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I never
> > use
> >> >midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX. I
> > just
> >> >hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't
expect
> >> >them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of
vibe.
> >> >
> >> >Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an
AES
> > to
> >> >ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4 x
> > Paris
> >> >submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME
box,
> >> >chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and
> > returning
> >> >the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs
to
> >> >complete the loop.
> >> >
> >> >If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and UAD-1
> > cards
> >> >outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
> >> >
> >> >Deej
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
>
>........and in fact, I've already figured out a way to use at least two of
them in this new rig, at least on the Paris mix bus once I've got all my
fader automation done.

;o)

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453d07b6$1@linux...
> That's going to be a tough one all right.
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:453d02d8@linux...
> > Here's the problem I see happening...you're not going to want to part
with
> > those UAD cards
> >
> > And that'll mean.....
> >
> >
> > "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453ccf13@linux...
> > > Uncle Ricky, his will actually be much *simpler* than what I'm doing
> now.
> > > MUCH simpler (well, at least, at first.....;o)
> > >
> > > ;o)
> > >
> > > "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:m80pj29e48oh6kg3glt9lnj26agjtqgqfr@4ax.com...
> > >> now my stomach hurts...
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:34 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> >I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can
> > >> >clock
> > >> >these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were
only
> > > two
> > >> >of these available in North America and since these are rare and
> > > apparently
> > >> >abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi
I/O,
> > >> >the
> > >> >other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie
> > > allows
> > >> >the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes
an
> > >> >unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card
has
> 7
> > >> >x
> > >> >SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of
> > > third
> > >> >party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
> > >> >think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32
> I/O
> > > of
> > >> >the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT
> modules
> > >> >across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)*
DSP
> > > based
> > >> >processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and
> > > hardware
> > >> >DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some
analog
> > >> >interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX
> along
> > >> >with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
> > >> >everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far
> into
> > > it.
> > >> >I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've
> > >> >ever
> > >> >wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I
never
> > > use
> > >> >midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX.
I
> > > just
> > >> >hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't
> expect
> > >> >them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of
> vibe.
> > >> >
> > >> >Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an
> AES
> > > to
> > >> >ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4
x
> > > Paris
> > >> >submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME
> box,
> > >> >chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and
> > > returning
> > >> >the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs
> to
> > >> >complete the loop.
> > >> >
> > >> >If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and
UAD-1
> > > cards
> > >> >outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
> > >> >
> > >> >Deej
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>What about routing every track to a group bus, i.e. a default project with
32 audio tracks, 16 f/x tracks, 16 instrument tracks, and 64 group tracks.
Then the groups are knocked down -22 db and then get routed to a) more groups
or b) the master. And the gain is made up at the master.

Even if this is cumbersome, is it 'sonically' correct?

TCB

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>I would need a post fader, post meter insert.
>
>Chuck
>
>Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>BTW - Nuendo/Cubase meters can be pre and post fader.
>>
>>Dedric
>>
>>On 10/22/06 6:35 PM, in article 453c0e59$1@linux, "Neil" <OIUOI@OI.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> <bump>
>>> Chuck did you see this (below), would this work?
>>>
>>> Neil
>>>
>>> "Neil" <IUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> OK, then how about this... (and I don't even know if this is
>>>> possible, as I'm no codehead, but...) can you make part of that
>>>> plugin's GUI package a separate meter that overlays the Cubase
>>>> channel meter, permanently/constantly, when that plugin is
>>>> installed & that particular view for the channel is selected? If
>>>> so, then you can make that meter read 22 db higher than the
>>>> actual Cubase meter and voila'!
>>>>
>>>> And make it that nice pretty Paris gold color, too, so that
>>>> when they just look at the channel itself they'll know if that
>>>> plugin is inserted without having to go to the "inserts" menu.
>>>>
>>>> Neil
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Neil,
>>>>>
>>>>> AFAIK the meters are driven by directly reading samples from the buffer.
>>>>> I don't know how to drive the channel meters any other way.
>>>>>
>>>>> Chuck
>>>>>
>>>>> "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert
>effect
>>>>>>> to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't believe there is, Chuck - I just checked to make sure &
>>>>>> I couldn't find a way to do it. Is there any way to enter a
>>>>>> prompt line in the plugin code to show the metering as being
>>>>>> higher than the actual level?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Neil
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>Hi Dimitrios,

I've got it working for one track. I'm trying to get a few more tracks going, but it's super sketchy even with the one.

What should the buffer setting be in Paris? I've got it cranked right now.

Maybe my Paris PC is underpowered for this, it's an AMD 1.24 Ghz processor..

Cheers,

TC

Dimitrios wrote:
> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>> Hi,
>> Brandon and whoever is interested.
>> To use wormhole is dead easy !!
>> I tried it after some good months in a few minutes really great working.
>>
>> First I use wormhole in cubase where it is in start mode giving a name like
>> track1
>> Now on Paris I open wormhole (wrapped from FXpansion 3.3) and I put an EMPTY
>> 24bit file (although 16 bit could work too but why not have full 24 bits
>> at least ?)
>> I made this file with wavelab recording silence and copying mulytiole silent
>> segments until I got a 5 minute 24 bit empty file.
>> PARIS MUST PLAY in order to receive the audio from Cubase.
>> In wormhole in Paris you choose from the 'chooser" the track1-end
>> where in cubase it is track1-start
>> I don't know why you are not getting any results ?
>> Oh one thing is PARIS UNDER XP ??? because I think Me or win98 does not
> work
>> with wormhole,if I remember correctly !
>> ALSO
>> Do not use wormhole to send to cubase and then back
>> In order to wormhole right you have tochoose alatency around 10.000 which
>> is big latency so no easy compensation.
>> What I SUGGEST is:
>> Use any great vst/dx sequncer like Cubase,Nuendo,Samplitude ,DP, Sawstudio,
>> or whatever and process natively there without moving the faders in there,
>> leave them at 0 !!!
>> Then with wormhole send as much as 24 audio tracks (Pentium 4 2.6ghz with
>> Paris) in Paris for summong and EDS effects only.
>> Native effects do not work under Paris this way and why should ??
>> Thats the best way to use Paris !
>> Note wormhgole is sending 32bit floating so Paris truncates to 24 bit integer
>> (I guess) so better than adat interfacing !
>> Works SAMPLE ACCURATE if you ONLY wrap it with FXpansion 3.3 , and I mean
>> ONLY !!
>> No other wrapper , standalone, can achieve sync !!
>> It is fine with me.
>> Ther will be a delay in hearing Paris wormhole tracks after you press play
>> on Cubase , remember 10000 samples but anyway so what...
>> If you wanna use Paris transport use ,idi synchronization, MTC so each time
>> you pusah play on Paris cubase follows.
>> Amother tip is to have paris in LOOP mode for say 4 bars so it will always
>> play the wormholed tracks no matter when you push play in Cubase.
>> SEPARATE machines !
>> No luck on same computer.
>> Regards,
>> Dimitriuos
>Don't know !
Have read that there was even a 20 bit mytek so I guess something might be
out there.
Really don't have a clew.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>Dimitrios,
>
>What model is it?
>
>Deej
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453d049c$1@linux...
>>
>> Anyone selling or part trading a mytek 48 khz version converter ?
>> As a matter of fact any very good only converter that does only 44.1/48khz
>> might do.
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>
>Put the buffer slider on Paris way beyond 4000 samples until it stops crackling.
Will work.
Regards,
Dimitrios

TC <tc@spammetodeathyoubastards.org> wrote:
>Hi Dimitrios,
>
>I've got it working for one track. I'm trying to get a few more tracks
going, but it's
>super sketchy even with the one.
>
>What should the buffer setting be in Paris? I've got it cranked right now.
>
>Maybe my Paris PC is underpowered for this, it's an AMD 1.24 Ghz processor..
>
>Cheers,
>
>TC
>
>
>
>Dimitrios wrote:
>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> Brandon and whoever is interested.
>>> To use wormhole is dead easy !!
>>> I tried it after some good months in a few minutes really great working.
>>>
>>> First I use wormhole in cubase where it is in start mode giving a name
like
>>> track1
>>> Now on Paris I open wormhole (wrapped from FXpansion 3.3) and I put an
EMPTY
>>> 24bit file (although 16 bit could work too but why not have full 24 bits
>>> at least ?)
>>> I made this file with wavelab recording silence and copying mulytiole
silent
>>> segments until I got a 5 minute 24 bit empty file.
>>> PARIS MUST PLAY in order to receive the audio from Cubase.
>>> In wormhole in Paris you choose from the 'chooser" the track1-end
>>> where in cubase it is track1-start
>>> I don't know why you are not getting any results ?
>>> Oh one thing is PARIS UNDER XP ??? because I think Me or win98 does not
>> work
>>> with wormhole,if I remember correctly !
>>> ALSO
>>> Do not use wormhole to send to cubase and then back
>>> In order to wormhole right you have tochoose alatency around 10.000 which
>>> is big latency so no easy compensation.
>>> What I SUGGEST is:
>>> Use any great vst/dx sequncer like Cubase,Nuendo,Samplitude ,DP, Sawstudio,
>>> or whatever and process natively there without moving the faders in there,
>>> leave them at 0 !!!
>>> Then with wormhole send as much as 24 audio tracks (Pentium 4 2.6ghz
with
>>> Paris) in Paris for summong and EDS effects only.
>>> Native effects do not work under Paris this way and why should ??
>>> Thats the best way to use Paris !
>>> Note wormhgole is sending 32bit floating so Paris truncates to 24 bit
integer
>>> (I guess) so better than adat interfacing !
>>> Works SAMPLE ACCURATE if you ONLY wrap it with FXpansion 3.3 , and I
mean
>>> ONLY !!
>>> No other wrapper , standalone, can achieve sync !!
>>> It is fine with me.
>>> Ther will be a delay in hearing Paris wormhole tracks after you press
play
>>> on Cubase , remember 10000 samples but anyway so what...
>>> If you wanna use Paris transport use ,idi synchronization, MTC so each
time
>>> you pusah play on Paris cubase follows.
>>> Amother tip is to have paris in LOOP mode for say 4 bars so it will always
>>> play the wormholed tracks no matter when you push play in Cubase.
>>> SEPARATE machines !
>>> No luck on same computer.
>>> Regards,
>>> Dimitriuos
>>"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in news:45302ae1@linux:

> I've been looping 16 tracks in and out of this app with *lots* of
> UAD-1 plugins inserted and I've been looping tracks being played back
> on two different submixes. This is suicide in Cubase SX when
> configured in the same way. Screen freeze guaranteed within 15
> seconds. This loop has been going for over 10 minutes without a
> glitch. LaMont my friend. I think you pointed us all in a very good
> direction.
>
> I doubt if I'll be spending any more money on Cubase SX upgrades
> unless I get more demand for 96k projects.
>
>
>

If I may, I'd like to ask a (possibly) dumb question. What are the
practical uses of this setup for Paris users with limited I/O and no UAD
cards?

Perhaps the better question is, what is this all for? Is it only for UAD
plug comp? Or is there a bigger payoff? You mentioned drum bussing /
subgrouping, which to me would rock. Is that sort of thing possible?

-scott v.For all you who deal with live sound.

this is pretty cool.

http://www.optogate.com

DCAn old friend of mine was working on something like this for the
touring industry about 15 years ago using security floor pressure pads.

This is way more elegant though, thanks for the link.

David.

DC wrote:
> For all you who deal with live sound.
>
> this is pretty cool.
>
> http://www.optogate.com
>
> DCGreat idea! Who sells them in the USA?

Cheers,
-Jamie
http://www.JamieKrutz.com]

EK Sound wrote:
> An old friend of mine was working on something like this for the touring
> industry about 15 years ago using security floor pressure pads.
>
> This is way more elegant though, thanks for the link.
>
> David.
>
> DC wrote:
>> For all you who deal with live sound.
>>
>> this is pretty cool.
>>
>> http://www.optogate.com
>>
>> DCI've been using the last dual processor 1.25 gHz G4 to run OS 9 for a few
years now w/ no problems. It's nice having the dual processors when I use
OS X apps like DP, PT or Peak.

Gantt

"Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>I'm using a dual 1GHz G4 Quicksilver, but PARIS doesn't take advantage of

>the extra processor. Be careful of the very last OS 9 G4, I think it was
a
>1.25 GHz as someone here had major problems using it with PARIS (Rick?).
I
>think they early 1.25GHz were ok.
>
>Tony
>
>
>"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:4539a168$1@linux...
>>
>> So what's the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not

>> classic
>> of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867
Mhz
>> machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to indicate
>> that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn't specify

>> whether
>> it's classic or not.
>>
>> Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an
>> accelerator
>> (say, Sonnet)?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Dale
>
>The US rep could be more responsive, but he sounds like a one-man
shop. the only downside is they are about 270.00 at retail
without a lot of margin.

Besides, we need one that works in reverse, to put on all the crappy
backup singers..

heh

They step up to the mic and.. silence! Better yet, use it to trigger
a sample of, oh I don't know, maybe someone who can actually
SING?

DC

EK Sound <askme@nospam.com> wrote:
>An old friend of mine was working on something like this for the
>touring industry about 15 years ago using security floor pressure pads.
>
>This is way more elegant though, thanks for the link.
>
>David.
>
>DC wrote:
>> For all you who deal with live sound.
>>
>> this is pretty cool.
>>
>> http://www.optogate.com
>>
>> DCHeh, that'd put a lot of "singers" out of work. :^)

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com

DC wrote:
> The US rep could be more responsive, but he sounds like a one-man
> shop. the only downside is they are about 270.00 at retail
> without a lot of margin.
>
> Besides, we need one that works in reverse, to put on all the crappy
> backup singers..
>
> heh
>
> They step up to the mic and.. silence! Better yet, use it to trigger
> a sample of, oh I don't know, maybe someone who can actually
> SING?
>
> DC
>
>
> EK Sound <askme@nospam.com> wrote:
>> An old friend of mine was working on something like this for the
>> touring industry about 15 years ago using security floor pressure pads.
>>
>> This is way more elegant though, thanks for the link.
>>
>> David.
>>
>> DC wrote:
>>> For all you who deal with live sound.
>>>
>>> this is pretty cool.
>>>
>>> http://www.optogate.com
>>>
>>> DC
>I'm not sure exactly which model it was, but I remember Rick posting about
an incompatibility problem with the G4 he bought and PARIS. I don't think he
could ever get PARIS to run on that machine.

Tony

"Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:453d29cb$1@linux...
>
> I've been using the last dual processor 1.25 gHz G4 to run OS 9 for a few
> years now w/ no problems. It's nice having the dual processors when I use
> OS X apps like DP, PT or Peak.
>
> Gantt
>
> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>>I'm using a dual 1GHz G4 Quicksilver, but PARIS doesn't take advantage of
>
>>the extra processor. Be careful of the very last OS 9 G4, I think it was
> a
>>1.25 GHz as someone here had major problems using it with PARIS (Rick?).
> I
>>think they early 1.25GHz were ok.
>>
>>Tony
>>
>>
>>"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>news:4539a168$1@linux...
>>>
>>> So what's the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not
>
>>> classic
>>> of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867
> Mhz
>>> machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to
>>> indicate
>>> that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn't specify
>
>>> whether
>>> it's classic or not.
>>>
>>> Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an
>>> accelerator
>>> (say, Sonnet)?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Dale
>>
>>
>The Monster rig...

Lives and grows

heehehehehehehe

Don

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453d0895@linux...
> .......and in fact, I've already figured out a way to use at least two of
> them in this new rig, at least on the Paris mix bus once I've got all my
> fader automation done.
>
> ;o)
>
> "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453d07b6$1@linux...
>> That's going to be a tough one all right.
>>
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:453d02d8@linux...
>> > Here's the problem I see happening...you're not going to want to part
> with
>> > those UAD cards
>> >
>> > And that'll mean.....
>> >
>> >
>> > "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453ccf13@linux...
>> > > Uncle Ricky, his will actually be much *simpler* than what I'm doing
>> now.
>> > > MUCH simpler (well, at least, at first.....;o)
>> > >
>> > > ;o)
>> > >
>> > > "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> > > news:m80pj29e48oh6kg3glt9lnj26agjtqgqfr@4ax.com...
>> > >> now my stomach hurts...
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:34 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> >I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can
>> > >> >clock
>> > >> >these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were
> only
>> > > two
>> > >> >of these available in North America and since these are rare and
>> > > apparently
>> > >> >abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi
> I/O,
>> > >> >the
>> > >> >other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink
>> > >> >thingie
>> > > allows
>> > >> >the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes
> an
>> > >> >unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card
> has
>> 7
>> > >> >x
>> > >> >SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot
>> > >> >of
>> > > third
>> > >> >party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
>> > >> >think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the
>> > >> >32
>> I/O
>> > > of
>> > >> >the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT
>> modules
>> > >> >across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)*
> DSP
>> > > based
>> > >> >processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and
>> > > hardware
>> > >> >DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some
> analog
>> > >> >interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX
>> along
>> > >> >with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
>> > >> >everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far
>> into
>> > > it.
>> > >> >I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all
>> > >> >I've
>> > >> >ever
>> > >> >wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I
> never
>> > > use
>> > >> >midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase
>> > >> >SX.
> I
>> > > just
>> > >> >hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't
>> expect
>> > >> >them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of
>> vibe.
>> > >> >
>> > >> >Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an
>> AES
>> > > to
>> > >> >ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the
>> > >> >4
> x
>> > > Paris
>> > >> >submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME
>> box,
>> > >> >chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and
>> > > returning
>> > >> >the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware
>> > >> >reverbs
>> to
>> > >> >complete the loop.
>> > >> >
>> > >> >If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and
> UAD-1
>> > > cards
>> > >> >outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
>> > >> >
>> > >> >Deej
>> > >> >
>> > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>Hi Dale,

A good friend of mine has his G4 on eBay starting today. He's meticulous
about his equipment so you can be assured that it's in excellent condition.
Here's the link if you're interested:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=29004 2688421

Have a great day!

Mark

"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>So what�s the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not classic
>of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867 Mhz
>machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to indicate
>that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn�t specify whether
>it�s classic or not.
>
>Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an accelerator
>(say, Sonnet)?
>
>Thanks,
>DaleHey Tony! It was the 2003 G4 Firewire 800 1.42 GHz machine that was bad.
How ever a lot of people still run that machine in studios with no problems.
As they say YMMV!

James

"Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>I'm not sure exactly which model it was, but I remember Rick posting about

>an incompatibility problem with the G4 he bought and PARIS. I don't think
he
>could ever get PARIS to run on that machine.
>
>Tony
>
>
>"Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net> wrote in message
>news:453d29cb$1@linux...
>>
>> I've been using the last dual processor 1.25 gHz G4 to run OS 9 for a
few
>> years now w/ no problems. It's nice having the dual processors when I
use
>> OS X apps like DP, PT or Peak.
>>
>> Gantt
>>
>> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>>>I'm using a dual 1GHz G4 Quicksilver, but PARIS doesn't take advantage
of
>>
>>>the extra processor. Be careful of the very last OS 9 G4, I think it was
>> a
>>>1.25 GHz as someone here had major problems using it with PARIS (Rick?).
>> I
>>>think they early 1.25GHz were ok.
>>>
>>>Tony
>>>
>>>
>>>"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>news:4539a168$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> So what's the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not
>>
>>>> classic
>>>> of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867
>> Mhz
>>>> machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to
>>>> indicate
>>>> that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn't specify
>>
>>>> whether
>>>> it's classic or not.
>>>>
>>>> Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an
>>>> accelerator
>>>> (say, Sonnet)?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Dale
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>I'm not saying it's a bad machine, just maybe not so good with PARIS.

Tony

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:453d38da$1@linux...
>
> Hey Tony! It was the 2003 G4 Firewire 800 1.42 GHz machine that was bad.
> How ever a lot of people still run that machine in studios with no
> problems.
> As they say YMMV!
>
> James
>
> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>>I'm not sure exactly which model it was, but I remember Rick posting about
>
>>an incompatibility problem with the G4 he bought and PARIS. I don't think
> he
>>could ever get PARIS to run on that machine.
>>
>>Tony
>>
>>
>>"Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net> wrote in message
>>news:453d29cb$1@linux...
>>>
>>> I've been using the last dual processor 1.25 gHz G4 to run OS 9 for a
> few
>>> years now w/ no problems. It's nice having the dual processors when I
> use
>>> OS X apps like DP, PT or Peak.
>>>
>>> Gantt
>>>
>>> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>>>>I'm using a dual 1GHz G4 Quicksilver, but PARIS doesn't take advantage
> of
>>>
>>>>the extra processor. Be careful of the very last OS 9 G4, I think it was
>>> a
>>>>1.25 GHz as someone here had major problems using it with PARIS (Rick?).
>>> I
>>>>think they early 1.25GHz were ok.
>>>>
>>>>Tony
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:4539a168$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> So what's the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9 not
>>>
>>>>> classic
>>>>> of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867
>>> Mhz
>>>>> machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to
>>>>> indicate
>>>>> that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn't specify
>>>
>>>>> whether
>>>>> it's classic or not.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an
>>>>> accelerator
>>>>> (say, Sonnet)?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Dale
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>Hey Tony! It was the 2003 G4 Firewire 800 1.42 GHz machine that was bad.
> How ever a lot of people still run that machine in studios with no problems.
> As they say YMMV!
>
>James
>
That was the only G4 tower that would not run Mac OS 9.

>"Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>>I'm not sure exactly which model it was, but I remember Rick posting about
>
>>an incompatibility problem with the G4 he bought and PARIS. I don't think
>he
>>could ever get PARIS to run on that machine.
>>
>>Tony
>>
>>
>>"Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net> wrote in message
>>news:453d29cb$1@linux...
>>>
>>> I've been using the last dual processor 1.25 gHz G4 to run OS 9 for a
>few
>>> years now w/ no problems. It's nice having the dual processors when
I
>use
>>> OS X apps like DP, PT or Peak.
>>>
>>> Gantt
>>>
>>> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>>>>I'm using a dual 1GHz G4 Quicksilver, but PARIS doesn't take advantage
>of
>>>
>>>>the extra processor. Be careful of the very last OS 9 G4, I think it
was
>>> a
>>>>1.25 GHz as someone here had major problems using it with PARIS (Rick?).
>>> I
>>>>think they early 1.25GHz were ok.
>>>>
>>>>Tony
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Dale" <dalebradleycello@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:4539a168$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> So what's the best Mac out there that will run Paris (and System 9
not
>>>
>>>>> classic
>>>>> of course)? I think people here have reported it to be one of the 867
>>> Mhz
>>>>> machines (not sure which one exactly), but lowendmac.com seems to
>>>>> indicate
>>>>> that 9.2 will run on up to a 1.25G machine, though it doesn't specify
>>>
>>>>> whether
>>>>> it's classic or not.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also, does it make sense to consider a fast-bus G4 coupled with an
>>>>> accelerator
>>>>> (say, Sonnet)?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Dale
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>"Carl Amburn" <carlamburn@hotNOSPAMmail.com> wrote in
news:4535d27f$1@linux:

> Ok - so after some research, I've got the jest of it...... anyone
> using Paris ASIO successfully? I'm running a 4 card rig with MEC's +.
> Wondering if anyone's able to use the Paris hardware with Cubase or
> Nuendo or whatever else.
>
> tia, again,
> -Carl

I've only tried running Samp 9 through ASIO into Paris. It gave me an error
saying I had too many cards (3). My take on it is that you can only have
one Paris card, and the other gotcha is that if you have an MEC interface,
only the built in 4in 4out is usable. All other I/O is useless with ASIO.

YMMV
-scott v.Hi Thad,

This might do it. I wasn't really looking for sonic correctness, just testing
a theory that people who like the paris sound, could get a more 'paris like'
mix, by making the native app do the *only* major difference I can spot in
the paris code.

Chuck

"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>What about routing every track to a group bus, i.e. a default project with
>32 audio tracks, 16 f/x tracks, 16 instrument tracks, and 64 group tracks.
>Then the groups are knocked down -22 db and then get routed to a) more groups
>or b) the master. And the gain is made up at the master.
>
>Even if this is cumbersome, is it 'sonically' correct?
>
>TCB
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>I would need a post fader, post meter insert.
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>>BTW - Nuendo/Cubase meters can be pre and post fader.
>>>
>>>Dedric
>>>
>>>On 10/22/06 6:35 PM, in article 453c0e59$1@linux, "Neil" <OIUOI@OI.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> <bump>
>>>> Chuck did you see this (below), would this work?
>>>>
>>>> Neil
>>>>
>>>> "Neil" <IUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> OK, then how about this... (and I don't even know if this is
>>>>> possible, as I'm no codehead, but...) can you make part of that
>>>>> plugin's GUI package a separate meter that overlays the Cubase
>>>>> channel meter, permanently/constantly, when that plugin is
>>>>> installed & that particular view for the channel is selected? If
>>>>> so, then you can make that meter read 22 db higher than the
>>>>> actual Cubase meter and voila'!
>>>>>
>>>>> And make it that nice pretty Paris gold color, too, so that
>>>>> when they just look at the channel itself they'll know if that
>>>>> plugin is inserted without having to go to the "inserts" menu.
>>>>>
>>>>> Neil
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Neil,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> AFAIK the meters are driven by directly reading samples from the buffer.
>>>>>> I don't know how to drive the channel meters any other way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chuck
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> duh duh duh, Thad (or anyone else) is there a way to set an insert
>>effect
>>>>>>>> to post fader, post meter in cubase?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't believe there is, Chuck - I just checked to make sure &
>>>>>>> I couldn't find a way to do it. Is there any way to enter a
>>>>>>> prompt line in the plugin code to show the metering as being
>>>>>>> higher than the actual level?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Neil
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>I don't think the paris asio driver is viable in multi card, multi interface
setups. If you have a single card, single mec setup then it would probably
work reliably to monitor the outputs of a mastering app, but only then through
the default mec outputs.

Chuck

volthause <volthause-nospam-@soldrocks-nospam-.com> wrote:
>"Carl Amburn" <carlamburn@hotNOSPAMmail.com> wrote in
>news:4535d27f$1@linux:
>
>> Ok - so after some research, I've got the jest of it...... anyone
>> using Paris ASIO successfully? I'm running a 4 card rig with MEC's +.
>> Wondering if anyone's able to use the Paris hardware with Cubase or
>> Nuendo or whatever else.
>>
>> tia, again,
>> -Carl
>
>I've only tried running Samp 9 through ASIO into Paris. It gave me an error

>saying I had too many cards (3). My take on it is that you can only have

>one Paris card, and the other gotcha is that if you have an MEC interface,

>only the built in 4in 4out is usable. All other I/O is useless with ASIO.
>
>YMMV
>-scott v.DJ,

Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to focus
on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.

It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird, proprietary
dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just doesn't
make sense to me.

If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.

ChuckOK Chuck,

I'll bite. I'll have a native system here irregardless of what audio card
I'm using. I don't plan to sell of anything until I'm convinced that the
Scope cards are the ticket for me. Right now I'm in the middle of recabling
the studio, but it will be pretty simple for me to configure it so that I
can just restore a Ghost image, reconfigure the digital connects and pop in
the Magma PCI cards, and I'm back to the RME/UAD-1 rig that I've been
running. I have always intended to keep this viable for a while. The only
major change I'll be making is the mobo on both rigs. In the near future,
both the Paris system and the Native system will be running on Gigabyte
GA-K8NS Ultra 939 mobos, but in the meantime, what I've got now is working.
Believe me, I would dearly love to get a native system sounding like Paris
and I'll gladly help you beta whatever plugin you might develop or jump
through some experimental hoops, and I'm sure Neil, Dedric, Gene, Dave,
LaMont will have great suggestions since they are much further along in
native world than I am........but I'm also going to be getting another wierd
proprietary DAW happening......the stuff is already on the way here.

;o)

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453d565a$1@linux...
>
> DJ,
>
> Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
focus
> on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>
> It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
proprietary
> dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
> Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
doesn't
> make sense to me.
>
> If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
> ChuckWith all due respect Chuck, screw that noise, I'm all for weird oddball DSP systems..

It's worth it because it sounds good and is dead easy to mix in. And.. that makes it fun.

Besides, DJ's endeavors make for damn fine entertainment..

Go DJ.

Cheers,

TC

chuck duffy wrote:
> DJ,
>
> Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to focus
> on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>
> It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird, proprietary
> dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
> Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just doesn't
> make sense to me.
>
> If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
> ChuckYESSSSSSSSSSS

Go Chuck!!!

oh wait I thought the thread was going to be about politics.

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453d565a$1@linux...
>
> DJ,
>
> Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
> focus
> on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>
> It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
> proprietary
> dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
> Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
> doesn't
> make sense to me.
>
> If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
> ChuckNo way man. ID Software would not let that happen.

"Mikep" <mikep@4hometown.com> wrote in message news:45394c41$1@linux...
>
> I own the software, but I was just wondering if it has ever been cracked
> so
> that you don't have to enter the challenge/response codes?HI DJ,
The Scope will do the trick if:
1. It works with your chipset and motherboard. (It will probably work
better on your old system.)
2. You want to use it's internal effects and synths only.
3. It can run at very low latencies like the RME and Lynx cards can
under the same CPU load for all the of the Native VSTi and effects you have.

If it it doesn't do well for any of the above extremely well then there
is no benefit to it at all Personally I think purely native is the way
to go with the UADs being used during the mixing stages when latency
isn't as important.

FYI-
Here is a benchmark I just did today with the new single socket Quad
Core Intel CPU i.e.. 4 cpus on one chip. A 48k buffer on the the
Fireface is approx 2ms. With a Multiface I think the 64k buffer is 1.5ms.

system-
N3
thonex test
975 chipset mobo
Quad core 2.66
RME Fireface latest non-beta

48k buffer @ 40% cpu load absolutely clean. At 64k it was 31%. We
haven't seen any machine to date be able to play back this Thonex test
at a 48k buffer totally clean.

64k buffer is the lowest any systems have been able to go at these CPU
loads.
Core2 Duo 2.66 - 58%
Dual core Opteron 2.6 - 58%
AMD FX60 - 73%
AMD X2 4400 - 70%
Dual Core "Wood crest" Xeon 2.0 gig - 53%
P4 955 3.4g - 76%

DJ wrote:

>OK Chuck,
>
>I'll bite. I'll have a native system here irregardless of what audio card
>I'm using. I don't plan to sell of anything until I'm convinced that the
>Scope cards are the ticket for me. Right now I'm in the middle of recabling
>the studio, but it will be pretty simple for me to configure it so that I
>can just restore a Ghost image, reconfigure the digital connects and pop in
>the Magma PCI cards, and I'm back to the RME/UAD-1 rig that I've been
>running. I have always intended to keep this viable for a while. The only
>major change I'll be making is the mobo on both rigs. In the near future,
>both the Paris system and the Native system will be running on Gigabyte
>GA-K8NS Ultra 939 mobos, but in the meantime, what I've got now is working.
>Believe me, I would dearly love to get a native system sounding like Paris
>and I'll gladly help you beta whatever plugin you might develop or jump
>through some experimental hoops, and I'm sure Neil, Dedric, Gene, Dave,
>LaMont will have great suggestions since they are much further along in
>native world than I am........but I'm also going to be getting another wierd
>proprietary DAW happening......the stuff is already on the way here.
>
>;o)
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453d565a$1@linux...
>
>
>>DJ,
>>
>>Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
>>
>>
>focus
>
>
>>on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>>
>>It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
>>
>>
>proprietary
>
>
>>dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
>>Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
>>
>>
>doesn't
>
>
>>make sense to me.
>>
>>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
>> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>
>
>
>
>

--
Chris Ludwig
ADK
chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
(859) 635-5762Imho, mixing has as much to do with how the engineer approaches the tools,
and their past experience/expectations, as it does the tools, maybe more.
That isn't a negative in any way - just than I believe perspective and past
experience play a significant role in how one solves a "problem" (i.e. a mix
itself).

Some people love analog summing like Dangerous 2-buss, others don't. Some
get great mixes out of native DAWs, others don't. Some think Samplitude
sounds better than Nuendo. Others might think Logic sounds better, or not.
Same for DP, Sonar, Saw, ProTools, etc. It all just says there are more
opinions than DAWs.

Anyway, Chuck - thanks for posting that finding in Paris. That answers some
questions I've had over the years that never made sense under the assumed
"mystique" of Paris. Actually this bodes quite well for anyone who loves to
mix in Paris - taking a methodical approach to what this gain
reduction/addition really means would lead one to uncover the keys to mixing
in any native DAW.

Regards,
Dedric

On 10/23/06 5:55 PM, in article 453d565a$1@linux, "chuck duffy" <c@c.com>
wrote:

>
> DJ,
>
> Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to focus
> on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>
> It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
> proprietary
> dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
> Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just doesn't
> make sense to me.
>
> If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
> ChuckChris,

The way I intend to use it is with it's internal FX only. If that doesn't
float my boat, then I'm back to the native mix thing. I've been talking
quite a bit to Ali Fawaz, the Creamware rep for North America. He's an
interesting guy and very willing to be helpful in getting this going. He's
very negative about VIA chipsets, but not for any particular reason relaing
to driver compatibility. He says they are less efficient on PCI bus
throughput. I know that was a problem years ago but nowadays I don't know if
I buy that if a system is configured properly. I'll have a parallel rig
running the Gigabyte GA-K8Ns Ultra 939 with an 4800 x 2 CPU. and I'll be
testing both systems. I'm definitely on a mission here......stay with
RME/UAD and mix native or move to Scope as a standalone DSP processor for
Paris. I'm really comfortable mixing with UAD-1 plugins. It's going to take
some serious stuff from Creamware to change my mind......but it's worth the
effort to find out, IMO. I'm tired of chasing my tail.

Deej
"Chris Ludwig" <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote in message
news:453d6c61@linux...
> HI DJ,
> The Scope will do the trick if:
> 1. It works with your chipset and motherboard. (It will probably work
> better on your old system.)
> 2. You want to use it's internal effects and synths only.
> 3. It can run at very low latencies like the RME and Lynx cards can
> under the same CPU load for all the of the Native VSTi and effects you
have.
>
> If it it doesn't do well for any of the above extremely well then there
> is no benefit to it at all Personally I think purely native is the way
> to go with the UADs being used during the mixing stages when latency
> isn't as important.
>
>
> FYI-
> Here is a benchmark I just did today with the new single socket Quad
> Core Intel CPU i.e.. 4 cpus on one chip. A 48k buffer on the the
> Fireface is approx 2ms. With a Multiface I think the 64k buffer is 1.5ms.
>
> system-
> N3
> thonex test
> 975 chipset mobo
> Quad core 2.66
> RME Fireface latest non-beta
>
> 48k buffer @ 40% cpu load absolutely clean. At 64k it was 31%. We
> haven't seen any machine to date be able to play back this Thonex test
> at a 48k buffer totally clean.
>
>
> 64k buffer is the lowest any systems have been able to go at these CPU
> loads.
> Core2 Duo 2.66 - 58%
> Dual core Opteron 2.6 - 58%
> AMD FX60 - 73%
> AMD X2 4400 - 70%
> Dual Core "Wood crest" Xeon 2.0 gig - 53%
> P4 955 3.4g - 76%
>
> DJ wrote:
>
> >OK Chuck,
> >
> >I'll bite. I'll have a native system here irregardless of what audio card
> >I'm using. I don't plan to sell of anything until I'm convinced that the
> >Scope cards are the ticket for me. Right now I'm in the middle of
recabling
> >the studio, but it will be pretty simple for me to configure it so that I
> >can just restore a Ghost image, reconfigure the digital connects and pop
in
> >the Magma PCI cards, and I'm back to the RME/UAD-1 rig that I've been
> >running. I have always intended to keep this viable for a while. The only
> >major change I'll be making is the mobo on both rigs. In the near future,
> >both the Paris system and the Native system will be running on Gigabyte
> >GA-K8NS Ultra 939 mobos, but in the meantime, what I've got now is
working.
> >Believe me, I would dearly love to get a native system sounding like
Paris
> >and I'll gladly help you beta whatever plugin you might develop or jump
> >through some experimental hoops, and I'm sure Neil, Dedric, Gene, Dave,
> >LaMont will have great suggestions since they are much further along in
> >native world than I am........but I'm also going to be getting another
wierd
> >proprietary DAW happening......the stuff is already on the way here.
> >
> >;o)
> >
> >"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453d565a$1@linux...
> >
> >
> >>DJ,
> >>
> >>Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
> >>
> >>
> >focus
> >
> >
> >>on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
> >>
> >>It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
> >>
> >>
> >proprietary
> >
> >
> >>dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
> >>Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
> >>
> >>
> >doesn't
> >
> >
> >>make sense to me.
> >>
> >>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is
wrong.
> >> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
> >>
> >>Chuck
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Chris Ludwig
> ADK
> chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
> www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
> (859) 635-5762"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:

>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.

(Long, but thought-provoking, and hopefully helpful, rant
follows):

I think the thing that's wrong is that some people just can't
get their heads around the differences between analog & digital.
With analog, "big" = hotter, and so hotter is better. When you
overbias your tape machines & smack the hell out of the tape,
you're getting compression right off the bat on every track you
do that with, so one gets used to hearing most tracks with some
degree of tape compression already... and we all know that
compression can make things sound "bigger". Or, you use a
compressor on the way in to the tape so that you get a better
SNR, but since that's not an issue with digital (unless you're
recording at levels so low that you just simply get poor
resolution, but that's a slightly different scenario), people
quit using compressors on the way in to digital since SNR isn't
an issue there.... you also can't smack an AD convertor hard &
expect it to like it - unlike tape. So right off the bat we've
got a whole different set of dynamics action going on from one
world to the other - then, when you've already got that
compressed kick or bassline on tape, you compress it more, and
you're compressing an already-compressed signal, so when you
apply compression to your uncompressed kick on your DAW you're
thinking "nah, that CAN'T be right, it can't need THAT much
compression! I'd better back that off a bit!" (because you're
looking at the ratios & the threshhold, etc, instead of using
your ears). EQ reacts differently with digital, too... if you're
used to mixing on a console, you might be used to boosting or
cutting something by 3, 4, 6db & getting an audible
difference... with digital/plugin EQ's, sometimes you gotta
boost or cut HUGE swaths of that frequency to really make a
difference... why? I think it's a phase thing... you get more
phase shift with analog filters, and so the change is more
apparent at smaller degrees of boost & cut. That also helps to
isolate things to have their own place in the mix at the same
time... considering that phase is the reason we have two ears -
it's the thing that makes it possible for us to tell which
direction a sound is coming from - this makes perfect sense.

So, those of us (and I think that's "most of us here") who cut
our teeth in the analog world first, and are used to all the
things mentioned above - and who have not changed that style of
mixing - could be disappointed in Native systems - not because
they fall short of analog or Paris, but because they are
actually much more accurate (assuming good quality convertors)
& as a result do not impart certain types of coloration that we
might interpret as "pleasing". If you could go back to a great
mix you did on analog & a console & take out half of the amount
of dynamics processing & half of the amount of EQ'ing you did,
what would you get? A mix that sounded flatter & more colorless
& with less dimension than the one you ended up with. Want
proof? Here it is: If you didn't need the amount of EQ &
dynamics you applied, you wouldn't have done so! If half the
amounts/degrees of those things would have sufficed, that's
what you would have used! So Paris sounds & acts kinda like
analog, and people who like Paris like that aspect of it... how
do we know there's not a few lines of code in there somewhere
that adds graduated degrees of even-harmonic distortion when
you push the faders or saturate the mix buss to whatever
degree? I personally don't think it's strictly a DSP thing,
because let's face it.. a plugin is basically doing the same
thing to your mix whether it's running of a processor on it's
own card or off your CPU; the difference being how well a
particular VST or Direct-X compressor or reverb is written (and
what it's designed to do in terms of treating the sound) vs.
whatever DSP compressor or reverb plugin you're talking about.
Can I get an "Amen, brutha!" on that?

Chuck's nailed the Paris mix buss thing, it seems, with that
-22db at the channel & +22db at the mix buss, but WHY does that
make a difference? Well, here's why gang... it's just as I said
earlier in another thread - you've got to give yourself some
headroom, dammit! Paris apparently does this for you. Want to
prove me wrong? Open up a Paris mix and drag the mix buss
master fader down 22db from wherever you have it, then insert
any plugin that has an output level control on each individual
channel of that mix - if the plugin is a compressor, for
example, don't use any compression, just use the output
control - now boost every channel by 22db using that output
control... if it only goes up 10 db, then insert that plugin
twice in a row & max out the output on each insertion...
that'll be close enough... how's that sound? I'll bet it won't
sound all that good! Are you hearing that "overstuffed" mix
buss sound? Is it smaller, with less dimension? I'd be curious
to see what you guys think if you try this. Now that we know
what Chuck told us he discovered, this is the best way to see
if that makes a difference or not (my guess - it DOES make a
difference, otherwise, they wouldn't have written the code that
way!).

So how can you get "big" in Native? Give yourself what Paris
apparently already gives you... some headroom - think "clean",
then dirty it up if you have to later... hell, just mash the
mix with a comp & limiter or an L2 or something equivalent -
you'll get all the harmonic distortion you want. I wasn't
kidding the other day when I said: "Think zen when mixing in
Cubase" it's all gotta flow without clips, gang... think about
it... if you have one channel getting "overs" in a 32-bit float-
point system, you may not notice it... heck you can't notice
each sample in a given sound file can you? Of course not. But
if you start adding more channels, and each of those channels
is running hot... let's say 32 channels - as a comparison
for you guys running two-card paris systems & no native mixes.
and let's say you're running hot (over zero) about 25% of the
time on each channel - that's 352,000 errors PER SECOND across
the 32 tracks. That's a lot of floating-point math going on
there, isn't it? And in this scenario, I want you to think of
each error as a mistake, because that's what it is... in this
style of mixing, it's a mistake. How can you expect something
that's got 352,000 mistakes per second going on, to sound good?

Are you still not convinced? Then you should also definitely
investigate running stems (submixes) & reimporting. When I've
done this I definitely can hear a difference, and I suspect you
most likely will be able to as well.. it is NOT a huge
difference, but it's audible. In fact, some months ago I posted
a stems mix vs. a non-stems mix & a number of you said you
could hear a difference. Now, if you think "aww, this is just
another pain-in-the-ass procedure I have to go through if I mix
in Native", keep in mind that you can run 90 Million stems
mixes in the time it will take Deej to set up his first Pulsar
card, and another 900 million in the time that it takes Chuck
to research & write that plugin (OK, just giving hell to Deej
there, and no really no offense intended to Chucks coding
capability, but I'm just saying this is something you can do
RIGHT NOW, TONIGHT if you want to if you have a Native system,
without having to wait for anything new). Now, if you have a
small project - one acoustic guitar, piano, & a vocal - with
just a few tracks, running stems won't make a difference, but
if you have a large project, give it a shot... you may not hear
enough of a difference to make it worth doing in any given
instance, but then again, you might.

So, now that I hope I've made my case, here's my own personal
guidelines for Native mixing - try it out & see wat you think:

1.) Do NOT bring down your Master Fader. It stays at zero
(unless you're doing a fade).

2.) On your Master inserts, use a peakstop/brickwall limiter
set anywhere from -.03 to -3db, depending on how much headroom
you want to give your mastering engineer. Settings for volume
maximization & other parameters will, of course, depend on the
program material.

3.) Record at 24-bit 88.2k or higher (Dan Lavry has a white
paper that makes a good case for a 60k sample rate - in order
to get the ringing from the convertors' FIR filters out of the
top range of our hearing - but since there is no standard 60k
sample rate, 88.2 is the next one up). Also, 16-bit may have
worked with Paris for whatever reason (maybe it just enhanced
the harmonic distortion you're hearing?), but let's face it,
everybody knows that more bits = greater "truth", especially
when combined with higher resolutions.

4.) Default your individual channel settings to -6db or lower...
I find that -6 is a good place to start because you can load up
a decent amount of tracks without overloading the mix buss &
hitting your limiter too hard at that level. Consider setting
it lower as a starting point if you plan on getting into the
range of 40+ tracks. HERE'S THE KEY... if you've got your mix
roughed out & you can pull out that peakstop limiter I
mentioned in #2 & NOT go over zero on the Master - you're
golden. Fuck it, set 'em all at -15 as a starting point if you
want, Paris is already setting them for you at -22, right? If
you're getting a few scant overs without the limiter, you're
still ok, really... the idea is not to overstuff the mix buss
so heavily that if you pull the limiter off you're going into
the +5, +6 range without it.

Think "clean" people = think "no clips" (or as few as
possible), you get 30-40 channels of "overs" constantly (like
the 352,000 of 'em per second in the example I gave earlier),
and it's going to get harsh & thin.... it's a cumulative effect.

That's it, really... it's just like any other tool - you can't
use an allen wrench to properly drive a nail, and you can't use
a hammer to trim your nose hair.

Happy Native mixing!

(think "zen"!)

NeilChris, I assume this is one of the systems that you built? If
so, how much $$$ are we talking about for that kind of rig?

Neil

Chris Ludwig <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote:
>HI DJ,
> The Scope will do the trick if:
>1. It works with your chipset and motherboard. (It will probably work
>better on your old system.)
>2. You want to use it's internal effects and synths only.
>3. It can run at very low latencies like the RME and Lynx cards can
>under the same CPU load for all the of the Native VSTi and effects you have.
>
>If it it doesn't do well for any of the above extremely well then there

>is no benefit to it at all Personally I think purely native is the way
>to go with the UADs being used during the mixing stages when latency
>isn't as important.
>
>
>FYI-
>Here is a benchmark I just did today with the new single socket Quad
>Core Intel CPU i.e.. 4 cpus on one chip. A 48k buffer on the the
>Fireface is approx 2ms. With a Multiface I think the 64k buffer is 1.5ms.
>
>system-
>N3
>thonex test
>975 chipset mobo
>Quad core 2.66
>RME Fireface latest non-beta
>
>48k buffer @ 40% cpu load absolutely clean. At 64k it was 31%. We
>haven't seen any machine to date be able to play back this Thonex test
>at a 48k buffer totally clean.
>
>
>64k buffer is the lowest any systems have been able to go at these CPU
>loads.
>Core2 Duo 2.66 - 58%
>Dual core Opteron 2.6 - 58%
>AMD FX60 - 73%
>AMD X2 4400 - 70%
>Dual Core "Wood crest" Xeon 2.0 gig - 53%
>P4 955 3.4g - 76%
>
>DJ wrote:
>
>>OK Chuck,
>>
>>I'll bite. I'll have a native system here irregardless of what audio card
>>I'm using. I don't plan to sell of anything until I'm convinced that the
>>Scope cards are the ticket for me. Right now I'm in the middle of recabling
>>the studio, but it will be pretty simple for me to configure it so that
I
>>can just restore a Ghost image, reconfigure the digital connects and pop
in
>>the Magma PCI cards, and I'm back to the RME/UAD-1 rig that I've been
>>running. I have always intended to keep this viable for a while. The only
>>major change I'll be making is the mobo on both rigs. In the near future,
>>both the Paris system and the Native system will be running on Gigabyte
>>GA-K8NS Ultra 939 mobos, but in the meantime, what I've got now is working.
>>Believe me, I would dearly love to get a native system sounding like Paris
>>and I'll gladly help you beta whatever plugin you might develop or jump
>>through some experimental hoops, and I'm sure Neil, Dedric, Gene, Dave,
>>LaMont will have great suggestions since they are much further along in
>>native world than I am........but I'm also going to be getting another
wierd
>>proprietary DAW happening......the stuff is already on the way here.
>>
>>;o)
>>
>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453d565a$1@linux...
>>
>>
>>>DJ,
>>>
>>>Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
>>>
>>>
>>focus
>>
>>
>>>on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>>>
>>>It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
>>>
>>>
>>proprietary
>>
>>
>>>dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
>>>Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
>>>
>>>
>>doesn't
>>
>>
>>>make sense to me.
>>>
>>>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
>>> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>>>
>>>Chuck
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>--
>Chris Ludwig
>ADK
>chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
>www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
>(859) 635-5762O wise one,

Which brickwall limiter preferest thou? What you described wasn't exactly
the methodology I used whil'st creating suckage from mine mix, so verily,
upon completing the recabling, performing a FengSui and reassembling my
environment in harmonic convergence, I shall endeavor once again to become
one with the native mix bus whil'st contemplating the aural posibilities of
yet another incarnation of the studio from hell.

Peacelovedove.........

;o)

"Neil" <IOUIU@OIU.com> wrote in message news:453d8006$1@linux...
>
> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
> >If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> > Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
> (Long, but thought-provoking, and hopefully helpful, rant
> follows):
>
> I think the thing that's wrong is that some people just can't
> get their heads around the differences between analog & digital.
> With analog, "big" = hotter, and so hotter is better. When you
> overbias your tape machines & smack the hell out of the tape,
> you're getting compression right off the bat on every track you
> do that with, so one gets used to hearing most tracks with some
> degree of tape compression already... and we all know that
> compression can make things sound "bigger". Or, you use a
> compressor on the way in to the tape so that you get a better
> SNR, but since that's not an issue with digital (unless you're
> recording at levels so low that you just simply get poor
> resolution, but that's a slightly different scenario), people
> quit using compressors on the way in to digital since SNR isn't
> an issue there.... you also can't smack an AD convertor hard &
> expect it to like it - unlike tape. So right off the bat we've
> got a whole different set of dynamics action going on from one
> world to the other - then, when you've already got that
> compressed kick or bassline on tape, you compress it more, and
> you're compressing an already-compressed signal, so when you
> apply compression to your uncompressed kick on your DAW you're
> thinking "nah, that CAN'T be right, it can't need THAT much
> compression! I'd better back that off a bit!" (because you're
> looking at the ratios & the threshhold, etc, instead of using
> your ears). EQ reacts differently with digital, too... if you're
> used to mixing on a console, you might be used to boosting or
> cutting something by 3, 4, 6db & getting an audible
> difference... with digital/plugin EQ's, sometimes you gotta
> boost or cut HUGE swaths of that frequency to really make a
> difference... why? I think it's a phase thing... you get more
> phase shift with analog filters, and so the change is more
> apparent at smaller degrees of boost & cut. That also helps to
> isolate things to have their own place in the mix at the same
> time... considering that phase is the reason we have two ears -
> it's the thing that makes it possible for us to tell which
> direction a sound is coming from - this makes perfect sense.
>
> So, those of us (and I think that's "most of us here") who cut
> our teeth in the analog world first, and are used to all the
> things mentioned above - and who have not changed that style of
> mixing - could be disappointed in Native systems - not because
> they fall short of analog or Paris, but because they are
> actually much more accurate (assuming good quality convertors)
> & as a result do not impart certain types of coloration that we
> might interpret as "pleasing". If you could go back to a great
> mix you did on analog & a console & take out half of the amount
> of dynamics processing & half of the amount of EQ'ing you did,
> what would you get? A mix that sounded flatter & more colorless
> & with less dimension than the one you ended up with. Want
> proof? Here it is: If you didn't need the amount of EQ &
> dynamics you applied, you wouldn't have done so! If half the
> amounts/degrees of those things would have sufficed, that's
> what you would have used! So Paris sounds & acts kinda like
> analog, and people who like Paris like that aspect of it... how
> do we know there's not a few lines of code in there somewhere
> that adds graduated degrees of even-harmonic distortion when
> you push the faders or saturate the mix buss to whatever
> degree? I personally don't think it's strictly a DSP thing,
> because let's face it.. a plugin is basically doing the same
> thing to your mix whether it's running of a processor on it's
> own card or off your CPU; the difference being how well a
> particular VST or Direct-X compressor or reverb is written (and
> what it's designed to do in terms of treating the sound) vs.
> whatever DSP compressor or reverb plugin you're talking about.
> Can I get an "Amen, brutha!" on that?
>
> Chuck's nailed the Paris mix buss thing, it seems, with that
> -22db at the channel & +22db at the mix buss, but WHY does that
> make a difference? Well, here's why gang... it's just as I said
> earlier in another thread - you've got to give yourself some
> headroom, dammit! Paris apparently does this for you. Want to
> prove me wrong? Open up a Paris mix and drag the mix buss
> master fader down 22db from wherever you have it, then insert
> any plugin that has an output level control on each individual
> channel of that mix - if the plugin is a compressor, for
> example, don't use any compression, just use the output
> control - now boost every channel by 22db using that output
> control... if it only goes up 10 db, then insert that plugin
> twice in a row & max out the output on each insertion...
> that'll be close enough... how's that sound? I'll bet it won't
> sound all that good! Are you hearing that "overstuffed" mix
> buss sound? Is it smaller, with less dimension? I'd be curious
> to see what you guys think if you try this. Now that we know
> what Chuck told us he discovered, this is the best way to see
> if that makes a difference or not (my guess - it DOES make a
> difference, otherwise, they wouldn't have written the code that
> way!).
>
>
> So how can you get "big" in Native? Give yourself what Paris
> apparently already gives you... some headroom - think "clean",
> then dirty it up if you have to later... hell, just mash the
> mix with a comp & limiter or an L2 or something equivalent -
> you'll get all the harmonic distortion you want. I wasn't
> kidding the other day when I said: "Think zen when mixing in
> Cubase" it's all gotta flow without clips, gang... think about
> it... if you have one channel getting "overs" in a 32-bit float-
> point system, you may not notice it... heck you can't notice
> each sample in a given sound file can you? Of course not. But
> if you start adding more channels, and each of those channels
> is running hot... let's say 32 channels - as a comparison
> for you guys running two-card paris systems & no native mixes.
> and let's say you're running hot (over zero) about 25% of the
> time on each channel - that's 352,000 errors PER SECOND across
> the 32 tracks. That's a lot of floating-point math going on
> there, isn't it? And in this scenario, I want you to think of
> each error as a mistake, because that's what it is... in this
> style of mixing, it's a mistake. How can you expect something
> that's got 352,000 mistakes per second going on, to sound good?
>
> Are you still not convinced? Then you should also definitely
> investigate running stems (submixes) & reimporting. When I've
> done this I definitely can hear a difference, and I suspect you
> most likely will be able to as well.. it is NOT a huge
> difference, but it's audible. In fact, some months ago I posted
> a stems mix vs. a non-stems mix & a number of you said you
> could hear a difference. Now, if you think "aww, this is just
> another pain-in-the-ass procedure I have to go through if I mix
> in Native", keep in mind that you can run 90 Million stems
> mixes in the time it will take Deej to set up his first Pulsar
> card, and another 900 million in the time that it takes Chuck
> to research & write that plugin (OK, just giving hell to Deej
> there, and no really no offense intended to Chucks coding
> capability, but I'm just saying this is something you can do
> RIGHT NOW, TONIGHT if you want to if you have a Native system,
> without having to wait for anything new). Now, if you have a
> small project - one acoustic guitar, piano, & a vocal - with
> just a few tracks, running stems won't make a difference, but
> if you have a large project, give it a shot... you may not hear
> enough of a difference to make it worth doing in any given
> instance, but then again, you might.
>
> So, now that I hope I've made my case, here's my own personal
> guidelines for Native mixing - try it out & see wat you think:
>
> 1.) Do NOT bring down your Master Fader. It stays at zero
> (unless you're doing a fade).
>
> 2.) On your Master inserts, use a peakstop/brickwall limiter
> set anywhere from -.03 to -3db, depending on how much headroom
> you want to give your mastering engineer. Settings for volume
> maximization & other parameters will, of course, depend on the
> program material.
>
> 3.) Record at 24-bit 88.2k or higher (Dan Lavry has a white
> paper that makes a good case for a 60k sample rate - in order
> to get the ringing from the convertors' FIR filters out of the
> top range of our hearing - but since there is no standard 60k
> sample rate, 88.2 is the next one up). Also, 16-bit may have
> worked with Paris for whatever reason (maybe it just enhanced
> the harmonic distortion you're hearing?), but let's face it,
> everybody knows that more bits = greater "truth", especially
> when combined with higher resolutions.
>
> 4.) Default your individual channel settings to -6db or lower...
> I find that -6 is a good place to start because you can load up
> a decent amount of tracks without overloading the mix buss &
> hitting your limiter too hard at that level. Consider setting
> it lower as a starting point if you plan on getting into the
> range of 40+ tracks. HERE'S THE KEY... if you've got your mix
> roughed out & you can pull out that peakstop limiter I
> mentioned in #2 & NOT go over zero on the Master - you're
> golden. Fuck it, set 'em all at -15 as a starting point if you
> want, Paris is already setting them for you at -22, right? If
> you're getting a few scant overs without the limiter, you're
> still ok, really... the idea is not to overstuff the mix buss
> so heavily that if you pull the limiter off you're going into
> the +5, +6 range without it.
>
> Think "clean" people = think "no clips" (or as few as
> possible), you get 30-40 channels of "overs" constantly (like
> the 352,000 of 'em per second in the example I gave earlier),
> and it's going to get harsh & thin.... it's a cumulative effect.
>
> That's it, really... it's just like any other tool - you can't
> use an allen wrench to properly drive a nail, and you can't use
> a hammer to trim your nose hair.
>
> Happy Native mixing!
>
> (think "zen"!)
>
> Neil"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>O wise one,
>
>Which brickwall limiter preferest thou?

I preferest this one, which is not only quite transparent, but
your wallet will find transparent, as well...

http://www.x-buz.com/BuzMaxi3.html

(actually I prefer version 2, which I don't think is available
anymore, but this one's nearly as transparent, methinks)

NeilI'm not Neil, and can't claim any resemblance to the title "O wise one" :-),
but give Spectraphy a try: http://www.crysonic.com/spectraphy.html.

Best I've found. ymmv, and any other applicable netiquette acronym.

Dedric

On 10/23/06 9:56 PM, in article 453d8fc2@linux, "DJ" <notachance@net.net>
wrote:

> O wise one,
>
> Which brickwall limiter preferest thou? What you described wasn't exactly
> the methodology I used whil'st creating suckage from mine mix, so verily,
> upon completing the recabling, performing a FengSui and reassembling my
> environment in harmonic convergence, I shall endeavor once again to become
> one with the native mix bus whil'st contemplating the aural posibilities of
> yet another incarnation of the studio from hell.
>
> Peacelovedove.........
>
> ;o)
>
>
>
>
> "Neil" <IOUIU@OIU.com> wrote in message news:453d8006$1@linux...
>>
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>> If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
>>> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>>
>> (Long, but thought-provoking, and hopefully helpful, rant
>> follows):
>>
>> I think the thing that's wrong is that some people just can't
>> get their heads around the differences between analog & digital.
>> With analog, "big" = hotter, and so hotter is better. When you
>> overbias your tape machines & smack the hell out of the tape,
>> you're getting compression right off the bat on every track you
>> do that with, so one gets used to hearing most tracks with some
>> degree of tape compression already... and we all know that
>> compression can make things sound "bigger". Or, you use a
>> compressor on the way in to the tape so that you get a better
>> SNR, but since that's not an issue with digital (unless you're
>> recording at levels so low that you just simply get poor
>> resolution, but that's a slightly different scenario), people
>> quit using compressors on the way in to digital since SNR isn't
>> an issue there.... you also can't smack an AD convertor hard &
>> expect it to like it - unlike tape. So right off the bat we've
>> got a whole different set of dynamics action going on from one
>> world to the other - then, when you've already got that
>> compressed kick or bassline on tape, you compress it more, and
>> you're compressing an already-compressed signal, so when you
>> apply compression to your uncompressed kick on your DAW you're
>> thinking "nah, that CAN'T be right, it can't need THAT much
>> compression! I'd better back that off a bit!" (because you're
>> looking at the ratios & the threshhold, etc, instead of using
>> your ears). EQ reacts differently with digital, too... if you're
>> used to mixing on a console, you might be used to boosting or
>> cutting something by 3, 4, 6db & getting an audible
>> difference... with digital/plugin EQ's, sometimes you gotta
>> boost or cut HUGE swaths of that frequency to really make a
>> difference... why? I think it's a phase thing... you get more
>> phase shift with analog filters, and so the change is more
>> apparent at smaller degrees of boost & cut. That also helps to
>> isolate things to have their own place in the mix at the same
>> time... considering that phase is the reason we have two ears -
>> it's the thing that makes it possible for us to tell which
>> direction a sound is coming from - this makes perfect sense.
>>
>> So, those of us (and I think that's "most of us here") who cut
>> our teeth in the analog world first, and are used to all the
>> things mentioned above - and who have not changed that style of
>> mixing - could be disappointed in Native systems - not because
>> they fall short of analog or Paris, but because they are
>> actually much more accurate (assuming good quality convertors)
>> & as a result do not impart certain types of coloration that we
>> might interpret as "pleasing". If you could go back to a great
>> mix you did on analog & a console & take out half of the amount
>> of dynamics processing & half of the amount of EQ'ing you did,
>> what would you get? A mix that sounded flatter & more colorless
>> & with less dimension than the one you ended up with. Want
>> proof? Here it is: If you didn't need the amount of EQ &
>> dynamics you applied, you wouldn't have done so! If half the
>> amounts/degrees of those things would have sufficed, that's
>> what you would have used! So Paris sounds & acts kinda like
>> analog, and people who like Paris like that aspect of it... how
>> do we know there's not a few lines of code in there somewhere
>> that adds graduated degrees of even-harmonic distortion when
>> you push the faders or saturate the mix buss to whatever
>> degree? I personally don't think it's strictly a DSP thing,
>> because let's face it.. a plugin is basically doing the same
>> thing to your mix whether it's running of a processor on it's
>> own card or off your CPU; the difference being how well a
>> particular VST or Direct-X compressor or reverb is written (and
>> what it's designed to do in terms of treating the sound) vs.
>> whatever DSP compressor or reverb plugin you're talking about.
>> Can I get an "Amen, brutha!" on that?
>>
>> Chuck's nailed the Paris mix buss thing, it seems, with that
>> -22db at the channel & +22db at the mix buss, but WHY does that
>> make a difference? Well, here's why gang... it's just as I said
>> earlier in another thread - you've got to give yourself some
>> headroom, dammit! Paris apparently does this for you. Want to
>> prove me wrong? Open up a Paris mix and drag the mix buss
>> master fader down 22db from wherever you have it, then insert
>> any plugin that has an output level control on each individual
>> channel of that mix - if the plugin is a compressor, for
>> example, don't use any compression, just use the output
>> control - now boost every channel by 22db using that output
>> control... if it only goes up 10 db, then insert that plugin
>> twice in a row & max out the output on each insertion...
>> that'll be close enough... how's that sound? I'll bet it won't
>> sound all that good! Are you hearing that "overstuffed" mix
>> buss sound? Is it smaller, with less dimension? I'd be curious
>> to see what you guys think if you try this. Now that we know
>> what Chuck told us he discovered, this is the best way to see
>> if that makes a difference or not (my guess - it DOES make a
>> difference, otherwise, they wouldn't have written the code that
>> way!).
>>
>>
>> So how can you get "big" in Native? Give yourself what Paris
>> apparently already gives you... some headroom - think "clean",
>> then dirty it up if you have to later... hell, just mash the
>> mix with a comp & limiter or an L2 or something equivalent -
>> you'll get all the harmonic distortion you want. I wasn't
>> kidding the other day when I said: "Think zen when mixing in
>> Cubase" it's all gotta flow without clips, gang... think about
>> it... if you have one channel getting "overs" in a 32-bit float-
>> point system, you may not notice it... heck you can't notice
>> each sample in a given sound file can you? Of course not. But
>> if you start adding more channels, and each of those channels
>> is running hot... let's say 32 channels - as a comparison
>> for you guys running two-card paris systems & no native mixes.
>> and let's say you're running hot (over zero) about 25% of the
>> time on each channel - that's 352,000 errors PER SECOND across
>> the 32 tracks. That's a lot of floating-point math going on
>> there, isn't it? And in this scenario, I want you to think of
>> each error as a mistake, because that's what it is... in this
>> style of mixing, it's a mistake. How can you expect something
>> that's got 352,000 mistakes per second going on, to sound good?
>>
>> Are you still not convinced? Then you should also definitely
>> investigate running stems (submixes) & reimporting. When I've
>> done this I definitely can hear a difference, and I suspect you
>> most likely will be able to as well.. it is NOT a huge
>> difference, but it's audible. In fact, some months ago I posted
>> a stems mix vs. a non-stems mix & a number of you said you
>> could hear a difference. Now, if you think "aww, this is just
>> another pain-in-the-ass procedure I have to go through if I mix
>> in Native", keep in mind that you can run 90 Million stems
>> mixes in the time it will take Deej to set up his first Pulsar
>> card, and another 900 million in the time that it takes Chuck
>> to research & write that plugin (OK, just giving hell to Deej
>> there, and no really no offense intended to Chucks coding
>> capability, but I'm just saying this is something you can do
>> RIGHT NOW, TONIGHT if you want to if you have a Native system,
>> without having to wait for anything new). Now, if you have a
>> small project - one acoustic guitar, piano, & a vocal - with
>> just a few tracks, running stems won't make a difference, but
>> if you have a large project, give it a shot... you may not hear
>> enough of a difference to make it worth doing in any given
>> instance, but then again, you might.
>>
>> So, now that I hope I've made my case, here's my own personal
>> guidelines for Native mixing - try it out & see wat you think:
>>
>> 1.) Do NOT bring down your Master Fader. It stays at zero
>> (unless you're doing a fade).
>>
>> 2.) On your Master inserts, use a peakstop/brickwall limiter
>> set anywhere from -.03 to -3db, depending on how much headroom
>> you want to give your mastering engineer. Settings for volume
>> maximization & other parameters will, of course, depend on the
>> program material.
>>
>> 3.) Record at 24-bit 88.2k or higher (Dan Lavry has a white
>> paper that makes a good case for a 60k sample rate - in order
>> to get the ringing from the convertors' FIR filters out of the
>> top range of our hearing - but since there is no standard 60k
>> sample rate, 88.2 is the next one up). Also, 16-bit may have
>> worked with Paris for whatever reason (maybe it just enhanced
>> the harmonic distortion you're hearing?), but let's face it,
>> everybody knows that more bits = greater "truth", especially
>> when combined with higher resolutions.
>>
>> 4.) Default your individual channel settings to -6db or lower...
>> I find that -6 is a good place to start because you can load up
>> a decent amount of tracks without overloading the mix buss &
>> hitting your limiter too hard at that level. Consider setting
>> it lower as a starting point if you plan on getting into the
>> range of 40+ tracks. HERE'S THE KEY... if you've got your mix
>> roughed out & you can pull out that peakstop limiter I
>> mentioned in #2 & NOT go over zero on the Master - you're
>> golden. Fuck it, set 'em all at -15 as a starting point if you
>> want, Paris is already setting them for you at -22, right? If
>> you're getting a few scant overs without the limiter, you're
>> still ok, really... the idea is not to overstuff the mix buss
>> so heavily that if you pull the limiter off you're going into
>> the +5, +6 range without it.
>>
>> Think "clean" people = think "no clips" (or as few as
>> possible), you get 30-40 channels of "overs" constantly (like
>> the 352,000 of 'em per second in the example I gave earlier),
>> and it's going to get harsh & thin.... it's a cumulative effect.
>>
>> That's it, really... it's just like any other tool - you can't
>> use an allen wrench to properly drive a nail, and you can't use
>> a hammer to trim your nose hair.
>>
>> Happy Native mixing!
>>
>> (think "zen"!)
>>
>> Neil
>
>Hi Chuck,
As I
ve stated many times before, there mixng in the Natives DAWs, expecially
Cuabse SX/Nuendo is difficult, until you add an mixer into the equation.
It's summing is poor at best.
Pro Tools is much better today for mixing and routing flexibility, even the
lower end versions (LE & M-Powered). You just hear and feel it when you import
audio(wav files) onto the playing field. They 48 bit summing is excellent,
and you can mix agressively..

Dedric and I have gone around and around on this issue. I'm sorry, I call
hen as I (Hear them).. :) This is the reason, I keep using Paris in my personal
studio. Now doay, other producers aring noticing that he Natives(Execpt PT)
are not living up to their hype..

Even more, I don;t agree with this new trend of adding more CPU powerer,
thinking that it will yield you better summing or sound.
It won't!!

Bottom line, if you are using SX/Nuendo, Sonar,Logic, you need to be using
the Apogee AD16x/DA..The Apogees have soft limiting beuilt in. Tha's very
inportant.. RME does not do soft limiting..
Or you need a decent analog /difital mixer to summ..Period..

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>DJ,
>
>Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to focus
>on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>
>It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
proprietary
>dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.

>Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just doesn't
>make sense to me.
>
>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
>ChuckChuck,

There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of somebody
making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various possibilities,
which one would assume would include:

1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality of an
EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris allowing
more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as the EDS
subs, or...
2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses the emaulation
of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow a Paris
mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.

I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in creating the
VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the EDS functionality
and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio going
through the card itself.

This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow and dedication
got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to mention
the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this shennigans
i would think.

Cheers,
Kim.

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>DJ,
>
>Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to focus
>on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>
>It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
proprietary
>dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.

>Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just doesn't
>make sense to me.
>
>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
>ChuckChris Ludwig <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote:
>HI DJ,
> The Scope will do the trick if:
>1. It works with your chipset and motherboard. (It will probably work
>better on your old system.)
>2. You want to use it's internal effects and synths only.
>3. It can run at very low latencies like the RME and Lynx cards can
>under the same CPU load for all the of the Native VSTi and effects you have.
>
>If it it doesn't do well for any of the above extremely well then there

>is no benefit to it at all Personally I think purely native is the way
>to go with the UADs being used during the mixing stages when latency
>isn't as important.
>
>
>FYI-
>Here is a benchmark I just did today with the new single socket Quad
>Core Intel CPU i.e.. 4 cpus on one chip. A 48k buffer on the the
>Fireface is approx 2ms. With a Multiface I think the 64k buffer is 1.5ms.
>
>system-
>N3
>thonex test
>975 chipset mobo
>Quad core 2.66
>RME Fireface latest non-beta
>
>48k buffer @ 40% cpu load absolutely clean. At 64k it was 31%. We
>haven't seen any machine to date be able to play back this Thonex test
>at a 48k buffer totally clean.
>
>
>64k buffer is the lowest any systems have been able to go at these CPU
>loads.
>Core2 Duo 2.66 - 58%
>Dual core Opteron 2.6 - 58%
>AMD FX60 - 73%
>AMD X2 4400 - 70%
>Dual Core "Wood crest" Xeon 2.0 gig - 53%
>P4 955 3.4g - 76%
>

Chris.
Is that the chip that will turn my G5 quad into a G5X8?
Hint, hint.
GeneMy formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.
The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset itself.

Does anyone have any recommendations for:

A) A good place to fix it?

B) A good reference headset at around the same price?

The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead
of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.comThis is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Dimitrios,
So you didn't reinstall just moved folders and rewrapped and pointed?
Tom
"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =
news:453d0178$1@linux...

Hi,
It doesn't have to do with reinstalling or not.
As Chuck said it may be something with long strings.
So I took it further for smoother plugin work with Paris !!
I reintalled all my VST at:
c:\vst
AND ALL my DX (yes DX) at:
c:\DX
ALSO I put the the content of the Paris folder DIRECTLY at:
c:\
I mean NOT the EMU folder but the content of it !

Paris runs super fast with plugins , even vst plugz not showingh =
before in
Chainer like waves are shown now although still not working.
I am sure as you will see that there is a big difference.
Not a single crash putting in and out dx plugins while paris running =
vst
andothers and quitting Paris while in play mode.
NO CRASH.
I encourage you to try after you make a ghost backup just in case.
I would love your input here.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>I installed up front into C:\Paris22 and C:\Paris3 for each version. =
I set

>all my VST plugs to hit C:\vst. Not sure in your situation what is=20
>appropriate, but feel safe to say a reinstall would do the trick. =
Copy/Paste

>I'm not to sure about that one becuase of the XP subsystem paths.
>AA
>
>
>"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message=20
>news:453cf05e$1@linux...
>>
>> I tried cut and copy to C:\ and the paf and ppj icons show up as =
generic.
>> It did open for me, but I changed it back as I'm in the middle of=20
>> something
>> and don't really want to mess things up.
>> Should I do an unstall of the app and the sub system and =
re-install, or

>> cut
>> copy the Paris exe and re-install the subsystem, pointing it toward =
the

>> C:\
>> or what?
>> Rod
>> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>>FWIW my paths are C:\Paris3 and C:\vst and I don't have =
problems.Note

>>>there
>>
>>>is no space in my 8.3 friendly naming, straight up DOS happy.
>>>
>>>AA
>>>
>>>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =
news:453ccc1f$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> Interesting.
>>>> So maybe VST doesn't work that fine maybe because it is normally:
>>>> c:\Program files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder.
>>>> So if we install all vst on say:
>>>> c:\vst that could help...
>>>> I will try :)
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>
>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>It probably has something to do with the way some portion of the =
effects
>>>> subsystem
>>>>>deals with long paths. Have you ever seen the way a long path =
gets
>>>>>converted
>>>>>for dos compatibility?
>>>>>
>>>>>Chuck
>>>>>
>>>>>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>Interesting...wonder why?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>D
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message =
news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi John,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe =
from
the
>>>>
>>>>>>> application
>>>>>>> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number =
of
>>>>>>> crashes.
>>>>>>> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp =
driver.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when =
nothing
else
>>>>>
>>>>>>> seems
>>>>>>> to.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chuck
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a =
fresh
>>>>>>>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's =
just
>>
>>>>>>>>stupid!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>John
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>DJ wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files=20
>>>>>>>>> Directory,
>>>>>or
>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Deej
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and =
put
it
>> in
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> root
>>>>>>>>> c:\
>>>>>>>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by =
quitting or
>>>>>>>>>> cahnging
>>>>>>>>>> projects.
>>>>>>>>>> Now solid !!
>>>>>>>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered =
reading

>>>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>so
>>>>>>>>> decided
>>>>>>>>>> to try so voila !
>>>>>>>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets =
better
>>>>>>>>> priority
>>>>>>>>>> ,don't know....
>>>>>>>>>> The essential part is that it works.
>>>>>>>>>> Try this.
>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or =
where
>> ever
>>>>>>> I've
>>>>>>>>>> got
>>>>>>>>>>> it ;-)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> plugins and everything ?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Duh-ON
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read =
it.
>>>>>>>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects =
that
>> may
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> lead
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY =
you
emu
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> folder
>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>>> c root.
>>>>>>>>>>>> c:\xxxx
>>>>>>>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this =
could
>>>> make
>>>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>> difference !!
>>>>>>>>>>>> It makes !!
>>>>>>>>>>>> DO IT !!
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
>>>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>=20
>
>

I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
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<DIV>Dimitrios,</DIV>
<DIV>So you didn't reinstall just moved =
folders and=20
rewrapped and pointed?</DIV>
<DIV>Tom</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Dimitrios" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>> wrote in =
message=20
<A=20
=
href=3D"news:453d0178$1@linux">news:453d0178$1@linux</A>...</DIV> Hi,<=
BR>It=20
doesn't have to do with reinstalling or not. As Chuck said it may =
be=20
something with long strings. So I took it further for smoother =
plugin work=20
with Paris !! I reintalled all my VST at: c:\vst AND ALL my =
DX (yes=20
DX) at: c:\DX ALSO I put the the content of the Paris folder =
DIRECTLY=20
at: c:\ I mean NOT the EMU folder but the content of it =
! Paris=20
runs super fast with plugins , even vst plugz not showingh before=20
in Chainer like waves are shown now although still not =
working. I am=20
sure as you will see that there is a big difference. Not a single =
crash=20
putting in and out dx plugins while paris running vst andothers and =

quitting Paris while in play mode. NO CRASH. I encourage you to =
try=20
after you make a ghost backup just in case. I would love your input =

here. Regards, Dimitrios "Aaron Allen" <<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:know-spam@not_here.dude">know-spam@not_here.dude</A>>=20
wrote: >I installed up front into C:\Paris22 and C:\Paris3 for =
each=20
version. I set >all my VST plugs to hit C:\vst. Not sure in =
your=20
situation what is >appropriate, but feel safe to say a =
reinstall would=20
do the trick. Copy/Paste >I'm not to sure about that one =
becuase of=20
the XP subsystem paths. >AA > > > "Rod Lincoln" =
<<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com">rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com</A>&g=
t;=20
wrote in message =
 >news:453cf05e$1@linux... >> >> I=20
tried cut and copy to C:\ and the paf and ppj icons show up as=20
generic. >> It did open for me, but I changed it back as I'm =
in the=20
middle of >> something >> and don't really want to =
mess=20
things up. >> Should I do an unstall of the app and the sub =
system=20
and re-install, or >> cut >> copy the Paris exe =
and=20
re-install the subsystem, pointing it toward the >>=20
C:\ >> or what? >> Rod >> "Aaron Allen" =
<<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:know-spam@not_here.dude">know-spam@not_here.dude</A>>=20
wrote: >>>FWIW my paths are C:\Paris3 and C:\vst and I =
don't have=20
problems.Note >>>there >> >>>is =
no space=20
in my 8.3 friendly naming, straight up DOS=20
=
happy. >>> >>>AA >>> >>>"=
Dimitrios"=20
<<A href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>> =
wrote in=20
message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:453ccc1f$1@linux">news:453ccc1f$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
t;> >>>>=20
Interesting. >>>> So maybe VST doesn't work that fine =
maybe=20
because it is normally: >>>> c:\Program=20
files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder. >>>> So if we =
install=20
all vst on say: >>>> c:\vst that could=20
help... >>>> I will try :) >>>>=20
Regards, >>>> =
Dimitrios >>>> >>>>=20
"chuck duffy" <<A href=3D"mailto:c@c.com">c@c.com</A>>=20
wrote: >>>>> >>>>>It probably has=20
something to do with the way some portion of the =
effects >>>>=20
subsystem >>>>>deals with long paths.  Have you =
ever=20
seen the way a long path=20
gets >>>>>converted >>>>>for dos=20
=
compatibility? >>>>> >>>>>Chuck &g=
t;>>>> >>>>> "Don=20
Nafe" <<A href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
wrote: >>>>>>Interesting. ..wonder=20
=
why? >>>>>> >>>>>>D >>=
>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>"=
chuck=20
duffy" <<A href=3D"mailto:c@c.com">c@c.com</A>> wrote in message =
<A=20
=
href=3D"news:453bc2a1$1@linux">news:453bc2a1$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
t;>>>> >>>>>>>=20
Hi =
John, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> A=20
long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe=20
from the >>>> >>>>>>>=20
application >>>>>>> folder to the root, and =
starting=20
from there reduces the number of >>>>>>>=20
crashes. >>>>>>> I posted this way back when =
we first=20
started using the xp=20
=
driver. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> =
I have=20
no idea why.  It may be stupid, but it works when=20
=
nothing else >>>>> >>>>>>>=20
seems >>>>>>>=20
to. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>=20
Chuck >>>>>>> >>>>>>> =
John=20
<<A href=3D"mailto:no@no.com">no@no.com</A>>=20
wrote: >>>>>>>& ;gt;If it needs to be in =
C:\  it=20
would make the most sense to do a=20
fresh >>>>>>>& ;gt;install there.  If it =
needs to=20
be in both locations then it's=20
=
just >> >>>>>>>& ;gt;stupid! >>&g=
t;>>>>> >>>>>>>& ;gt;John >&gt=
;>>>>>> >>>>>>>& ;gt;DJ=20
wrote: >>>>>>>& ;gt;> Do you copy it, leaving =
the=20
original in the Program files >>>>>>>& ;gt;> =

Directory, >>>>>or >>>>>>>=20
do >>>>>>>& ;gt;> you cut it and paste it to =
the=20
=
C:\ >>>>>>>& ;gt;> >>>>>>&g=
t;>>=20
=
Thanks, >>>>>>>& ;gt;> >>>>>&g=
t;>>>=20
=
Deej >>>>>>>& ;gt;> >>>>>>&=
gt;>>=20
"Dimitrios" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>>=20
wrote in message >>>>>>>& ;gt;> <A=20
=
href=3D"news:453b97a1$1@linux">news:453b97a1$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
t;>>>>>>>=2 0
Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and=20
put it >>=20
in >>>>> >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> =

root >>>>>>>& ;gt;>=20
c:\ >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> I had several crashes =
after=20
closing Paris either by quitting=20
or >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>=20
cahnging >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>=20
projects. >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> Now solid=20
!! >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> It is not something =
that I=20
discovered, just remembered=20
reading >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>=20
this >>>>>so >>>>>>>& ;gt;> =

decided >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> to try so voila=20
! >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> I don't know why but I =
guess=20
maybe that this way Paris gets =
better >>>>>>>& ;gt;>=20
priority >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> ,don't=20
know.... >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> The essential =
part is=20
that it works. >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> Try=20
this. >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>=20
Regards, >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>=20
=
Dimitrios >>>>>>>& ;gt;>> >>>>=
>>>>>>=20
"Don Nafe" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
wrote: >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>> copy it to =
create=20
c:\emu =20
=
? >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>> >>>>>=
>>>>>>=20
and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or =
where >>=20
ever >>>>>>>=20
I've >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>=20
got >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>> it=20
=
;-) >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>> >>>>&g=
t;>>>>>>=20
plugins and everything=20
=
? >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>> >>>>>=
>>>>>>=20
Any idea how this prevents=20
=
crashes? >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>> >>>&=
gt;>>>>>>>= 20
=
Duh-ON >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>> >>>&gt=
;>>>>>>>=20
"Dimitrios" <<A =
href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>>=20
wrote in message >>>>>>>& ;gt;> <A=20
=
href=3D"news:453b7449$1@linux">news:453b7449$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
t;>>>>>>>&a mp;gt;>=20
I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read=20
it. >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> To avoid =
crashes when=20
closing Paris or changing projects that >>=20
=
may >>>>> >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>&g=
t;>=20
lead >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>=20
to >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> blue screen =
sometimes=20
due to DX vst plugin loading COPY=20
=
you emu >>>> >>>>>>>& ;gt;>&gt=
;>>=20
folder >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>=20
on >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> c=20
root. >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>>=20
c:\xxxx >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> I have =
read that=20
some time ago but didn't think that this could >>>>=20
make >>>>>>>& ;gt;>=20
any >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> difference=20
!! >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> It makes=20
!! >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> DO IT=20
!! >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> Thats for XP of =

course. >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>> Now I am a =
happier=20
Pulsarian ! >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>>=20
Regards, >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>>>=20
=
Dimitrios >>>>>>>& ;gt;>>> >>>=
>>>>>> >>>>>>>& ;gt;> >&=
gt;>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>&g=
t;> >>>>> >>>> >>> &gt=
;>> >>=20
 > > </BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, =
and=20
you? <A=20
href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
..html</A>   </DIV></BODY ></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_008A_01C6F712.EF5AB8D0--I don't know who works on these but without my older (600 ohm) K240DF's I
would die.......plus....you can kill Behringer headphone amps with these
too.

;op

"Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:453daccc@linux...
>
> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.
> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
itself.
>
> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>
> A) A good place to fix it?
>
> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>
> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead
> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.comAs a 4 years Pulsar user I do not agree.
I have never seen anything like this no matter what I tried and looked for.
It is a mind blowing intergrated system that has support and a lot of third
party developers with free and commercial plugz.
I wholeheartly recommend it.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>DJ,
>
>Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to focus
>on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>
>It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
proprietary
>dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.

>Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just doesn't
>make sense to me.
>
>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
>ChuckHey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
Just to let you know.
Regards,
DimitriosDear To,
No reinstalling just for Paris folder moving.
Just move the entire folder content to root c:
I reinstalled though all my vst's to c:\vst and all my DirectX to c:\DX
What I am seeing is a very stable Paris with plugins and no crashes and blue
screens.
I didn't even let the vst or dx installation let make a new folder inside
vst or dx folder just put them all there without subfolders.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>Dimitrios,
>So you didn't reinstall just moved folders and rewrapped and pointed?
>Tom
> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =
>news:453d0178$1@linux...
>
> Hi,
> It doesn't have to do with reinstalling or not.
> As Chuck said it may be something with long strings.
> So I took it further for smoother plugin work with Paris !!
> I reintalled all my VST at:
> c:\vst
> AND ALL my DX (yes DX) at:
> c:\DX
> ALSO I put the the content of the Paris folder DIRECTLY at:
> c:\
> I mean NOT the EMU folder but the content of it !
>
> Paris runs super fast with plugins , even vst plugz not showingh =
>before in
> Chainer like waves are shown now although still not working.
> I am sure as you will see that there is a big difference.
> Not a single crash putting in and out dx plugins while paris running =
>vst
> andothers and quitting Paris while in play mode.
> NO CRASH.
> I encourage you to try after you make a ghost backup just in case.
> I would love your input here.
> Regards,
> Dimitrios
>
> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
> >I installed up front into C:\Paris22 and C:\Paris3 for each version.
=
>I set
>
> >all my VST plugs to hit C:\vst. Not sure in your situation what is=20
> >appropriate, but feel safe to say a reinstall would do the trick. =
>Copy/Paste
>
> >I'm not to sure about that one becuase of the XP subsystem paths.
> >AA
> >
> >
> >"Rod Lincoln" <rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com> wrote in message=20
> >news:453cf05e$1@linux...
> >>
> >> I tried cut and copy to C:\ and the paf and ppj icons show up as =
>generic.
> >> It did open for me, but I changed it back as I'm in the middle of=20
> >> something
> >> and don't really want to mess things up.
> >> Should I do an unstall of the app and the sub system and =
>re-install, or
>
> >> cut
> >> copy the Paris exe and re-install the subsystem, pointing it toward
=
>the
>
> >> C:\
> >> or what?
> >> Rod
> >> "Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
> >>>FWIW my paths are C:\Paris3 and C:\vst and I don't have =
>problems.Note
>
> >>>there
> >>
> >>>is no space in my 8.3 friendly naming, straight up DOS happy.
> >>>
> >>>AA
> >>>
> >>>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =
>news:453ccc1f$1@linux...
> >>>>
> >>>> Interesting.
> >>>> So maybe VST doesn't work that fine maybe because it is normally:
> >>>> c:\Program files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder.
> >>>> So if we install all vst on say:
> >>>> c:\vst that could help...
> >>>> I will try :)
> >>>> Regards,
> >>>> Dimitrios
> >>>>
> >>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>It probably has something to do with the way some portion of the
=
>effects
> >>>> subsystem
> >>>>>deals with long paths. Have you ever seen the way a long path =
>gets
> >>>>>converted
> >>>>>for dos compatibility?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Chuck
> >>>>>
> >>>>>"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
> >>>>>>Interesting...wonder why?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>D
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message =
>news:453bc2a1$1@linux...
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Hi John,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> A long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe =
>from
> the
> >>>>
> >>>>>>> application
> >>>>>>> folder to the root, and starting from there reduces the number
=
>of
> >>>>>>> crashes.
> >>>>>>> I posted this way back when we first started using the xp =
>driver.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I have no idea why. It may be stupid, but it works when =
>nothing
> else
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>> seems
> >>>>>>> to.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Chuck
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> John <no@no.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>If it needs to be in C:\ it would make the most sense to do a
=
>fresh
> >>>>>>>>install there. If it needs to be in both locations then it's
=
>just
> >>
> >>>>>>>>stupid!
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>John
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>DJ wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> Do you copy it, leaving the original in the Program files=20
> >>>>>>>>> Directory,
> >>>>>or
> >>>>>>> do
> >>>>>>>>> you cut it and paste it to the C:\
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Thanks,
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Deej
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
> >>>>>>>>> news:453b97a1$1@linux...
> >>>>>>>>>> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and =
>put
> it
> >> in
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> root
> >>>>>>>>> c:\
> >>>>>>>>>> I had several crashes after closing Paris either by =
>quitting or
> >>>>>>>>>> cahnging
> >>>>>>>>>> projects.
> >>>>>>>>>> Now solid !!
> >>>>>>>>>> It is not something that I discovered, just remembered =
>reading
>
> >>>>>>>>>> this
> >>>>>so
> >>>>>>>>> decided
> >>>>>>>>>> to try so voila !
> >>>>>>>>>> I don't know why but I guess maybe that this way Paris gets
=
>better
> >>>>>>>>> priority
> >>>>>>>>>> ,don't know....
> >>>>>>>>>> The essential part is that it works.
> >>>>>>>>>> Try this.
> >>>>>>>>>> Regards,
> >>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>> copy it to create c:\emu ?
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or =
>where
> >> ever
> >>>>>>> I've
> >>>>>>>>>> got
> >>>>>>>>>>> it ;-)
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> plugins and everything ?
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Any idea how this prevents crashes?
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Duh-ON
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message
> >>>>>>>>> news:453b7449$1@linux...
> >>>>>>>>>>>> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read
=
>it.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> To avoid crashes when closing Paris or changing projects
=
>that
> >> may
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> lead
> >>>>>>>>>> to
> >>>>>>>>>>>> blue screen sometimes due to DX vst plugin loading COPY =
>you
> emu
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> folder
> >>>>>>>>>> on
> >>>>>>>>>>>> c root.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> c:\xxxx
> >>>>>>>>>>>> I have read that some time ago but didn't think that this
=
>could
> >>>> make
> >>>>>>>>> any
> >>>>>>>>>>>> difference !!
> >>>>>>>>>>>> It makes !!
> >>>>>>>>>>>> DO IT !!
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Thats for XP of course.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Now I am a happier Pulsarian !
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>=20
> >
> >
>
>
>
>I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
>http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
>
><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
><HTML><HEAD>
><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
><META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR>
><STYLE></STYLE>
></HEAD>
><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
><DIV>Dimitrios,</DIV>
><DIV>So you didn't reinstall just moved =
>folders and=20
>rewrapped and pointed?</DIV>
><DIV>Tom</DIV>
><BLOCKQUOTE=20
>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
> <DIV>"Dimitrios" <<A=20
> href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>> wrote in =
>message=20
> <A=20
> =
>href=3D"news:453d0178$1@linux">news:453d0178$1@linux</A>...</DIV> Hi,<=
>BR>It=20
> doesn't have to do with reinstalling or not. As Chuck said it may =
>be=20
> something with long strings. So I took it further for smoother =
>plugin work=20
> with Paris !! I reintalled all my VST at: c:\vst AND ALL my =
>DX (yes=20
> DX) at: c:\DX ALSO I put the the content of the Paris folder =
>DIRECTLY=20
> at: c:\ I mean NOT the EMU folder but the content of it =
>! Paris=20
> runs super fast with plugins , even vst plugz not showingh before=20
> in Chainer like waves are shown now although still not =
>working. I am=20
> sure as you will see that there is a big difference. Not a single =
>crash=20
> putting in and out dx plugins while paris running vst andothers and
=
>
> quitting Paris while in play mode. NO CRASH. I encourage you to
=
>try=20
> after you make a ghost backup just in case. I would love your input
=
>
> here. Regards, Dimitrios "Aaron Allen" <<A=20
> =
>href=3D"mailto:know-spam@not_here.dude">know-spam@not_here.dude</A>>=20
> wrote: >I installed up front into C:\Paris22 and C:\Paris3 for =
>each=20
> version. I set >all my VST plugs to hit C:\vst. Not sure in =
>your=20
> situation what is >appropriate, but feel safe to say a =
>reinstall would=20
> do the trick. Copy/Paste >I'm not to sure about that one =
>becuase of=20
> the XP subsystem paths. >AA > > >"Rod Lincoln" =
><<A=20
> =
>href=3D"mailto:rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com">rlincoln@nospam.kc.rr.com</A>&g=
>t;=20
> wrote in message =
> >news:453cf05e$1@linux... >> >> I=20
> tried cut and copy to C:\ and the paf and ppj icons show up as=20
> generic. >> It did open for me, but I changed it back as I'm =
>in the=20
> middle of >> something >> and don't really want to =
>mess=20
> things up. >> Should I do an unstall of the app and the sub =
>system=20
> and re-install, or >> cut >> copy the Paris exe =
>and=20
> re-install the subsystem, pointing it toward the >>=20
> C:\ >> or what? >> Rod >> "Aaron Allen" =
><<A=20
> =
>href=3D"mailto:know-spam@not_here.dude">know-spam@not_here.dude</A>>=20
> wrote: >>>FWIW my paths are C:\Paris3 and C:\vst and I =
>don't have=20
> problems.Note >>>there >> >>>is =
>no space=20
> in my 8.3 friendly naming, straight up DOS=20
> =
>happy. >>> >>>AA >>> >>>"=
>Dimitrios"=20
> <<A href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>> =
>wrote in=20
> message <A=20
> =
>href=3D"news:453ccc1f$1@linux">news:453ccc1f$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>t;> >>>>=20
> Interesting. >>>> So maybe VST doesn't work that fine =
>maybe=20
> because it is normally: >>>> c:\Program=20
> files\Steinberg\Vstplugins\vst subfolder. >>>> So if we =
>install=20
> all vst on say: >>>> c:\vst that could=20
> help... >>>> I will try :) >>>>=20
> Regards, >>>> =
>Dimitrios >>>> >>>>=20
> "chuck duffy" <<A href=3D"mailto:c@c.com">c@c.com</A>>=20
> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>It probably has=20
> something to do with the way some portion of the =
>effects >>>>=20
> subsystem >>>>>deals with long paths.� Have you =
>ever=20
> seen the way a long path=20
> gets >>>>>converted >>>>>for dos=20
> =
>compatibility? >>>>> >>>>>Chuck &g=
>t;>>>> >>>>>"Don=20
> Nafe" <<A href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
> wrote: >>>>>>Interesting...wonder=20
> =
>why? >>>>>> >>>>>>D >>=
>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>"=
>chuck=20
> duffy" <<A href=3D"mailto:c@c.com">c@c.com</A>> wrote in message =
><A=20
> =
>href=3D"news:453bc2a1$1@linux">news:453bc2a1$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>t;>>>> >>>>>>>=20
> Hi =
>John, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> A=20
> long time ago I noticed that simply copying the paris.exe=20
> from the >>>> >>>>>>>=20
> application >>>>>>> folder to the root, and =
>starting=20
> from there reduces the number of >>>>>>>=20
> crashes. >>>>>>> I posted this way back when =
>we first=20
> started using the xp=20
> =
>driver. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> =
>I have=20
> no idea why.� It may be stupid, but it works when=20
> =
>nothing else >>>>> >>>>>>>=20
> seems >>>>>>>=20
> to. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>=20
> Chuck >>>>>>> >>>>>>> =
>John=20
> <<A href=3D"mailto:no@no.com">no@no.com</A>>=20
> wrote: >>>>>>>>If it needs to be in =
>C:\� it=20
> would make the most sense to do a=20
> fresh >>>>>>>>install there.� If it =
>needs to=20
> be in both locations then it's=20
> =
>just >> >>>>>>>>stupid! >>&g=
>t;>>>>> >>>>>>>>John >>=
>;>>>>>> >>>>>>>>DJ=20
> wrote: >>>>>>>>> Do you copy it, leaving =
>the=20
> original in the Program files >>>>>>>>> =
>
> Directory, >>>>>or >>>>>>>=20
> do >>>>>>>>> you cut it and paste it to =
>the=20
> =
>C:\ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>&g=
>t;>>=20
> =
>Thanks, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>&g=
>t;>>>=20
> =
>Deej >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>&=
>gt;>>=20
> "Dimitrios" <<A =
>href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>>=20
> wrote in message >>>>>>>>> <A=20
> =
>href=3D"news:453b97a1$1@linux">news:453b97a1$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>t;>>>>>>>=20
> Take the folder "Paris Pro" that is inside emu folder and=20
> put it >>=20
> in >>>>> >>>>>>>>>> =
>
> root >>>>>>>>>=20
> c:\ >>>>>>>>>> I had several crashes =
>after=20
> closing Paris either by quitting=20
> or >>>>>>>>>>=20
> cahnging >>>>>>>>>>=20
> projects. >>>>>>>>>> Now solid=20
> !! >>>>>>>>>> It is not something =
>that I=20
> discovered, just remembered=20
> reading >>>>>>>>>>=20
> this >>>>>so >>>>>>>>> =
>
> decided >>>>>>>>>> to try so voila=20
> ! >>>>>>>>>> I don't know why but I =
>guess=20
> maybe that this way Paris gets =
>better >>>>>>>>>=20
> priority >>>>>>>>>> ,don't=20
> know.... >>>>>>>>>> The essential =
>part is=20
> that it works. >>>>>>>>>> Try=20
> this. >>>>>>>>>>=20
> Regards, >>>>>>>>>>=20
> =
>Dimitrios >>>>>>>>>> >>>>=
>>>>>>>=20
> "Don Nafe" <<A =
>href=3D"mailto:dnafe@magma.ca">dnafe@magma.ca</A>>=20
> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> copy it to =
>create=20
> c:\emu�=20
> =
>? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>=
>>>>>>>=20
> and that's the whole folder from c:\programfiles\emu (or =
>where >>=20
> ever >>>>>>>=20
> I've >>>>>>>>>>=20
> got >>>>>>>>>>> it=20
> =
>;-) >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>&g=
>t;>>>>>>=20
> plugins and everything=20
> =
>? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>=
>>>>>>>=20
> Any idea how this prevents=20
> =
>crashes? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>&=
>gt;>>>>>>>=20
> =
>Duh-ON >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>=
>;>>>>>>>=20
> "Dimitrios" <<A =
>href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>>=20
> wrote in message >>>>>>>>> <A=20
> =
>href=3D"news:453b7449$1@linux">news:453b7449$1@linux</A>... >>&g=
>t;>>>>>>>>>=20
> I know I posted bfore but maybe some of you did not read=20
> it. >>>>>>>>>>>> To avoid =
>crashes when=20
> closing Paris or changing projects that >>=20
> =
>may >>>>> >>>>>>>>>>&g=
>t;>=20
> lead >>>>>>>>>>=20
> to >>>>>>>>>>>> blue screen =
>sometimes=20
> due to DX vst plugin loading COPY=20
> =
>you emu >>>> >>>>>>>>>>=
>;>>=20
> folder >>>>>>>>>>=20
> on >>>>>>>>>>>> c=20
> root. >>>>>>>>>>>>=20
> c:\xxxx >>>>>>>>>>>> I have =
>read that=20
> some time ago but didn't think that this could >>>>=20
> make >>>>>>>>>=20
> any >>>>>>>>>>>> difference=20
> !! >>>>>>>>>>>> It makes=20
> !! >>>>>>>>>>>> DO IT=20
> !! >>>>>>>>>>>> Thats for XP of =
>
> course. >>>>>>>>>>>> Now I am a =
>happier=20
> Pulsarian ! >>>>>>>>>>>>=20
> Regards, >>>>>>>>>>>>=20
> =
>Dimitrios >>>>>>>>>>> >>>=
>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >&=
>gt;>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>&g=
>t;> >>>>> >>>> >>> >=
>;>> >>=20
> > > </BLOCKQUOTE>
><DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, =
>and=20
>you? <A=20
>href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
>.html</A>��</DIV></BODY></HTML>
>
>They still pass 24bits.

James

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>
>Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
>bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
>Just to let you know.
>Regards,
>DimitriosI posted this a while ago.. I now use Nuendo with a Layla 3G to output 8 x
analog channels and 8 x ADAT stems to Paris ie. Paris is now my mixer, its
in the same computer, its easy....hardly any overhead as all Paris is doing
is sitting in 'live' mode. I've been doing a bunch of live concert DVDs with
50 odd channels - 2 hour files - no chance I'd be wanting to convert all
those puppies to .pafs... or even the stems for that matter. The proof is in
the sound - the files played through Paris are alive and have depth. Same
mix in Nuendo...urrrgghh. I know that I'm getting a double belt of DA-AD
plus losing 4 bits of info through the Paris ADAT, but honestly the end
justifies the means. All i'm trying to add to the discussion is - if you
want the functionality of the native program plus the Paris sound its
readily achievable without having to jump through the '2nd computer as FX
buss' hoops.

Cheers,

David.

"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:453d9ba4$1@linux...
>
>
> Chuck,
>
> There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of somebody
> making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various possibilities,
> which one would assume would include:
>
> 1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality of an
> EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris allowing
> more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as the
EDS
> subs, or...
> 2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses the
emaulation
> of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow a Paris
> mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.
>
> I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in creating the
> VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the EDS
functionality
> and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio going
> through the card itself.
>
> This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow and
dedication
> got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to
mention
> the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this shennigans
> i would think.
>
> Cheers,
> Kim.
>
> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
> >
> >DJ,
> >
> >Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
focus
> >on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
> >
> >It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
> proprietary
> >dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
>
> >Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
doesn't
> >make sense to me.
> >
> >If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> > Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
> >
> >Chuck
>i'm going to sams club cuz they've got a sale on pepto...

On Mon, 23 Oct 2006 12:21:09 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:

>.......and in fact, I've already figured out a way to use at least two of
>them in this new rig, at least on the Paris mix bus once I've got all my
>fader automation done.
>
>;o)
>
>"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453d07b6$1@linux...
>> That's going to be a tough one all right.
>>
>> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:453d02d8@linux...
>> > Here's the problem I see happening...you're not going to want to part
>with
>> > those UAD cards
>> >
>> > And that'll mean.....
>> >
>> >
>> > "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote in message news:453ccf13@linux...
>> > > Uncle Ricky, his will actually be much *simpler* than what I'm doing
>> now.
>> > > MUCH simpler (well, at least, at first.....;o)
>> > >
>> > > ;o)
>> > >
>> > > "rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> > > news:m80pj29e48oh6kg3glt9lnj26agjtqgqfr@4ax.com...
>> > >> now my stomach hurts...
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 15:51:34 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> >I have ordered 2 x Scope II Project cards and a Sync plate so I can
>> > >> >clock
>> > >> >these. One of them will have the ADAT interface board (there were
>only
>> > > two
>> > >> >of these available in North America and since these are rare and
>> > > apparently
>> > >> >abnormal, I like that;o) for 24 ADAT I/O, a spdif I/O and a Midi
>I/O,
>> > >> >the
>> > >> >other will have what is called a ZLink interface. This ZLink thingie
>> > > allows
>> > >> >the addition of a couple of analog I/O boxes later on and includes
>an
>> > >> >unbalanced analog I/O, another ADAT I/O and a Midi I/O. Each card
>has
>> 7
>> > >> >x
>> > >> >SHARC DSP's and it's got a lot plugins bundled and there is a lot of
>> > > third
>> > >> >party support. It's sorta what I hoped Paris would evolve into, I
>> > >> >think.......sooo......if things o as planned I'll be patching the 32
>> I/O
>> > > of
>> > >> >the Scope cards to the ADAT inputs and outputs of 4 Paris ADAT
>> modules
>> > >> >across 4 x MECs and thereby have 8 x *realtime (as in no latency)*
>DSP
>> > > based
>> > >> >processors available per submix. This, along with native plugs and
>> > > hardware
>> > >> >DSP should get me down the road. I'm going to have to get some
>analog
>> > >> >interfaces for this though if I want to be able to chain analog FX
>> along
>> > >> >with digital FX to the Paris inserts. I'm going to wait and see if
>> > >> >everything else is going to be satisfactory before I jump this far
>> into
>> > > it.
>> > >> >I'll be using this a standalone DSP processor only which is all I've
>> > >> >ever
>> > >> >wanted all along when trying to integrate Cubase SX and Paris. I
>never
>> > > use
>> > >> >midi here and if I need it', the Creamware will work with Cubase SX.
>I
>> > > just
>> > >> >hope the FX are of the same general quality as the UAD-1. I don't
>> expect
>> > >> >them to be exactly the same, but I am hoping for the same kind of
>> vibe.
>> > >> >
>> > >> >Now the other part of the equation will be using an RME ADI4 DD (an
>> AES
>> > > to
>> > >> >ADAT format converter) to strap my 4 x hardware reverbs across the 4
>x
>> > > Paris
>> > >> >submixes by sending the outputs of each of the modules into the RME
>> box,
>> > >> >chaining the signal through the second ADAT module of each MEC and
>> > > returning
>> > >> >the signal to the RME box and the AES inputs of the hardware reverbs
>> to
>> > >> >complete the loop.
>> > >> >
>> > >> >If this works, I'll be moving a bunch of RME audio hardware and
>UAD-1
>> > > cards
>> > >> >outta' here PDQ. I'll post them up here to give ya'll first dibs.
>> > >> >
>> > >> >Deej
>> > >> >
>> > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>Hi James,
Have you checked on that with some kind of bit viewer ?
I found a website that says that it uses the optical connections with the
16bit format.
I know all ebay sites don't tell the truth but this is a must forme before
buying one so would want tobe 100 % certain.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>They still pass 24bits.
>
>James
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>
>>Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
>>bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
>>Just to let you know.
>>Regards,
>>Dimitrios
>Dear James and DJ,
Here is one thread :
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.audio.pro/browse_thread/t hread/9c3479188d31e8fc/93356fe3a8335016?lnk=st&q=midiman +digipatch+24+bit&rnum=3#93356fe3a8335016

I had a digipatch for a week before I sent it back. Beware of 24 bit audio

transmission. It didn't work with my 02R or my Apogees. Call their tech

support. Keep looking for the physical type, and let me know if you find

it. I saw one before from Full Comapss. I called them and they did not

have access to it.

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>They still pass 24bits.
>
>James
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>
>>Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
>>bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
>>Just to let you know.
>>Regards,
>>Dimitrios
>Another thread about being 16 bit only !!
It truncates !!
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.audio.pro/browse_thread/t hread/7099581c8a6a02e6/61b0facf99e54eca?lnk=st&q=midiman +digipatch+16bit&rnum=3#61b0facf99e54eca

Note that this unit only handles TYPE I ADAT (16-bit)... If you run
TYPE-II (20-bit) I/O, it WILL truncate.

Thats what the thread says.
You said that it passes 24 bit audio, well what if it passes but truncates
to 16 bit ?
Regards,
Dimitrios

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>They still pass 24bits.
>
>James
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>>
>>Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
>>bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
>>Just to let you know.
>>Regards,
>>Dimitrios
>Hi,
I have ordered the mytek digital clock which has 8 wc outs and one AES out.
I suppose the AES carries the wordcloc sync, right ?
Then with a AES to bnc transformer adaptor which tramnsforms the 110ohms
to 75 ohms I can probably connect another device with bnc wordclock input
, right ?

Now here is one nice question.
A AES/EBU distributor from Aardvark (1 to 6)which accepts one aes input and
outputs to 6 would that work as clock distributor ?
To further use 110/75 transformer adptors to connect more devices ?
Regards,
Dimitrios"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.ne> wrote:

>Even more, I don;t agree with this new trend of adding more CPU powerer,
>thinking that it will yield you better summing or sound.
>It won't!!

Perhaps not, but what it WILL do is allow you to get into
using very processor-intensive tools while still running a lot
of tracks. For example, If you mix with Izotope Ozone across
your 2-buss, you could mix with super high-quality program
compression, brickwall limiting, and a stereo image enhancer
right in place... however, Ozone is very CPU-intensive (I've
done this before in SX, but I've had to "freeze" a lot of
tracks in order to be abe to accommodate it. No big deal unless
you want to make changes to any of those tracks inserts, then
you have to unfreeze/tweak/refreeze.

Another thing it enables you to do is to get into convo or
modeled reverbs on the same computer - i.e.: no having to
dedicate a separate box for EFX. I have nothing against DSP-
based stuff, but there are a couple of really cool - but SUPER-
cpu-intensive verbs out there... did anyone else check out the
demo for theRayspace reverb that Deej (i think it was Deej,
anyway) posted a link for? If not, go check it out.... here's
the link:

http://www.quikquak.com/software.html

Simply amazing, IMO; but very much a CPU hog. So much so that I
can't use it at all - I was able to try it on a drum group
only after disabling half of the tracks on a particular project.

NeilI don't think anyone believes cpu power has anything to do with sound
quality, just as lowering channels by 22dB and raising the master buss by
22dB has nothing to do with improving sound quality - it's just a matter of
managing levels for the user instead of the user lowering the fader by 22dB.

Nothing wrong with a faster machine to allow more fx processing... or FX
Teleport, Wormhole or VST System Link.

Regards,
Dedric

On 10/24/06 7:02 AM, in article 453e0efb$1@linux, "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com>
wrote:

>
> "LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.ne> wrote:
>
>> Even more, I don;t agree with this new trend of adding more CPU powerer,
>> thinking that it will yield you better summing or sound.
>> It won't!!
>
> Perhaps not, but what it WILL do is allow you to get into
> using very processor-intensive tools while still running a lot
> of tracks. For example, If you mix with Izotope Ozone across
> your 2-buss, you could mix with super high-quality program
> compression, brickwall limiting, and a stereo image enhancer
> right in place... however, Ozone is very CPU-intensive (I've
> done this before in SX, but I've had to "freeze" a lot of
> tracks in order to be abe to accommodate it. No big deal unless
> you want to make changes to any of those tracks inserts, then
> you have to unfreeze/tweak/refreeze.
>
> Another thing it enables you to do is to get into convo or
> modeled reverbs on the same computer - i.e.: no having to
> dedicate a separate box for EFX. I have nothing against DSP-
> based stuff, but there are a couple of really cool - but SUPER-
> cpu-intensive verbs out there... did anyone else check out the
> demo for theRayspace reverb that Deej (i think it was Deej,
> anyway) posted a link for? If not, go check it out.... here's
> the link:
>
> http://www.quikquak.com/software.html
>
> Simply amazing, IMO; but very much a CPU hog. So much so that I
> can't use it at all - I was able to try it on a drum group
> only after disabling half of the tracks on a particular project.
>
> NeilDedric, You have experience in both Cubase and Paris if I'm not
mistaken, I'm about to receive Cubase using presonus digimax fs pres.
Can you elaborate on what sonic differences I should expect to
experience pro and con?

Thanks,
John

Dedric Terry wrote:
> I don't think anyone believes cpu power has anything to do with sound
> quality, just as lowering channels by 22dB and raising the master buss by
> 22dB has nothing to do with improving sound quality - it's just a matter of
> managing levels for the user instead of the user lowering the fader by 22dB.
>
> Nothing wrong with a faster machine to allow more fx processing... or FX
> Teleport, Wormhole or VST System Link.
>
> Regards,
> Dedric
>
> On 10/24/06 7:02 AM, in article 453e0efb$1@linux, "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com>
> wrote:
>
>> "LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.ne> wrote:
>>
>>> Even more, I don;t agree with this new trend of adding more CPU powerer,
>>> thinking that it will yield you better summing or sound.
>>> It won't!!
>> Perhaps not, but what it WILL do is allow you to get into
>> using very processor-intensive tools while still running a lot
>> of tracks. For example, If you mix with Izotope Ozone across
>> your 2-buss, you could mix with super high-quality program
>> compression, brickwall limiting, and a stereo image enhancer
>> right in place... however, Ozone is very CPU-intensive (I've
>> done this before in SX, but I've had to "freeze" a lot of
>> tracks in order to be abe to accommodate it. No big deal unless
>> you want to make changes to any of those tracks inserts, then
>> you have to unfreeze/tweak/refreeze.
>>
>> Another thing it enables you to do is to get into convo or
>> modeled reverbs on the same computer - i.e.: no having to
>> dedicate a separate box for EFX. I have nothing against DSP-
>> based stuff, but there are a couple of really cool - but SUPER-
>> cpu-intensive verbs out there... did anyone else check out the
>> demo for theRayspace reverb that Deej (i think it was Deej,
>> anyway) posted a link for? If not, go check it out.... here's
>> the link:
>>
>> http://www.quikquak.com/software.html
>>
>> Simply amazing, IMO; but very much a CPU hog. So much so that I
>> can't use it at all - I was able to try it on a drum group
>> only after disabling half of the tracks on a particular project.
>>
>> Neil
>TC <tc@spammetodeathyoubastards.org> wrote:
> PafWav convert (free utility, not sure if it's still online somewhere),
> or Wavelab also reads and converts paf files.

Sorry to not reply earlier, but you can get PafWavConvert on
ParisFAQs.com...

Doug (Finally got a newsreader installed on my Mac...!)This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C6F754.2343B070
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dimitrios,
I'm not sure AES/EBU carries clock. I thought it didn't.
I may be wrong. Better check on that one.
Tom
"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =
news:453df85b$1@linux...

Hi,
I have ordered the mytek digital clock which has 8 wc outs and one AES =
out.
I suppose the AES carries the wordcloc sync, right ?
Then with a AES to bnc transformer adaptor which tramnsforms the =
110ohms
to 75 ohms I can probably connect another device with bnc wordclock =
input
, right ?

Now here is one nice question.
A AES/EBU distributor from Aardvark (1 to 6)which accepts one aes =
input and
outputs to 6 would that work as clock distributor ?
To further use 110/75 transformer adptors to connect more devices ?
Regards,
Dimitrios

I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C6F754.2343B070
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>Dimitrios,</DIV>
<DIV>I'm not sure AES/EBU carries =
clock.  I thought=20
it didn't.</DIV>
<DIV>I may be wrong.  Better check on =
that=20
one.</DIV>
<DIV>Tom</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Dimitrios" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>> wrote in =
message=20
<A =
href=3D"news:453df85b$1@linux">news:453df85b$1@linux</A>...</DIV> Hi,<=
BR>I=20
have ordered the mytek digital clock which has 8 wc outs and one AES =
out. I=20
suppose the AES carries the wordcloc sync, right ? Then with a AES =
to bnc=20
transformer adaptor which tramnsforms the 110ohms to 75 ohms I can =
probably=20
connect another device with bnc wordclock input , right =
? Now here=20
is one nice question. A AES/EBU distributor from Aardvark (1 to =
6)which=20
accepts one aes input and outputs to 6 would that work as clock =
distributor=20
? To further use 110/75 transformer adptors to connect more devices =

? Regards, Dimitrios</BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, =
and=20
you? <A=20
href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
..html</A>   </DIV></BODY ></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0036_01C6F754.2343B070--Hmmmm..........I've been around the block with this before. It is also said
that these don't allow 96K.......... MAudio tech support says these pass 24
bit/96k bit for bit-sample for sample.

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453dc0c9$1@linux...
>
> Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
> bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
> Just to let you know.
> Regards,
> Dimitrios"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:

�Hi,
I have ordered the mytek digital clock which has 8 wc outs and one AES out.
I suppose the AES carries the wordcloc sync, right ?�

It should, my Mytek converter supports this.

�Then with a AES to bnc transformer adaptor which tramnsforms the 110ohms
to 75 ohms I can probably connect another device with bnc wordclock input
, right ?�

Yes. I�ve had good luck with the Canare
Transformers.

�Now here is one nice question.
A AES/EBU distributor from Aardvark (1 to 6)which accepts one aes input and
outputs to 6 would that work as clock distributor ?
To further use 110/75 transformer adaptors to connect more devices?�

This may work but it could be delayed from the original clock.

GeneMy Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear that
there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's not
bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are not
as good as you may think..

"espresso" <audio@espressodigital.com> wrote:
>I posted this a while ago.. I now use Nuendo with a Layla 3G to output
8 x
>analog channels and 8 x ADAT stems to Paris ie. Paris is now my mixer, its
>in the same computer, its easy....hardly any overhead as all Paris is doing
>is sitting in 'live' mode. I've been doing a bunch of live concert DVDs
with
>50 odd channels - 2 hour files - no chance I'd be wanting to convert all
>those puppies to .pafs... or even the stems for that matter. The proof is
in
>the sound - the files played through Paris are alive and have depth. Same
>mix in Nuendo...urrrgghh. I know that I'm getting a double belt of DA-AD
>plus losing 4 bits of info through the Paris ADAT, but honestly the end
>justifies the means. All i'm trying to add to the discussion is - if you
>want the functionality of the native program plus the Paris sound its
>readily achievable without having to jump through the '2nd computer as FX
>buss' hoops.
>
>Cheers,
>
>David.
>
>
>"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:453d9ba4$1@linux...
>>
>>
>> Chuck,
>>
>> There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of somebody
>> making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various possibilities,
>> which one would assume would include:
>>
>> 1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality of
an
>> EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris allowing
>> more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as the
>EDS
>> subs, or...
>> 2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses the
>emaulation
>> of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow a Paris
>> mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.
>>
>> I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in creating
the
>> VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the EDS
>functionality
>> and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio going
>> through the card itself.
>>
>> This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow and
>dedication
>> got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to
>mention
>> the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this shennigans
>> i would think.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Kim.
>>
>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >DJ,
>> >
>> >Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
>focus
>> >on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>> >
>> >It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
>> proprietary
>> >dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
>>
>> >Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
>doesn't
>> >make sense to me.
>> >
>> >If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
>> > Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>> >
>> >Chuck
>>
>
>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_00DC_01C6F745.D72B96C0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

It will work just fine. I have done this sending AES out of my Mytek =
Stereo96 A/D converter to a Lucid GenX-6 with the Lucid set to =
distribute the clock signal. Just make sure the Aardsync can slave to =
sample rates above 48K if you intend to use them.

Deej

"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
news:453e1bf0@linux...
Dimitrios,
I'm not sure AES/EBU carries clock. I thought it didn't.
I may be wrong. Better check on that one.
Tom
"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =
news:453df85b$1@linux...

Hi,
I have ordered the mytek digital clock which has 8 wc outs and one =
AES out.
I suppose the AES carries the wordcloc sync, right ?
Then with a AES to bnc transformer adaptor which tramnsforms the =
110ohms
to 75 ohms I can probably connect another device with bnc wordclock =
input
, right ?

Now here is one nice question.
A AES/EBU distributor from Aardvark (1 to 6)which accepts one aes =
input and
outputs to 6 would that work as clock distributor ?
To further use 110/75 transformer adptors to connect more devices ?
Regards,
Dimitrios

I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html =20

------=_NextPart_000_00DC_01C6F745.D72B96C0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4134.100" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>It will work just fine. I have done =
this sending=20
AES out of my Mytek Stereo96 A/D converter to a Lucid GenX-6 with the =
Lucid set=20
to distribute the clock signal. Just make sure the Aardsync can slave to =
sample=20
rates above 48K if you intend to use them.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Deej</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Tom Bruhl" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>> wrote =
in message=20
<A href=3D"news:453e1bf0@linux">news:453e1bf0@linux</A>...</DIV>
<DIV>Dimitrios,</DIV>
<DIV>I'm not sure AES/EBU carries =
clock.  I=20
thought it didn't.</DIV>
<DIV>I may be wrong.  Better check on =
that=20
one.</DIV>
<DIV>Tom</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Dimitrios" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>> wrote =
in message=20
<A=20
=
href=3D"news:453df85b$1@linux">news:453df85b$1@linux</A>...</DIV> Hi,<=
BR>I=20
have ordered the mytek digital clock which has 8 wc outs and one AES =

out. I suppose the AES carries the wordcloc sync, right ? Then =
with a=20
AES to bnc transformer adaptor which tramnsforms the 110ohms to =
75 ohms I=20
can probably connect another device with bnc wordclock input , =
right=20
? Now here is one nice question. A AES/EBU distributor =
from=20
Aardvark (1 to 6)which accepts one aes input and outputs to 6 =
would that=20
work as clock distributor ? To further use 110/75 transformer =
adptors to=20
connect more devices ? Regards, Dimitrios</BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, =
and=20
you? <A=20
=
href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
..html</A>   </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE ></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_00DC_01C6F745.D72B96C0--My wife agrees with you LaMont. She can pick out a native mix like a buzzard
circling roadkill at 3000'.

"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote in message news:453e20c4$1@linux...
>
> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear that
> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's not
> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are not
> as good as you may think..
>
>
> "espresso" <audio@espressodigital.com> wrote:
> >I posted this a while ago.. I now use Nuendo with a Layla 3G to output
> 8 x
> >analog channels and 8 x ADAT stems to Paris ie. Paris is now my mixer,
its
> >in the same computer, its easy....hardly any overhead as all Paris is
doing
> >is sitting in 'live' mode. I've been doing a bunch of live concert DVDs
> with
> >50 odd channels - 2 hour files - no chance I'd be wanting to convert all
> >those puppies to .pafs... or even the stems for that matter. The proof is
> in
> >the sound - the files played through Paris are alive and have depth. Same
> >mix in Nuendo...urrrgghh. I know that I'm getting a double belt of DA-AD
> >plus losing 4 bits of info through the Paris ADAT, but honestly the end
> >justifies the means. All i'm trying to add to the discussion is - if you
> >want the functionality of the native program plus the Paris sound its
> >readily achievable without having to jump through the '2nd computer as FX
> >buss' hoops.
> >
> >Cheers,
> >
> >David.
> >
> >
> >"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:453d9ba4$1@linux...
> >>
> >>
> >> Chuck,
> >>
> >> There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of
somebody
> >> making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various
possibilities,
> >> which one would assume would include:
> >>
> >> 1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality of
> an
> >> EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris
allowing
> >> more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as the
> >EDS
> >> subs, or...
> >> 2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses the
> >emaulation
> >> of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow a
Paris
> >> mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.
> >>
> >> I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in creating
> the
> >> VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the EDS
> >functionality
> >> and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio
going
> >> through the card itself.
> >>
> >> This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow and
> >dedication
> >> got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to
> >mention
> >> the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this
shennigans
> >> i would think.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Kim.
> >>
> >> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >DJ,
> >> >
> >> >Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
> >focus
> >> >on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
> >> >
> >> >It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another
weird,
> >> proprietary
> >> >dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it
gets.
> >>
> >> >Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
> >doesn't
> >> >make sense to me.
> >> >
> >> >If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is
wrong.
> >> > Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
> >> >
> >> >Chuck
> >>
> >
> >
>Thanks DJ,
Gene what happens if the clcock gets delayed thru the aardvaark 1x6 distributor
?
I mean I have read that many buy wordclock devices that support 3-4 wc outputs
and then they use a distributor for further clcoking, isn't it the same delaying
factor involved ?
Does this matter sonically ?
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Gene Lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>
>�Hi,
>I have ordered the mytek digital clock which has 8 wc outs and one AES out.
>I suppose the AES carries the wordcloc sync, right ?�
>
>It should, my Mytek converter supports this.
>
>�Then with a AES to bnc transformer adaptor which tramnsforms the 110ohms
>to 75 ohms I can probably connect another device with bnc wordclock input
>, right ?�
>
>Yes. I�ve had good luck with the Canare
>Transformers.
>
>�Now here is one nice question.
>A AES/EBU distributor from Aardvark (1 to 6)which accepts one aes input
and
>outputs to 6 would that work as clock distributor ?
>To further use 110/75 transformer adaptors to connect more devices?�
>
>
>This may work but it could be delayed from the original clock.
>
>
>Gene
>Doug,
Good to see your post,how are you doing?
What you been up to?

respect
Nappy

Doug Wellington <doug@parisfaqs.com> wrote:
>TC <tc@spammetodeathyoubastards.org> wrote:
>> PafWav convert (free utility, not sure if it's still online somewhere),
>> or Wavelab also reads and converts paf files.
>
>Sorry to not reply earlier, but you can get PafWavConvert on
>ParisFAQs.com...
>
>Doug (Finally got a newsreader installed on my Mac...!)
>DJ,
I suspect that they truncate according to the date of their release.
One way to to see inside is to detect if the adat connectors on pcb have
6 legs and not 3 or 4.

Also to be sure please make the following.
Try to record an adat signal from digipatch adat out to Paris adat in and
then use the free vst plugin bitviewer to see it it is 20 bits.
At least we will know if it passes 20 bits.
It is important to all of us !
Do you know what it means if you all this time were recrording and patching
all the way truncating the bits ??
Maybe thats a cause of what you were hearing when you were sending over to
cuabse and then back and you wanted to use dither etc...
Regards,
Dimitrios

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>Hmmmm..........I've been around the block with this before. It is also said
>that these don't allow 96K.......... MAudio tech support says these pass
24
>bit/96k bit for bit-sample for sample.
>
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453dc0c9$1@linux...
>>
>> Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
>> bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
>> Just to let you know.
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>
>Thanks DJ,
>Gene what happens if the clcock gets delayed thru the aardvaark 1x6 distributor
>?
>I mean I have read that many buy wordclock devices that support 3-4 wc outputs
>and then they use a distributor for further clcoking, isn't it the same
delaying
>factor involved ?
>Does this matter sonically ?
>Regards,
>Dimitrios

It�s the potential "Dreaded Clicks".
Like most complex wordclock setups, you will need to try it to know for sure.
GeneHi Doug ?
How are you ?
Any time spend with Paris code programming :) ?
Regards,
Dimitrios

Doug Wellington <doug@parisfaqs.com> wrote:
>TC <tc@spammetodeathyoubastards.org> wrote:
>> PafWav convert (free utility, not sure if it's still online somewhere),
>> or Wavelab also reads and converts paf files.
>
>Sorry to not reply earlier, but you can get PafWavConvert on
>ParisFAQs.com...
>
>Doug (Finally got a newsreader installed on my Mac...!)
>DJ,
Here is another proof of digipatch beeing 16bit...

http://www.technosound.com.cy/easyconsole.cfm?id=526&lan g=gr

Regards,
Dimitrios

Note: The Litepipe protocol used by the Digipatch, known as DT-16, is a format
intended to support 16-bit Type I ADAT devices. Other Litepipe formats are
not guaranteed to work reliably. All coaxial S/PDIF and Optical S/PDIF (TosLink)
are fully supported.

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>Hmmmm..........I've been around the block with this before. It is also said
>that these don't allow 96K.......... MAudio tech support says these pass
24
>bit/96k bit for bit-sample for sample.
>
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453dc0c9$1@linux...
>>
>> Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
>> bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
>> Just to let you know.
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>
> http://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/ts/detail.php?Index=1254 6&keyword=M-Audio

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>Hmmmm..........I've been around the block with this before. It is also said
>that these don't allow 96K.......... MAudio tech support says these pass
24
>bit/96k bit for bit-sample for sample.
>
>
>"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453dc0c9$1@linux...
>>
>> Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
>> bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
>> Just to let you know.
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear that
>there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's not
>bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are not
>as good as you may think..

There IS something going on... IME, I think that a lot of people
are using the tool in a manner in which it was not designed for.
It's not designed to accomodate 50 tracks worth of clips/overs
resulting in hundreds of thousands of errors per second... it's
as simple as that.
I don't think anyone who's said you can get good mixes out of
Native suystems has insisted that it sounds exactly like Paris
(or PT, or analog, or anything else), so is something different
going on? Yeah... it's different - doesn't mean that it can't be
good.Chuck,

By and large I agree with this, which is why I don't have a Pulsar card when
I could easily afford one. But I'll say this, you can't get any of John Bowen's
synths (www.zargmusic.com) on a native system, reverbs still throttle CPUs,
and Stephan Sprenger thought seriously about coding for Pulsar. He decided
not to _because_ it was so proprietary and becasue the vendor competed with
the third parties, but he liked the idea.

I remember many, many moons ago using another proprietary product that was
DOA on the market--the OASYS PCI card. Had they taken the time to put pretty
plug-in interfaces that could be used directly inside a VST/PT host I think
they would have sold a ton of them. I know it's stupid, but just being able
to lay off some of the really intense processors to a DSP chip, having a
decent hardware mixer for routing, and the extra goodies of a DSP card can
be really useful. And at $750 a Pulsar gets me all of that for cost of 5-8
good native plug-ins.

I think the reason UAD has done relatively well with their cards is just
this, they make things easier and they sound good. The Pulsar line _could_
be that if they do it right.

TCB

"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>DJ,
>
>Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to focus
>on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>
>It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
proprietary
>dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.

>Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just doesn't
>make sense to me.
>
>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
>ChuckI hear you Deej, I'm half dead now. My left side has gone numb. Or is it
my right side?

Plus, I have a Powerplay Pro-XL that I haven't been able to kill, and
now it may never die...

I guess I'll just get the K240S and see if the numbness goes away, but
the headset amp is probably safe now.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com

DJ wrote:
> I don't know who works on these but without my older (600 ohm) K240DF's I
> would die.......plus....you can kill Behringer headphone amps with these
> too.
>
> ;op
>
>
> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:453daccc@linux...
>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.
>> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
> itself.
>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>
>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>
>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>
>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead
>> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>Hi Dj,
Try running the Digipatch thru you RME card and use RME Digicheck
software bit meter or wavelab they will both confirm 16 bit only.
The bastards...
Chris

DJ wrote:
> Hmmmm..........I've been around the block with this before. It is also said
> that these don't allow 96K.......... MAudio tech support says these pass 24
> bit/96k bit for bit-sample for sample.
>
>
> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message news:453dc0c9$1@linux...
>> Hey DJ in search for a digital patcjhbay I found that your midiman digital
>> bays are only 16 bit adat compliant.
>> Just to let you know.
>> Regards,
>> Dimitrios
>
>

--
Chris Ludwig

ADK Pro Audio
(859) 635-5762
www.adkproaudio.com
chrisl@adkproaudio.comHi Gene,
The chip we got is a pre-production unmarked one for testing. The ones
you want are the quad core xeons that supposedly drop in to the G5s!! :)

Chris

Gene Lennon wrote:
> Chris Ludwig <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote:
>> HI DJ,
>> The Scope will do the trick if:
>> 1. It works with your chipset and motherboard. (It will probably work
>> better on your old system.)
>> 2. You want to use it's internal effects and synths only.
>> 3. It can run at very low latencies like the RME and Lynx cards can
>> under the same CPU load for all the of the Native VSTi and effects you have.
>>
>> If it it doesn't do well for any of the above extremely well then there
>
>> is no benefit to it at all Personally I think purely native is the way
>> to go with the UADs being used during the mixing stages when latency
>> isn't as important.
>>
>>
>> FYI-
>> Here is a benchmark I just did today with the new single socket Quad
>> Core Intel CPU i.e.. 4 cpus on one chip. A 48k buffer on the the
>> Fireface is approx 2ms. With a Multiface I think the 64k buffer is 1.5ms.
>>
>> system-
>> N3
>> thonex test
>> 975 chipset mobo
>> Quad core 2.66
>> RME Fireface latest non-beta
>>
>> 48k buffer @ 40% cpu load absolutely clean. At 64k it was 31%. We
>> haven't seen any machine to date be able to play back this Thonex test
>> at a 48k buffer totally clean.
>>
>>
>> 64k buffer is the lowest any systems have been able to go at these CPU
>> loads.
>> Core2 Duo 2.66 - 58%
>> Dual core Opteron 2.6 - 58%
>> AMD FX60 - 73%
>> AMD X2 4400 - 70%
>> Dual Core "Wood crest" Xeon 2.0 gig - 53%
>> P4 955 3.4g - 76%
>>
>
> Chris.
> Is that the chip that will turn my G5 quad into a G5X8?
> Hint, hint.
> Gene
>

--
Chris Ludwig

ADK Pro Audio
(859) 635-5762
www.adkproaudio.com
chrisl@adkproaudio.comHI Neil,

Yes we built but no price yet sense the chips aren't in retail channels
yet.
it will less than a dual opteron 280.

Chris

Neil wrote:
> Chris, I assume this is one of the systems that you built? If
> so, how much $$$ are we talking about for that kind of rig?
>
> Neil
>
>
> Chris Ludwig <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote:
>> HI DJ,
>> The Scope will do the trick if:
>> 1. It works with your chipset and motherboard. (It will probably work
>> better on your old system.)
>> 2. You want to use it's internal effects and synths only.
>> 3. It can run at very low latencies like the RME and Lynx cards can
>> under the same CPU load for all the of the Native VSTi and effects you have.
>>
>> If it it doesn't do well for any of the above extremely well then there
>
>> is no benefit to it at all Personally I think purely native is the way
>> to go with the UADs being used during the mixing stages when latency
>> isn't as important.
>>
>>
>> FYI-
>> Here is a benchmark I just did today with the new single socket Quad
>> Core Intel CPU i.e.. 4 cpus on one chip. A 48k buffer on the the
>> Fireface is approx 2ms. With a Multiface I think the 64k buffer is 1.5ms.
>>
>> system-
>> N3
>> thonex test
>> 975 chipset mobo
>> Quad core 2.66
>> RME Fireface latest non-beta
>>
>> 48k buffer @ 40% cpu load absolutely clean. At 64k it was 31%. We
>> haven't seen any machine to date be able to play back this Thonex test
>> at a 48k buffer totally clean.
>>
>>
>> 64k buffer is the lowest any systems have been able to go at these CPU
>> loads.
>> Core2 Duo 2.66 - 58%
>> Dual core Opteron 2.6 - 58%
>> AMD FX60 - 73%
>> AMD X2 4400 - 70%
>> Dual Core "Wood crest" Xeon 2.0 gig - 53%
>> P4 955 3.4g - 76%
>>
>> DJ wrote:
>>
>>> OK Chuck,
>>>
>>> I'll bite. I'll have a native system here irregardless of what audio card
>>> I'm using. I don't plan to sell of anything until I'm convinced that the
>>> Scope cards are the ticket for me. Right now I'm in the middle of recabling
>>> the studio, but it will be pretty simple for me to configure it so that
> I
>>> can just restore a Ghost image, reconfigure the digital connects and pop
> in
>>> the Magma PCI cards, and I'm back to the RME/UAD-1 rig that I've been
>>> running. I have always intended to keep this viable for a while. The only
>>> major change I'll be making is the mobo on both rigs. In the near future,
>>> both the Paris system and the Native system will be running on Gigabyte
>>> GA-K8NS Ultra 939 mobos, but in the meantime, what I've got now is working.
>>> Believe me, I would dearly love to get a native system sounding like Paris
>>> and I'll gladly help you beta whatever plugin you might develop or jump
>>> through some experimental hoops, and I'm sure Neil, Dedric, Gene, Dave,
>>> LaMont will have great suggestions since they are much further along in
>>> native world than I am........but I'm also going to be getting another
> wierd
>>> proprietary DAW happening......the stuff is already on the way here.
>>>
>>> ;o)
>>>
>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote in message news:453d565a$1@linux...
>>>
>>>
>>>> DJ,
>>>>
>>>> Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
>>>>
>>>>
>>> focus
>>>
>>>
>>>> on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>>>>
>>>> It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another weird,
>>>>
>>>>
>>> proprietary
>>>
>>>
>>>> dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it gets.
>>>> Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
>>>>
>>>>
>>> doesn't
>>>
>>>
>>>> make sense to me.
>>>>
>>>> If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
>>>> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>>>>
>>>> Chuck
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> --
>> Chris Ludwig
>> ADK
>> chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
>> www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
>> (859) 635-5762
>

--
Chris Ludwig

ADK Pro Audio
(859) 635-5762
www.adkproaudio.com
chrisl@adkproaudio.comI've played the same gear forever, including an 18 watt amp that is a cross
between as AC-30 and an AC-15. I put a THD power soak on so I can play it
completely opened up. It sounds incredible, both in my opinion and in the
opinion of many, many people who have complimented me on my guitar sound.
I played a gig two weeks ago as the local band opening up for a national
tour. The sound person (a woman actually, with a lovely British accent) asked
if I would mind using the headliner's amp. I don't think I had any choice.
The amp the headliner had was a gorgeously restored AC-30 so I could hardly
complain. However, since I've used the same strat, LP, and Top Hat soaked
down all of these years it didn't sound or feel like _my_ gear and I had
a really tough time. I made some out and out mistakes, mostly because I was
trying to get more compression and grit out of the Vox than was there and
I tried to correct it by playing harder. Does that mean that beautifully
restored AC-30s sound bad?

Your wife didn't like the first non-PARIS mix you've done in years. Does
that mean native sounds bad?

Discuss.

"DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>My wife agrees with you LaMont. She can pick out a native mix like a buzzard
>circling roadkill at 3000'.
>
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote in message news:453e20c4$1@linux...
>>
>> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear
that
>> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's
not
>> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are not
>> as good as you may think..
>>
>>
>> "espresso" <audio@espressodigital.com> wrote:
>> >I posted this a while ago.. I now use Nuendo with a Layla 3G to output
>> 8 x
>> >analog channels and 8 x ADAT stems to Paris ie. Paris is now my mixer,
>its
>> >in the same computer, its easy....hardly any overhead as all Paris is
>doing
>> >is sitting in 'live' mode. I've been doing a bunch of live concert DVDs
>> with
>> >50 odd channels - 2 hour files - no chance I'd be wanting to convert
all
>> >those puppies to .pafs... or even the stems for that matter. The proof
is
>> in
>> >the sound - the files played through Paris are alive and have depth.
Same
>> >mix in Nuendo...urrrgghh. I know that I'm getting a double belt of DA-AD
>> >plus losing 4 bits of info through the Paris ADAT, but honestly the end
>> >justifies the means. All i'm trying to add to the discussion is - if
you
>> >want the functionality of the native program plus the Paris sound its
>> >readily achievable without having to jump through the '2nd computer as
FX
>> >buss' hoops.
>> >
>> >Cheers,
>> >
>> >David.
>> >
>> >
>> >"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:453d9ba4$1@linux...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Chuck,
>> >>
>> >> There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of
>somebody
>> >> making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various
>possibilities,
>> >> which one would assume would include:
>> >>
>> >> 1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality
of
>> an
>> >> EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris
>allowing
>> >> more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as
the
>> >EDS
>> >> subs, or...
>> >> 2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses the
>> >emaulation
>> >> of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow
a
>Paris
>> >> mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.
>> >>
>> >> I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in creating
>> the
>> >> VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the EDS
>> >functionality
>> >> and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio
>going
>> >> through the card itself.
>> >>
>> >> This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow
and
>> >dedication
>> >> got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to
>> >mention
>> >> the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this
>shennigans
>> >> i would think.
>> >>
>> >> Cheers,
>> >> Kim.
>> >>
>> >> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >DJ,
>> >> >
>> >> >Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need
to
>> >focus
>> >> >on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>> >> >
>> >> >It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another
>weird,
>> >> proprietary
>> >> >dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it
>gets.
>> >>
>> >> >Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
>> >doesn't
>> >> >make sense to me.
>> >> >
>> >> >If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is
>wrong.
>> >> > Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>> >> >
>> >> >Chuck
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>If DJ's wife is not happy, nobody's happy ! hehe
John

TCB wrote:
> I've played the same gear forever, including an 18 watt amp that is a cross
> between as AC-30 and an AC-15. I put a THD power soak on so I can play it
> completely opened up. It sounds incredible, both in my opinion and in the
> opinion of many, many people who have complimented me on my guitar sound.
> I played a gig two weeks ago as the local band opening up for a national
> tour. The sound person (a woman actually, with a lovely British accent) asked
> if I would mind using the headliner's amp. I don't think I had any choice.
> The amp the headliner had was a gorgeously restored AC-30 so I could hardly
> complain. However, since I've used the same strat, LP, and Top Hat soaked
> down all of these years it didn't sound or feel like _my_ gear and I had
> a really tough time. I made some out and out mistakes, mostly because I was
> trying to get more compression and grit out of the Vox than was there and
> I tried to correct it by playing harder. Does that mean that beautifully
> restored AC-30s sound bad?
>
> Your wife didn't like the first non-PARIS mix you've done in years. Does
> that mean native sounds bad?
>
> Discuss.
>
> "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>> My wife agrees with you LaMont. She can pick out a native mix like a buzzard
>> circling roadkill at 3000'.
>>
>>
>> "LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote in message news:453e20c4$1@linux...
>>> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear
> that
>>> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's
> not
>>> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are not
>>> as good as you may think..
>>>
>>>
>>> "espresso" <audio@espressodigital.com> wrote:
>>>> I posted this a while ago.. I now use Nuendo with a Layla 3G to output
>>> 8 x
>>>> analog channels and 8 x ADAT stems to Paris ie. Paris is now my mixer,
>> its
>>>> in the same computer, its easy....hardly any overhead as all Paris is
>> doing
>>>> is sitting in 'live' mode. I've been doing a bunch of live concert DVDs
>>> with
>>>> 50 odd channels - 2 hour files - no chance I'd be wanting to convert
> all
>>>> those puppies to .pafs... or even the stems for that matter. The proof
> is
>>> in
>>>> the sound - the files played through Paris are alive and have depth.
> Same
>>>> mix in Nuendo...urrrgghh. I know that I'm getting a double belt of DA-AD
>>>> plus losing 4 bits of info through the Paris ADAT, but honestly the end
>>>> justifies the means. All i'm trying to add to the discussion is - if
> you
>>>> want the functionality of the native program plus the Paris sound its
>>>> readily achievable without having to jump through the '2nd computer as
> FX
>>>> buss' hoops.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> David.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:453d9ba4$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> Chuck,
>>>>>
>>>>> There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of
>> somebody
>>>>> making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various
>> possibilities,
>>>>> which one would assume would include:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality
> of
>>> an
>>>>> EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris
>> allowing
>>>>> more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as
> the
>>>> EDS
>>>>> subs, or...
>>>>> 2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses the
>>>> emaulation
>>>>> of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow
> a
>> Paris
>>>>> mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.
>>>>>
>>>>> I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in creating
>>> the
>>>>> VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the EDS
>>>> functionality
>>>>> and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio
>> going
>>>>> through the card itself.
>>>>>
>>>>> This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow
> and
>>>> dedication
>>>>> got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to
>>>> mention
>>>>> the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this
>> shennigans
>>>>> i would think.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Kim.
>>>>>
>>>>> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>>> DJ,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need
> to
>>>> focus
>>>>>> on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another
>> weird,
>>>>> proprietary
>>>>>> dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it
>> gets.
>>>>>> Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
>>>> doesn't
>>>>>> make sense to me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is
>> wrong.
>>>>>> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chuck
>>>>
>>
>Intel Core 2 Duo 64 bit, more RAM, bigger HD. Firewire 800, double layer
superdrive.

http://www.apple.com/macbookpro/intel.html

64 bit is important to me for upcoming OSX versions and 3D animation
software updates.

The MacBooks will likely also get the Core 2 Duo at some point.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.comhttp://www.presonus.com/faderport.htmlChances are the headband (AKG part number #2040M0209) has broken
inside the earcup, and the wire has come off. To check this, use a
heat gun to WARM the aluminum cap on the side of the housing (taking
care not to melt the plastic). Once warmed, gently pry up the cap
(the heat will soften the glue). Remove the phillips screw under the
cap to remove the cover and expose the wiring. You can simply solder
the wire back on, but if the headband is broken, it should be replaced.

David.

Jamie K wrote:
>
> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.
> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
> itself.
>
> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>
> A) A good place to fix it?
>
> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>
> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead
> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.comi hope to god you don't use that as a compliment when you tell amy how
much you appreciate her senses...whew...

On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 08:29:15 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:

>My wife agrees with you LaMont. She can pick out a native mix like a buzzard
>circling roadkill at 3000'.
>
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote in message news:453e20c4$1@linux...
>>
>> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear that
>> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's not
>> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are not
>> as good as you may think..
>>
>>
>> "espresso" <audio@espressodigital.com> wrote:
>> >I posted this a while ago.. I now use Nuendo with a Layla 3G to output
>> 8 x
>> >analog channels and 8 x ADAT stems to Paris ie. Paris is now my mixer,
>its
>> >in the same computer, its easy....hardly any overhead as all Paris is
>doing
>> >is sitting in 'live' mode. I've been doing a bunch of live concert DVDs
>> with
>> >50 odd channels - 2 hour files - no chance I'd be wanting to convert all
>> >those puppies to .pafs... or even the stems for that matter. The proof is
>> in
>> >the sound - the files played through Paris are alive and have depth. Same
>> >mix in Nuendo...urrrgghh. I know that I'm getting a double belt of DA-AD
>> >plus losing 4 bits of info through the Paris ADAT, but honestly the end
>> >justifies the means. All i'm trying to add to the discussion is - if you
>> >want the functionality of the native program plus the Paris sound its
>> >readily achievable without having to jump through the '2nd computer as FX
>> >buss' hoops.
>> >
>> >Cheers,
>> >
>> >David.
>> >
>> >
>> >"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:453d9ba4$1@linux...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Chuck,
>> >>
>> >> There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of
>somebody
>> >> making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various
>possibilities,
>> >> which one would assume would include:
>> >>
>> >> 1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality of
>> an
>> >> EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris
>allowing
>> >> more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as the
>> >EDS
>> >> subs, or...
>> >> 2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses the
>> >emaulation
>> >> of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow a
>Paris
>> >> mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.
>> >>
>> >> I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in creating
>> the
>> >> VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the EDS
>> >functionality
>> >> and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio
>going
>> >> through the card itself.
>> >>
>> >> This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow and
>> >dedication
>> >> got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to
>> >mention
>> >> the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this
>shennigans
>> >> i would think.
>> >>
>> >> Cheers,
>> >> Kim.
>> >>
>> >> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >DJ,
>> >> >
>> >> >Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need to
>> >focus
>> >> >on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>> >> >
>> >> >It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another
>weird,
>> >> proprietary
>> >> >dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it
>gets.
>> >>
>> >> >Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
>> >doesn't
>> >> >make sense to me.
>> >> >
>> >> >If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is
>wrong.
>> >> > Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>> >> >
>> >> >Chuck
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>Thanks for the detailed instructions, David! Much appreciated.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com

EK Sound wrote:
> Chances are the headband (AKG part number #2040M0209) has broken inside
> the earcup, and the wire has come off. To check this, use a heat gun to
> WARM the aluminum cap on the side of the housing (taking care not to
> melt the plastic). Once warmed, gently pry up the cap (the heat will
> soften the glue). Remove the phillips screw under the cap to remove the
> cover and expose the wiring. You can simply solder the wire back on,
> but if the headband is broken, it should be replaced.
>
> David.
>
> Jamie K wrote:
>>
>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left
>> channel. The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the
>> headset itself.
>>
>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>
>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>
>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>
>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55
>> instead of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:453e49c4$1@linux...
>
> I've played the same gear forever, including an 18 watt amp that is a
cross
> between as AC-30 and an AC-15. I put a THD power soak on so I can play it
> completely opened up. It sounds incredible, both in my opinion and in the
> opinion of many, many people who have complimented me on my guitar sound.
> I played a gig two weeks ago as the local band opening up for a national
> tour. The sound person (a woman actually, with a lovely British accent)
asked
> if I would mind using the headliner's amp. I don't think I had any choice.
> The amp the headliner had was a gorgeously restored AC-30 so I could
hardly
> complain. However, since I've used the same strat, LP, and Top Hat soaked
> down all of these years it didn't sound or feel like _my_ gear and I had
> a really tough time. I made some out and out mistakes, mostly because I
was
> trying to get more compression and grit out of the Vox than was there and
> I tried to correct it by playing harder. Does that mean that beautifully
> restored AC-30s sound bad?
>
> Your wife didn't like the first non-PARIS mix you've done in years. Does
> that mean native sounds bad?
>
> Discuss.

I'd say you're absolutely right about this Thad......I should have said that
she can pick out *my native mix* .....(add aforementioned reference to
soaring carrion bird and carcass located on vehicular accessway ). I do
intend to keep plugging away at this. The Creamware system has always
intrigued me.......going wayyyyy back. I printed out the manual and started
reading last night. Even with the voluminous verbage vis-a-vis the RME
Totalmix, most of it made sense to me immediately............but then again,
I think Windows in much more intuitive than Mac OS, so .......oh well.

;o)Whaaaaatttttt???.......why???......what's the problem?

"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ponsj2tvrbuutjnnsfh2nda9io1s3n6d1a@4ax.com...
> i hope to god you don't use that as a compliment when you tell amy how
> much you appreciate her senses...whew...
>
> On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 08:29:15 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>
> >My wife agrees with you LaMont. She can pick out a native mix like a
buzzard
> >circling roadkill at 3000'.
> >
> >
> >"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote in message news:453e20c4$1@linux...
> >>
> >> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear
that
> >> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's
not
> >> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are
not
> >> as good as you may think..
> >>
> >>
> >> "espresso" <audio@espressodigital.com> wrote:
> >> >I posted this a while ago.. I now use Nuendo with a Layla 3G to
output
> >> 8 x
> >> >analog channels and 8 x ADAT stems to Paris ie. Paris is now my mixer,
> >its
> >> >in the same computer, its easy....hardly any overhead as all Paris is
> >doing
> >> >is sitting in 'live' mode. I've been doing a bunch of live concert
DVDs
> >> with
> >> >50 odd channels - 2 hour files - no chance I'd be wanting to convert
all
> >> >those puppies to .pafs... or even the stems for that matter. The proof
is
> >> in
> >> >the sound - the files played through Paris are alive and have depth.
Same
> >> >mix in Nuendo...urrrgghh. I know that I'm getting a double belt of
DA-AD
> >> >plus losing 4 bits of info through the Paris ADAT, but honestly the
end
> >> >justifies the means. All i'm trying to add to the discussion is - if
you
> >> >want the functionality of the native program plus the Paris sound its
> >> >readily achievable without having to jump through the '2nd computer as
FX
> >> >buss' hoops.
> >> >
> >> >Cheers,
> >> >
> >> >David.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:453d9ba4$1@linux...
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Chuck,
> >> >>
> >> >> There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of
> >somebody
> >> >> making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various
> >possibilities,
> >> >> which one would assume would include:
> >> >>
> >> >> 1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality
of
> >> an
> >> >> EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris
> >allowing
> >> >> more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as
the
> >> >EDS
> >> >> subs, or...
> >> >> 2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses
the
> >> >emaulation
> >> >> of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow a
> >Paris
> >> >> mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.
> >> >>
> >> >> I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in
creating
> >> the
> >> >> VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the
EDS
> >> >functionality
> >> >> and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio
> >going
> >> >> through the card itself.
> >> >>
> >> >> This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow
and
> >> >dedication
> >> >> got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to
> >> >mention
> >> >> the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this
> >shennigans
> >> >> i would think.
> >> >>
> >> >> Cheers,
> >> >> Kim.
> >> >>
> >> >> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >DJ,
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need
to
> >> >focus
> >> >> >on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another
> >weird,
> >> >> proprietary
> >> >> >dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it
> >gets.
> >> >>
> >> >> >Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
> >> >doesn't
> >> >> >make sense to me.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is
> >wrong.
> >> >> > Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Chuck
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >
>Neil I do mix follow the native mix rules. No overs, faders around -5db ect,
and I can make it sound good..

However, when I add in a mixer for summing, all of those native mixing rules
are out the window. The whole mix "sonically" opens up..

As well as, If I'm using Apogees AD16x/DA16x with soft-limiter set on, I
can mix like I want to in SX. With RME interface's and converters, I have
to abide by the rules.

Lastly, when i have to mix (In the Box) using SX/Nuendo, I refer to the Charles
dye method and add in Harmonic distortion via plugs in (namely) antares Mic
modler(tube) on the inserts. This gives a different texture to the faders.
These days,I just use the SSL plugs which have that harmonic distort color
that helps a native mix...
"Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>>
>>My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear that
>>there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's
not
>>bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are not
>>as good as you may think..
>
>There IS something going on... IME, I think that a lot of people
>are using the tool in a manner in which it was not designed for.
>It's not designed to accomodate 50 tracks worth of clips/overs
>resulting in hundreds of thousands of errors per second... it's
>as simple as that.
>I don't think anyone who's said you can get good mixes out of
>Native suystems has insisted that it sounds exactly like Paris
>(or PT, or analog, or anything else), so is something different
>going on? Yeah... it's different - doesn't mean that it can't be
>good.Anyone useing a 1616 or 1616M as a portable recording solution? If so what
do you think, and what speed laptop are you using? Units have received great
reviews (EM etc) but it's E-mu so something just does not sit right.

Spec's state the card has DSP and I think someone was raving about the converters
at one point here awhile back.
I'm looking for an inexpensive portable solution to add to my Paris system
not replace.
Or
Is the Hamerfall RME DSP mutliface a better solution or?? Thanks again
for any and all help!!John <no@no.com> wrote in news:453e5131$1@linux:

> http://www.presonus.com/faderport.html
>

Wow. Yet Another Control Surface.

I liked the one that was posted several weeks ago better. The LCD screen
just screamed "tits" to me. This one is just phoning it in.

-scott v.Hey Gang,

I think that if someone were to try to jam "AES Sync" into a word clock
input, they would fail miserably.

AES Sync (or AES Black, as it is sometimes called) is a complete AES 64
bit digital word, with preamble bits, status bits, et al, but with
zeroes occupying the audio bit locations (hence the 'black' or 'silence'
designation), output at the selected sample rate. It is a very good
digital clock source, if your equipment has the appropriate port. The
folks who originally created the format worked hard to make their system
capable of self-clocking. Works well on long cabling, too, with proper
cable types and proper termination.

Word clock, on the other hand, is simply a TTL-level pulse (5V p-p) at
the selected sample rate. It is useful, as well, but don't get the two
confused. Still needs proper termination, but not very good with long
cables. "Super Clock" is a wordclock pulse at 256 times the selected
sample rate. Not used too much any more, but still available, if
needed. My Rosendahl has one output which can be set to this rate.

Check any of these signals with a scope - you'll see what I mean.

Canare 110<>75 transformers are wonderful things, but they don't change
AES Sync into word clock, or vice-versa.

Also, clock distribution systems should not introduce sufficient delays
as to be problematic, especially in a project studio or small commercial
studio. Get to the radio/TV station sized facility, and then we can
talk....

Happy clocking,

Larry Upton
KPBS TV/FM
San Diego

Gene Lennon wrote:

> "Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote:
>
>>Thanks DJ,
>>Gene what happens if the clcock gets delayed thru the aardvaark 1x6 distributor
>>?
>>I mean I have read that many buy wordclock devices that support 3-4 wc outputs
>>and then they use a distributor for further clcoking, isn't it the same
>
> delaying
>
>>factor involved ?
>>Does this matter sonically ?
>>Regards,
>>Dimitrios
>
>
> It�s the potential "Dreaded Clicks".
> Like most complex wordclock setups, you will need to try it to know for sure.
> Gene
>After being hosed 2x by proprietary DAW venders I wonder if it isn't better
to support projects like Ardour? Anyone ever give it a go? Thoughts?

http://www.ardour.org/i'm in love with the mackie universal control. nothing else will do!
John

volthause wrote:
> John <no@no.com> wrote in news:453e5131$1@linux:
>
>> http://www.presonus.com/faderport.html
>>
>
> Wow. Yet Another Control Surface.
>
> I liked the one that was posted several weeks ago better. The LCD screen
> just screamed "tits" to me. This one is just phoning it in.
>
> -scott v.I've played with it briefly. It's getting WAY better, and I'll give it a serious
look again soon, when I have a new machine.

"Geoff MacKenzie" <gmkmail@yahoo.com> wrote:
>After being hosed 2x by proprietary DAW venders I wonder if it isn't better

>to support projects like Ardour? Anyone ever give it a go? Thoughts?
>
>http://www.ardour.org/
>
>This is impressive.

http://www.ardour.org/ssl_support_announcement

TCB

"Geoff MacKenzie" <gmkmail@yahoo.com> wrote:
>After being hosed 2x by proprietary DAW venders I wonder if it isn't better

>to support projects like Ardour? Anyone ever give it a go? Thoughts?
>
>http://www.ardour.org/
>
>My word, they have a subversion repo. This could do shocking things to my
work productivity . . .

TCB

"Geoff MacKenzie" <gmkmail@yahoo.com> wrote:
>After being hosed 2x by proprietary DAW venders I wonder if it isn't better

>to support projects like Ardour? Anyone ever give it a go? Thoughts?
>
>http://www.ardour.org/
>
>You can't go wrong with the K240S. I use it all the time as well in the studio
as
at home. Great value for the money.

Greetings
Ab

Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>I hear you Deej, I'm half dead now. My left side has gone numb. Or is it

>my right side?
>
>Plus, I have a Powerplay Pro-XL that I haven't been able to kill, and
>now it may never die...
>
>I guess I'll just get the K240S and see if the numbness goes away, but
>the headset amp is probably safe now.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>DJ wrote:
>> I don't know who works on these but without my older (600 ohm) K240DF's
I
>> would die.......plus....you can kill Behringer headphone amps with these
>> too.
>>
>> ;op
>>
>>
>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:453daccc@linux...
>>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.
>>> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
>> itself.
>>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>>
>>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>>
>>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>>
>>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead
>>> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>Just read about the new Macbook pro. The FW 800 port was what I was waiting
for.
First thing in the morning is to contact my local apple reseller.
Btw, anyone interested in an Albook G4 1.5Ghz with 2GB Ram? Rick, DJ;?)

Best
Ab

Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>Intel Core 2 Duo 64 bit, more RAM, bigger HD. Firewire 800, double layer

>superdrive.
>
>http://www.apple.com/macbookpro/intel.html
>
>64 bit is important to me for upcoming OSX versions and 3D animation
>software updates.
>
>The MacBooks will likely also get the Core 2 Duo at some point.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.comThanks Ab, good to hear!

I'll probably get the 240S and also try and fix the old headset using
David's instructions.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com

Ab wrote:
> You can't go wrong with the K240S. I use it all the time as well in the studio
> as
> at home. Great value for the money.
>
> Greetings
> Ab
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>> I hear you Deej, I'm half dead now. My left side has gone numb. Or is it
>
>> my right side?
>>
>> Plus, I have a Powerplay Pro-XL that I haven't been able to kill, and
>> now it may never die...
>>
>> I guess I'll just get the K240S and see if the numbness goes away, but
>> the headset amp is probably safe now.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>> DJ wrote:
>>> I don't know who works on these but without my older (600 ohm) K240DF's
> I
>>> would die.......plus....you can kill Behringer headphone amps with these
>>> too.
>>>
>>> ;op
>>>
>>>
>>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:453daccc@linux...
>>>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.
>>>> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
>>> itself.
>>>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>>>
>>>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>>>
>>>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>>>
>>>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead
>>>> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>They sound ok. Not as good as the other ones.

"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message news:453ea17b$1@linux...
>
> You can't go wrong with the K240S. I use it all the time as well in the
> studio
> as
> at home. Great value for the money.
>
> Greetings
> Ab
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>
>>I hear you Deej, I'm half dead now. My left side has gone numb. Or is it
>
>>my right side?
>>
>>Plus, I have a Powerplay Pro-XL that I haven't been able to kill, and
>>now it may never die...
>>
>>I guess I'll just get the K240S and see if the numbness goes away, but
>>the headset amp is probably safe now.
>>
>>Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>DJ wrote:
>>> I don't know who works on these but without my older (600 ohm) K240DF's
> I
>>> would die.......plus....you can kill Behringer headphone amps with these
>>> too.
>>>
>>> ;op
>>>
>>>
>>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:453daccc@linux...
>>>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left
>>>> channel.
>>>> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
>>> itself.
>>>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>>>
>>>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>>>
>>>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>>>
>>>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55
>>>> instead
>>>> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>Lamont - if your D-A converters affect the way you mix inside a DAW, you
aren't mixing what you think you are. Certainly converters can sound
different, but the differences at the RME/Apogee level aren't in siginficant
areas (mainly a slight difference in sound of the top end - yes I've heard
all of these, along with Myteks, Cranesong, DCS, and others side by side -
Cranesong is my favorite - Myteks are great, but a little sterile. DCS is
just too expensive).

1) If you are saying you mix differently on a console because you are using
Apogee converters from the DAW with soft limit vs. RME converters, also into
the same desk (no mixing in SX, just playback), you are simply using the
converters to color the signal (albeit only slightly), in different ways -
Softlimit just limiting. Nothing wrong with that, but that is altering the
tracks going in, not the mixing platform itself. Saying RME converters
limit you because they don't have a limiter built in says you aren't mixing
the way most of us do - you are trying to get analog saturation out of
digital - ain't gonna happen.

2) If you are mixing inside SX and change your approach depending on which
converter you monitor through, then that's a problem since your bounces
aren't going to be the same, and your decisions aren't going to be
consistent. The idea is to have your monitoring chain *not* affect your mix
decisions, but enable more accurate ones.

If you mixdown to a 2-track of some sort (Masterlink, etc), then you are
using SoftLimit as a limiter on the output. You could achieve the same
think in a multitude of different ways.

Regards,
Dedric

On 10/24/06 1:44 PM, in article 453e6d24$1@linux, "LaMont"
<jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:

>
> Neil I do mix follow the native mix rules. No overs, faders around -5db ect,
> and I can make it sound good..
>
> However, when I add in a mixer for summing, all of those native mixing rules
> are out the window. The whole mix "sonically" opens up..
>
> As well as, If I'm using Apogees AD16x/DA16x with soft-limiter set on, I
> can mix like I want to in SX. With RME interface's and converters, I have
> to abide by the rules.
>
> Lastly, when i have to mix (In the Box) using SX/Nuendo, I refer to the
> Charles
> dye method and add in Harmonic distortion via plugs in (namely) antares Mic
> modler(tube) on the inserts. This gives a different texture to the faders.
> These days,I just use the SSL plugs which have that harmonic distort color
> that helps a native mix...
> "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>
>> "LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear that
>>> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's
> not
>>> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are not
>>> as good as you may think..
>>
>> There IS something going on... IME, I think that a lot of people
>> are using the tool in a manner in which it was not designed for.
>> It's not designed to accomodate 50 tracks worth of clips/overs
>> resulting in hundreds of thousands of errors per second... it's
>> as simple as that.
>> I don't think anyone who's said you can get good mixes out of
>> Native suystems has insisted that it sounds exactly like Paris
>> (or PT, or analog, or anything else), so is something different
>> going on? Yeah... it's different - doesn't mean that it can't be
>> good.
>Hi John,

The difference is pretty much what Chuck found in technical detail - Paris
lets you clip channels by cutting your levels for you. Native DAWs don't do
this - what you put in you get out. You may not actually hear any
difference other than Paris' converters vs. the Presonus (I haven't heard
the Presonus so I can't comment on the differences there).

I always thought Paris was harder to get a clear top end out of. Nuendo
sounded clearer to me immediately. Some of that was Paris' converters, some
wasn't. If tracks are being cut by 22dB before you even start processing
you are losing 3.5 bits of resolution from 24-bit files (depending on how
Paris transfers to larger bit depths for processing, and where it lops them
off in the end).

There will always be people disagreeing about the audio quality of DAWs, but
imho, the differences have more to do with the way the "art" of mixing has
been taught and passed along over the years as a trade rather than skill -
with many misconceptions and traditions that have no sonic foundation or
engineering logic.

There are a lot of people mixing pro level music in Nuendo, and Cubase is
the same audio engine. Imho, Cubase 4 has the best workflow of any native
DAW out there now.

Regards,
Dedric

On 10/24/06 7:43 AM, in article 453e165b$1@linux, "John" <no@no.com> wrote:

> Dedric, You have experience in both Cubase and Paris if I'm not
> mistaken, I'm about to receive Cubase using presonus digimax fs pres.
> Can you elaborate on what sonic differences I should expect to
> experience pro and con?
>
> Thanks,
> John
>
> Dedric Terry wrote:
>> I don't think anyone believes cpu power has anything to do with sound
>> quality, just as lowering channels by 22dB and raising the master buss by
>> 22dB has nothing to do with improving sound quality - it's just a matter of
>> managing levels for the user instead of the user lowering the fader by 22dB.
>>
>> Nothing wrong with a faster machine to allow more fx processing... or FX
>> Teleport, Wormhole or VST System Link.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Dedric
>>
>> On 10/24/06 7:02 AM, in article 453e0efb$1@linux, "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> "LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.ne> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Even more, I don;t agree with this new trend of adding more CPU powerer,
>>>> thinking that it will yield you better summing or sound.
>>>> It won't!!
>>> Perhaps not, but what it WILL do is allow you to get into
>>> using very processor-intensive tools while still running a lot
>>> of tracks. For example, If you mix with Izotope Ozone across
>>> your 2-buss, you could mix with super high-quality program
>>> compression, brickwall limiting, and a stereo image enhancer
>>> right in place... however, Ozone is very CPU-intensive (I've
>>> done this before in SX, but I've had to "freeze" a lot of
>>> tracks in order to be abe to accommodate it. No big deal unless
>>> you want to make changes to any of those tracks inserts, then
>>> you have to unfreeze/tweak/refreeze.
>>>
>>> Another thing it enables you to do is to get into convo or
>>> modeled reverbs on the same computer - i.e.: no having to
>>> dedicate a separate box for EFX. I have nothing against DSP-
>>> based stuff, but there are a couple of really cool - but SUPER-
>>> cpu-intensive verbs out there... did anyone else check out the
>>> demo for theRayspace reverb that Deej (i think it was Deej,
>>> anyway) posted a link for? If not, go check it out.... here's
>>> the link:
>>>
>>> http://www.quikquak.com/software.html
>>>
>>> Simply amazing, IMO; but very much a CPU hog. So much so that I
>>> can't use it at all - I was able to try it on a drum group
>>> only after disabling half of the tracks on a particular project.
>>>
>>> Neil
>>Yes, I do mixdown to a Masterlink...

Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>Lamont - if your D-A converters affect the way you mix inside a DAW, you
>aren't mixing what you think you are. Certainly converters can sound
>different, but the differences at the RME/Apogee level aren't in siginficant
>areas (mainly a slight difference in sound of the top end - yes I've heard
>all of these, along with Myteks, Cranesong, DCS, and others side by side
-
>Cranesong is my favorite - Myteks are great, but a little sterile. DCS is
>just too expensive).
>
>1) If you are saying you mix differently on a console because you are using
>Apogee converters from the DAW with soft limit vs. RME converters, also
into
>the same desk (no mixing in SX, just playback), you are simply using the
>converters to color the signal (albeit only slightly), in different ways
-
>Softlimit just limiting. Nothing wrong with that, but that is altering
the
>tracks going in, not the mixing platform itself. Saying RME converters
>limit you because they don't have a limiter built in says you aren't mixing
>the way most of us do - you are trying to get analog saturation out of
>digital - ain't gonna happen.
>
>2) If you are mixing inside SX and change your approach depending on which
>converter you monitor through, then that's a problem since your bounces
>aren't going to be the same, and your decisions aren't going to be
>consistent. The idea is to have your monitoring chain *not* affect your
mix
>decisions, but enable more accurate ones.
>
>If you mixdown to a 2-track of some sort (Masterlink, etc), then you are
>using SoftLimit as a limiter on the output. You could achieve the same
>think in a multitude of different ways.
>
>Regards,
>Dedric
>
>On 10/24/06 1:44 PM, in article 453e6d24$1@linux, "LaMont"
><jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> Neil I do mix follow the native mix rules. No overs, faders around -5db
ect,
>> and I can make it sound good..
>>
>> However, when I add in a mixer for summing, all of those native mixing
rules
>> are out the window. The whole mix "sonically" opens up..
>>
>> As well as, If I'm using Apogees AD16x/DA16x with soft-limiter set on,
I
>> can mix like I want to in SX. With RME interface's and converters, I have
>> to abide by the rules.
>>
>> Lastly, when i have to mix (In the Box) using SX/Nuendo, I refer to the
>> Charles
>> dye method and add in Harmonic distortion via plugs in (namely) antares
Mic
>> modler(tube) on the inserts. This gives a different texture to the faders.
>> These days,I just use the SSL plugs which have that harmonic distort color
>> that helps a native mix...
>> "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> "LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear
that
>>>> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's
>> not
>>>> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are
not
>>>> as good as you may think..
>>>
>>> There IS something going on... IME, I think that a lot of people
>>> are using the tool in a manner in which it was not designed for.
>>> It's not designed to accomodate 50 tracks worth of clips/overs
>>> resulting in hundreds of thousands of errors per second... it's
>>> as simple as that.
>>> I don't think anyone who's said you can get good mixes out of
>>> Native suystems has insisted that it sounds exactly like Paris
>>> (or PT, or analog, or anything else), so is something different
>>> going on? Yeah... it's different - doesn't mean that it can't be
>>> good.
>>
>Cuase SX 2.0.1 sending to PARIS 3.0.
Both instances wrapped fxpansion3.3.
Same Computer.

Ok, here is the deal.
I opened an instance of WH2 in Cubase SX 2.0.1.
I named it"test".
I selected "start".
I opened an instance of WH2 in PARIS 3.0.
I selected Test-end.
I selected "end"
I placed a 6 minute audio slice of silence on the channel in PARIS 3.0.
I pushed play in Cubase.
I pushed play in PARIS.
It worked I got a connection and I could here the audio coming thru the
channel in PARIS.
NOW HERE"S THE PROBLEM....
I can't record the WH2 signal in PARIS!
I press record in PARIS and it just records silence over the silence I already
got there.
I have to place the monitoring selection to During Record Only.
Otherwise when I record enable the track the signal goes silent.
When During Record Only is selected the signal keeps playing when record
enabled, but just records silence.
What could cause this?

Thanks,
BrandonBEGBROKE, OXFORD - Solid State Logic is committed to providing end users with
a range of products that enhance the experience of producing music or sound
for picture. To this end SSL is establishing strategic partnerships throughout
the industry to deliver a new breed of hardware and software solutions to
audio workstation users. Our recent collaboration with software plug-in developer
Waves and a number of audio workstation manufacturers is an example.

Continuing down this track, SSL is proud to announce its involvement with
the Ardour workstation and is contributing to its development by employing
Paul Davis, the founder of Ardour and its key developer.

Paul is working on an agreed set of development objectives and is also co-ordinating
the efforts of other Ardour developers. Our aim is to develop associated
software & hardware and, in time, produce Ardour based products with special
SSL elements that add value.

Solid State Logic Managing Director Antony David says: "Our involvement with
Ardour should not be seen as exclusive of other workstation manufacturers
but we regard the Ardour platform as important for an industry that doesn't
currently have a truly open project interchange standard or an open platform
for plug-in developers. We regard the open architecture and platform neutral
technology of the Ardour workstation as a natural fit with SSL's long-term
vision to provide scalable and customisable solutions to a rapidly growing
customer base."

Ardour Founder Paul Davis explains: "Other pro audio manufacturers such as
Harrison have already contributed to the development of Ardour and more are
interested to do so. We hope that our involvement will encourage others to
get on board. We have also made it clear to those who have asked that we
would not object to a move to establish a separate legal entity (sometimes
referred to as the 'Ardour Foundation') if that helps convince potential
contributors about the security of the code as open source software."

The Ardour Audio Workstation is a collaborative open-source software development
effort. Rather than being a product of a particular company, its development
is centered around a growing community of independent software developers.
For more information about the Ardour Audio Workstation visit www.ardour.org

"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>My word, they have a subversion repo. This could do shocking things to my
>work productivity . . .
>
>TCB
>
>"Geoff MacKenzie" <gmkmail@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>After being hosed 2x by proprietary DAW venders I wonder if it isn't better
>
>>to support projects like Ardour? Anyone ever give it a go? Thoughts?
>>
>>http://www.ardour.org/
>>
>>
>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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charset="iso-8859-1"
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I think Letterman's band has been using them for a while.
Tom
"Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message =
news:453d3029@linux...

Heh, that'd put a lot of "singers" out of work. :^)

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com

DC wrote:
> The US rep could be more responsive, but he sounds like a one-man
> shop. the only downside is they are about 270.00 at retail=20
> without a lot of margin.
>=20
> Besides, we need one that works in reverse, to put on all the crappy
> backup singers..
>=20
> heh
>=20
> They step up to the mic and.. silence! Better yet, use it to =
trigger
> a sample of, oh I don't know, maybe someone who can actually=20
> SING?
>=20
> DC
>=20
>=20
> EK Sound <askme@nospam.com> wrote:
>> An old friend of mine was working on something like this for the=20
>> touring industry about 15 years ago using security floor pressure =
pads.
>>
>> This is way more elegant though, thanks for the link.
>>
>> David.
>>
>> DC wrote:
>>> For all you who deal with live sound.
>>>
>>> this is pretty cool.
>>>
>>> http://www.optogate.com
>>>
>>> DC
>

I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
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<DIV>I think Letterman's band has been using =
them for a=20
while.</DIV>
<DIV>Tom</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Jamie K" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:Meta@Dimensional.com">Meta@Dimensional.com</A>> =
wrote in=20
message <A =
href=3D"news:453d3029@linux">news:453d3029@linux</A>...</DIV> Heh,=20
that'd put a lot of "singers" out of work. =
:^) Cheers,  =20
-Jamie   <A=20
=
href=3D"http://www.JamieKrutz.com">www.JamieKrutz.com</A> DC=20
wrote: > The US rep could be more responsive, but he sounds like =
a=20
one-man > shop.   the only downside is they are about =
270.00=20
at retail > without a lot of margin. > > Besides, =
we need=20
one that works in reverse, to put on all the crappy > backup=20
singers.. > > heh > > They step up to the =
mic and..=20
silence!   Better yet, use it to trigger > a sample =
of, oh I=20
don't know, maybe someone who can actually > SING? > =
 >=20
DC > > > EK Sound <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:askme@nospam.com">askme@nospam.com</A>> =
wrote: >> An=20
old friend of mine was working on something like this for the =
 >>=20
touring industry about 15 years ago using security floor pressure=20
pads. >> >> This is way more elegant though, thanks =
for the=20
link. >> >> David. >> >> DC=20
wrote: >>> For all you who deal with live=20
sound. >>> >>> this is pretty=20
cool. >>> >>> <A=20
=
href=3D"http://www.optogate.com">http://www.optogate.com</A> >>&=
gt; >>>=20
DC ></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, =
and=20
you? <A=20
href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
..html</A>   </DIV></BODY ></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C6F7C5.34EE5390--Hey Jamie! Did you check the continuity between the plug and the driver?
It could be the cable, or a bad connection at the driver.

James

Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.

>The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset itself.
>
>Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>
>A) A good place to fix it?
>
>B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>
>The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead

>of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.comWatch the alphatrack videos, you wont want to buy the Personus.

http://img3.harmony-central.com/Video/aes121/Frontier_Design _Alphatrack.mp4

http://www.frontierdesign.com/

James

John <no@no.com> wrote:
>http://www.presonus.com/faderport.htmlChris Ludwig <chrisl@adkproaudio.com> wrote:
>Hi Gene,
>The chip we got is a pre-production unmarked one for testing. The ones
>you want are the quad core xeons that supposedly drop in to the G5s!! :)
>
>Chris
>

Thanks Chris :�(
Gene"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
> My word, they have a subversion repo. This could do shocking things to my
> work productivity . . .

Heehee...yeah...you could spend YEARS trying to fix that code...

I don't know if anyone remembers a couple years ago, I was using Ardour as
the test platform for the PARIS drivers on Linux, back before audio on OS X
got fixed... I had talked to PBD about porting Ardour to OS X, but he
HIGHLY discouraged me from doing that at the time. That and the morons over
on the Linux audio list were enough for me to swear off ever doing any more
audio work under Linux. I was so disgusted, I deleted the entire source
tree!

Ardour has been on the verge of being something for a long time. Maybe some
day it will be... (And in the meantime, they at least got a spiffy new logo
earlier this year!) Oooo!

Doug

http://www.parisfaqs.com"Geoff MacKenzie" <gmkmail@yahoo.com> wrote:
> After being hosed 2x by proprietary DAW venders I wonder if it isn't better
> to support projects like Ardour? Anyone ever give it a go? Thoughts?
>
> http://www.ardour.org/

Well, let me put it this way - there's a reason you get the source code with
an open source project...

Doug ;-)

http://www.parisfaqs.com"Nappy" <mgrant01@san.rr.com> wrote:
> Good to see your post,how are you doing?
> What you been up to?

Nappy! Good to see you still here man! Oh, where to start... Well,
I've been seeing guys around me getting old, and some dying, :( so I
started to re-evaluate my life. In June, I got serious about getting
some aerobic exercise. I started riding a road bike five days a week.
(Lost 15 pounds in less than 3 weeks.) I even competed in the Arizona
State Time Trials and I might compete in the El Tour de Tucson next
month.

My son damaged his knee, so he hasn't been able to play soccer or
baseball for six months, so we've been doing other things. For
example, a week and a half ago, we were up at Sunrise Ski for a
downhill mountain bike race. My daughter took first place in her
class, my wife took second in hers, and my son took third in his! We
got about four inches of snow on that Sunday too - it was beautiful!
I hadn't really been in snow since 1985 - forgot about that lovely
crunching sound and the stillness - ahhh...

We had a pack rat invasion earlier this year - the little bastards
took all of my stained glass patterns and shredded them into a nest!
They also hauled most of the sandpaper off, and they chewed into
almost every cardboard box in my garage! I moved a lot of stuff onto
the back porch and then the little $#!^s took over the porch, even
chewing under the back door to come into the house! I think we've
finally gotten rid of them though... (Funny, but when I was cleaning
out the garage, I found a complete PARIS bundle 3, two 8-in cards and
an extra EDS that I forgot I had! All still in original boxes...)

My mom decided to move from Santa Barbara to Tucson, so she bought a
couple houses (!) here, one for her to move into and one for my
sister-in-law (brother's ex) and kids. I take all the kids to school,
so I get to see my brother's kids almost every day, but he only sees
them once or twice a year. Dang... Anyway, my mom dawdled and never
got around to selling the Santa Barbara house during the housing boom,
so now she can't sell it at all it seems. She's taken it off the
market and is renting rooms out. Mean time, I get to take care of all
three Tucson houses (mine, sister-in-law's, mom's including pool)
along with everything else. Geesh...

Work is hectic - I report directly to the president of our company
now. I'm pretty much personally responsible for computing for half of
our company! I've been scrambling to deploy CMS, WIKI, Forum, Blog
and IM software to hopefully improve communication and collaboration
along with taking care of the continuous stream of Linux upgrades, new
employee computer needs, and trying to learn our DSP framework...

On the music front, I blew off Different Skies this year, but enrolled
in EIS, and got back to work on a couple projects - the analog synth
is almost soldered up (40+ modules), the Chroma, T8, Fizmo and AN1x
are all fixed up and working, I finally repaired the KSP-8 and
finished the opamp upgrade in the big Roland mixer and I even finished
the design of the controller for the Looperlative. The hard disk in
my development Mac got corrupted beyond repair it seems, so I had to
completely reinstall - I ended up buying a new controller and putting
in a couple big hard drives. That was good, as I was finally able to
install the Quantum Leap Orchestra and Symphonic Choirs along with
several of the other sample libraries I had purchased but never
installed. (Ever checked out the Prominy LPC? Rawkin!) I recently
got a Macbook, so I've been playing with that, even using Parallels to
run Winders XP and RedHat Enterprise 4. It's fun to run Microsoft
development tools on a Mac...!

Oh, did I mention I gave up the DJ gig down at the radio station?
Five days a week at 5 AM on top of the regular job got to be a bit much...

Phew... How's that? ;-)

Doug (Wow, after proof-reading that, I think I must be insane!)man, your amy is one loving woman.

On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 12:41:48 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:

>Whaaaaatttttt???.......why???......what's the problem?
>
>
>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:ponsj2tvrbuutjnnsfh2nda9io1s3n6d1a@4ax.com...
>> i hope to god you don't use that as a compliment when you tell amy how
>> much you appreciate her senses...whew...
>>
>> On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 08:29:15 -0600, "DJ" <notachance@net.net> wrote:
>>
>> >My wife agrees with you LaMont. She can pick out a native mix like a
>buzzard
>> >circling roadkill at 3000'.
>> >
>> >
>> >"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote in message news:453e20c4$1@linux...
>> >>
>> >> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear
>that
>> >> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's
>not
>> >> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are
>not
>> >> as good as you may think..
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "espresso" <audio@espressodigital.com> wrote:
>> >> >I posted this a while ago.. I now use Nuendo with a Layla 3G to
>output
>> >> 8 x
>> >> >analog channels and 8 x ADAT stems to Paris ie. Paris is now my mixer,
>> >its
>> >> >in the same computer, its easy....hardly any overhead as all Paris is
>> >doing
>> >> >is sitting in 'live' mode. I've been doing a bunch of live concert
>DVDs
>> >> with
>> >> >50 odd channels - 2 hour files - no chance I'd be wanting to convert
>all
>> >> >those puppies to .pafs... or even the stems for that matter. The proof
>is
>> >> in
>> >> >the sound - the files played through Paris are alive and have depth.
>Same
>> >> >mix in Nuendo...urrrgghh. I know that I'm getting a double belt of
>DA-AD
>> >> >plus losing 4 bits of info through the Paris ADAT, but honestly the
>end
>> >> >justifies the means. All i'm trying to add to the discussion is - if
>you
>> >> >want the functionality of the native program plus the Paris sound its
>> >> >readily achievable without having to jump through the '2nd computer as
>FX
>> >> >buss' hoops.
>> >> >
>> >> >Cheers,
>> >> >
>> >> >David.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >news:453d9ba4$1@linux...
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Chuck,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> There was talk some time ago (oh how the years wander on...) of
>> >somebody
>> >> >> making an EDS chip emulator, which would then allow various
>> >possibilities,
>> >> >> which one would assume would include:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> 1) a "Virtual" EDS card driver which emulates all the functionality
>of
>> >> an
>> >> >> EDS card down to the last bit, and hence plugs right into Paris
>> >allowing
>> >> >> more submixes, natively, but with the same sound characteristics as
>the
>> >> >EDS
>> >> >> subs, or...
>> >> >> 2) using the same technology, a virtual Paris mix bus, which uses
>the
>> >> >emaulation
>> >> >> of the EDS alongside the code from the Paris OS to basically allow a
>> >Paris
>> >> >> mix bus, using something like rewire, to plug in to a native app.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I believe the talk was inspired by Matthew Craig's efforts in
>creating
>> >> the
>> >> >> VST Paris EQ, which does basically this same thing, emulating the
>EDS
>> >> >functionality
>> >> >> and hence generating pretty much identical output to the same audio
>> >going
>> >> >> through the card itself.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> This would sure sort out the issues if anybody with enough knowhow
>and
>> >> >dedication
>> >> >> got on board. Suddenly any app could have the Paris mix bus, not to
>> >> >mention
>> >> >> the paris EQ... that would pretty much put an end to all this
>> >shennigans
>> >> >> i would think.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Cheers,
>> >> >> Kim.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >DJ,
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >Listen I know you love messing with this stuff, but I think we need
>to
>> >> >focus
>> >> >> >on how to get the mixes we want out of an all native system.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >It just doesn't make any sense to me to get onboard with another
>> >weird,
>> >> >> proprietary
>> >> >> >dsp system. Creamware is as weird, oddball nad proprietary as it
>> >gets.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >Why bother with it? Why bother with UAD or anything else. It just
>> >> >doesn't
>> >> >> >make sense to me.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is
>> >wrong.
>> >> >> > Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >Chuck
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >
>>
>does it work?
latency ?

please answer......I saw both. My love stays with the Mackie Universal Control. I like
riding 3 or 4 faders at once.
John

James McCloskey wrote:
> Watch the alphatrack videos, you wont want to buy the Personus.
>
> http://img3.harmony-central.com/Video/aes121/Frontier_Design _Alphatrack.mp4
>
> http://www.frontierdesign.com/
>
> James
>
>
> John <no@no.com> wrote:
>> http://www.presonus.com/faderport.html
>Is there a paf convert to convert 16 bit pafs to wavs ? The one I see
says only 24 bit.

Thanks,
JohnWhatcha all think?

http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/software/de fault.mspxexactly!!

Dedric Terry wrote:

>Hi John,
>
>The difference is pretty much what Chuck found in technical detail - Paris
>lets you clip channels by cutting your levels for you. Native DAWs don't do
>this - what you put in you get out. You may not actually hear any
>difference other than Paris' converters vs. the Presonus (I haven't heard
>the Presonus so I can't comment on the differences there).
>
>I always thought Paris was harder to get a clear top end out of. Nuendo
>sounded clearer to me immediately. Some of that was Paris' converters, some
>wasn't. If tracks are being cut by 22dB before you even start processing
>you are losing 3.5 bits of resolution from 24-bit files (depending on how
>Paris transfers to larger bit depths for processing, and where it lops them
>off in the end).
>
>There will always be people disagreeing about the audio quality of DAWs, but
>imho, the differences have more to do with the way the "art" of mixing has
>been taught and passed along over the years as a trade rather than skill -
>with many misconceptions and traditions that have no sonic foundation or
>engineering logic.
>
>There are a lot of people mixing pro level music in Nuendo, and Cubase is
>the same audio engine. Imho, Cubase 4 has the best workflow of any native
>DAW out there now.
>
>Regards,
>Dedric
>
>On 10/24/06 7:43 AM, in article 453e165b$1@linux, "John" <no@no.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>>Dedric, You have experience in both Cubase and Paris if I'm not
>>mistaken, I'm about to receive Cubase using presonus digimax fs pres.
>>Can you elaborate on what sonic differences I should expect to
>>experience pro and con?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>John
>>
>>Dedric Terry wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I don't think anyone believes cpu power has anything to do with sound
>>>quality, just as lowering channels by 22dB and raising the master buss by
>>>22dB has nothing to do with improving sound quality - it's just a matter of
>>>managing levels for the user instead of the user lowering the fader by 22dB.
>>>
>>>Nothing wrong with a faster machine to allow more fx processing... or FX
>>>Teleport, Wormhole or VST System Link.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>Dedric
>>>
>>>On 10/24/06 7:02 AM, in article 453e0efb$1@linux, "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.ne> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Even more, I don;t agree with this new trend of adding more CPU powerer,
>>>>>thinking that it will yield you better summing or sound.
>>>>>It won't!!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Perhaps not, but what it WILL do is allow you to get into
>>>>using very processor-intensive tools while still running a lot
>>>>of tracks. For example, If you mix with Izotope Ozone across
>>>>your 2-buss, you could mix with super high-quality program
>>>>compression, brickwall limiting, and a stereo image enhancer
>>>>right in place... however, Ozone is very CPU-intensive (I've
>>>>done this before in SX, but I've had to "freeze" a lot of
>>>>tracks in order to be abe to accommodate it. No big deal unless
>>>>you want to make changes to any of those tracks inserts, then
>>>>you have to unfreeze/tweak/refreeze.
>>>>
>>>>Another thing it enables you to do is to get into convo or
>>>>modeled reverbs on the same computer - i.e.: no having to
>>>>dedicate a separate box for EFX. I have nothing against DSP-
>>>>based stuff, but there are a couple of really cool - but SUPER-
>>>>cpu-intensive verbs out there... did anyone else check out the
>>>>demo for theRayspace reverb that Deej (i think it was Deej,
>>>>anyway) posted a link for? If not, go check it out.... here's
>>>>the link:
>>>>
>>>>http://www.quikquak.com/software.html
>>>>
>>>>Simply amazing, IMO; but very much a CPU hog. So much so that I
>>>>can't use it at all - I was able to try it on a drum group
>>>>only after disabling half of the tracks on a particular project.
>>>>
>>>>Neil
>>>>
>>>>
>
>
>

--
Chris Ludwig
ADK
chrisl@adkproaudio.com <mailto:chrisl@adkproaudio.com>
www.adkproaudio.com <http://www.adkproaudio.com/>
(859) 635-5762Additionally,
I tried using Wires to send from the WH2 channel to another channel and
record that channel.
That didnt work either.

Here is Plasq's response:

Adrian
Admin

Admin
Posts: 28

Well, at least I got it working. I am going to try and send a loop
starting from inside PARIS on the same computer. Re:CubaseSX to PARIS Same
Computer - 2006/10/25 22:03 Wormhole just transfers audio from one insert
slot to another. How you record that is a problem of the DAW. It might not
be possible in basic DAWs.

Unfortunately, we do not know Paris, so I can't tell you how to do
that. It's the same as recording any plugin output. In most hosts it works
by routing the audio to a bus and recording the bus.

--
Thanks,

Brandon

"Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote in message news:453ecae6$1@linux...
>
> Cuase SX 2.0.1 sending to PARIS 3.0.
> Both instances wrapped fxpansion3.3.
> Same Computer.
>
> Ok, here is the deal.
> I opened an instance of WH2 in Cubase SX 2.0.1.
> I named it"test".
> I selected "start".
> I opened an instance of WH2 in PARIS 3.0.
> I selected Test-end.
> I selected "end"
> I placed a 6 minute audio slice of silence on the channel in PARIS 3.0.
> I pushed play in Cubase.
> I pushed play in PARIS.
> It worked I got a connection and I could here the audio coming thru the
> channel in PARIS.
> NOW HERE"S THE PROBLEM....
> I can't record the WH2 signal in PARIS!
> I press record in PARIS and it just records silence over the silence I
already
> got there.
> I have to place the monitoring selection to During Record Only.
> Otherwise when I record enable the track the signal goes silent.
> When During Record Only is selected the signal keeps playing when record
> enabled, but just records silence.
> What could cause this?
>
> Thanks,
> Brandon

Yup. It's free but you have to validate windows. I've been using it at work
for over a year, haven't seen any problems with it other than not liking the
way it updates. It comes as part of Vista, though I'm not positive if it's
*all* flavors of Vista yet or not.

AA

"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:453f4cb1@linux...
> Whatcha all think?
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/software/de fault.mspx http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual &videoid=727615787Sorry here is plasq's response:

Wormhole just transfers audio from one insert slot to another. How you
record that is a problem of the DAW. It might not be possible in basic DAWs.

Unfortunately, we do not know Paris, so I can't tell you how to do that.
It's the same as recording any plugin output. In most hosts it works by
routing the audio to a bus and recording the bus.

Thanks,

Brandon

"Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote in message news:453f6bb8$1@linux...
> Additionally,
> I tried using Wires to send from the WH2 channel to another channel and
> record that channel.
> That didnt work either.
>
> Here is Plasq's response:
>
> Adrian
> Admin
>
> Admin
> Posts: 28
>
>
> Well, at least I got it working. I am going to try and send a loop
> starting from inside PARIS on the same computer. Re:CubaseSX to PARIS Same
> Computer - 2006/10/25 22:03 Wormhole just transfers audio from one insert
> slot to another. How you record that is a problem of the DAW. It might not
> be possible in basic DAWs.
>
> Unfortunately, we do not know Paris, so I can't tell you how to do
> that. It's the same as recording any plugin output. In most hosts it works
> by routing the audio to a bus and recording the bus.
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks,
>
> Brandon
>
>
>
> "Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote in message news:453ecae6$1@linux...
> >
> > Cuase SX 2.0.1 sending to PARIS 3.0.
> > Both instances wrapped fxpansion3.3.
> > Same Computer.
> >
> > Ok, here is the deal.
> > I opened an instance of WH2 in Cubase SX 2.0.1.
> > I named it"test".
> > I selected "start".
> > I opened an instance of WH2 in PARIS 3.0.
> > I selected Test-end.
> > I selected "end"
> > I placed a 6 minute audio slice of silence on the channel in PARIS 3.0.
> > I pushed play in Cubase.
> > I pushed play in PARIS.
> > It worked I got a connection and I could here the audio coming thru the
> > channel in PARIS.
> > NOW HERE"S THE PROBLEM....
> > I can't record the WH2 signal in PARIS!
> > I press record in PARIS and it just records silence over the silence I
> already
> > got there.
> > I have to place the monitoring selection to During Record Only.
> > Otherwise when I record enable the track the signal goes silent.
> > When During Record Only is selected the signal keeps playing when record
> > enabled, but just records silence.
> > What could cause this?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brandon
>
>
>Doesn't this belong in the "nut we have to crack" thread, LOL?
AA

"Doug Wellington" <doug@parisfaqs.com> wrote in message
news:29EC74E8-63F9-11DB-81A9-000393A9F344%doug@parisfaqs.com...
> "Nappy" <mgrant01@san.rr.com> wrote:
>> Good to see your post,how are you doing?
>> What you been up to?
>
> Nappy! Good to see you still here man! Oh, where to start... Well,
> I've been seeing guys around me getting old, and some dying, :( so I
> started to re-evaluate my life. In June, I got serious about getting
> some aerobic exercise. I started riding a road bike five days a week.
> (Lost 15 pounds in less than 3 weeks.) I even competed in the Arizona
> State Time Trials and I might compete in the El Tour de Tucson next
> month.
>
> My son damaged his knee, so he hasn't been able to play soccer or
> baseball for six months, so we've been doing other things. For
> example, a week and a half ago, we were up at Sunrise Ski for a
> downhill mountain bike race. My daughter took first place in her
> class, my wife took second in hers, and my son took third in his! We
> got about four inches of snow on that Sunday too - it was beautiful!
> I hadn't really been in snow since 1985 - forgot about that lovely
> crunching sound and the stillness - ahhh...
>
> We had a pack rat invasion earlier this year - the little bastards
> took all of my stained glass patterns and shredded them into a nest!
> They also hauled most of the sandpaper off, and they chewed into
> almost every cardboard box in my garage! I moved a lot of stuff onto
> the back porch and then the little $#!^s took over the porch, even
> chewing under the back door to come into the house! I think we've
> finally gotten rid of them though... (Funny, but when I was cleaning
> out the garage, I found a complete PARIS bundle 3, two 8-in cards and
> an extra EDS that I forgot I had! All still in original boxes...)
>
> My mom decided to move from Santa Barbara to Tucson, so she bought a
> couple houses (!) here, one for her to move into and one for my
> sister-in-law (brother's ex) and kids. I take all the kids to school,
> so I get to see my brother's kids almost every day, but he only sees
> them once or twice a year. Dang... Anyway, my mom dawdled and never
> got around to selling the Santa Barbara house during the housing boom,
> so now she can't sell it at all it seems. She's taken it off the
> market and is renting rooms out. Mean time, I get to take care of all
> three Tucson houses (mine, sister-in-law's, mom's including pool)
> along with everything else. Geesh...
>
> Work is hectic - I report directly to the president of our company
> now. I'm pretty much personally responsible for computing for half of
> our company! I've been scrambling to deploy CMS, WIKI, Forum, Blog
> and IM software to hopefully improve communication and collaboration
> along with taking care of the continuous stream of Linux upgrades, new
> employee computer needs, and trying to learn our DSP framework...
>
> On the music front, I blew off Different Skies this year, but enrolled
> in EIS, and got back to work on a couple projects - the analog synth
> is almost soldered up (40+ modules), the Chroma, T8, Fizmo and AN1x
> are all fixed up and working, I finally repaired the KSP-8 and
> finished the opamp upgrade in the big Roland mixer and I even finished
> the design of the controller for the Looperlative. The hard disk in
> my development Mac got corrupted beyond repair it seems, so I had to
> completely reinstall - I ended up buying a new controller and putting
> in a couple big hard drives. That was good, as I was finally able to
> install the Quantum Leap Orchestra and Symphonic Choirs along with
> several of the other sample libraries I had purchased but never
> installed. (Ever checked out the Prominy LPC? Rawkin!) I recently
> got a Macbook, so I've been playing with that, even using Parallels to
> run Winders XP and RedHat Enterprise 4. It's fun to run Microsoft
> development tools on a Mac...!
>
> Oh, did I mention I gave up the DJ gig down at the radio station?
> Five days a week at 5 AM on top of the regular job got to be a bit much...
>
> Phew... How's that? ;-)
>
> Doug (Wow, after proof-reading that, I think I must be insane!)
>
>I meant antivirus. sorry

John wrote:
> Whatcha all think?
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/athome/security/spyware/software/de fault.mspxDoug,
What,no wood working? LOL
I'm just kidding. You are truly amazing!
I've got to get the kids off to school now,but I
e-mail you later when i get a chance. Look
for it in the near future.

respect
Nappy

Doug Wellington <doug@parisfaqs.com> wrote:
>"Nappy" <mgrant01@san.rr.com> wrote:
>> Good to see your post,how are you doing?
>> What you been up to?
>
>Nappy! Good to see you still here man! Oh, where to start... Well,
>I've been seeing guys around me getting old, and some dying, :( so I
>started to re-evaluate my life. In June, I got serious about getting
>some aerobic exercise. I started riding a road bike five days a week.

>(Lost 15 pounds in less than 3 weeks.) I even competed in the Arizona
>State Time Trials and I might compete in the El Tour de Tucson next
>month.
>
>My son damaged his knee, so he hasn't been able to play soccer or
>baseball for six months, so we've been doing other things. For
>example, a week and a half ago, we were up at Sunrise Ski for a
>downhill mountain bike race. My daughter took first place in her
>class, my wife took second in hers, and my son took third in his! We
>got about four inches of snow on that Sunday too - it was beautiful!
>I hadn't really been in snow since 1985 - forgot about that lovely
>crunching sound and the stillness - ahhh...
>
>We had a pack rat invasion earlier this year - the little bastards
>took all of my stained glass patterns and shredded them into a nest!
>They also hauled most of the sandpaper off, and they chewed into
>almost every cardboard box in my garage! I moved a lot of stuff onto
>the back porch and then the little $#!^s took over the porch, even
>chewing under the back door to come into the house! I think we've
>finally gotten rid of them though... (Funny, but when I was cleaning
>out the garage, I found a complete PARIS bundle 3, two 8-in cards and
>an extra EDS that I forgot I had! All still in original boxes...)
>
>My mom decided to move from Santa Barbara to Tucson, so she bought a
>couple houses (!) here, one for her to move into and one for my
>sister-in-law (brother's ex) and kids. I take all the kids to school,
>so I get to see my brother's kids almost every day, but he only sees
>them once or twice a year. Dang... Anyway, my mom dawdled and never
>got around to selling the Santa Barbara house during the housing boom,
>so now she can't sell it at all it seems. She's taken it off the
>market and is renting rooms out. Mean time, I get to take care of all
>three Tucson houses (mine, sister-in-law's, mom's including pool)
>along with everything else. Geesh...
>
>Work is hectic - I report directly to the president of our company
>now. I'm pretty much personally responsible for computing for half of
>our company! I've been scrambling to deploy CMS, WIKI, Forum, Blog
>and IM software to hopefully improve communication and collaboration
>along with taking care of the continuous stream of Linux upgrades, new
>employee computer needs, and trying to learn our DSP framework...
>
>On the music front, I blew off Different Skies this year, but enrolled
>in EIS, and got back to work on a couple projects - the analog synth
>is almost soldered up (40+ modules), the Chroma, T8, Fizmo and AN1x
>are all fixed up and working, I finally repaired the KSP-8 and
>finished the opamp upgrade in the big Roland mixer and I even finished
>the design of the controller for the Looperlative. The hard disk in
>my development Mac got corrupted beyond repair it seems, so I had to
>completely reinstall - I ended up buying a new controller and putting
>in a couple big hard drives. That was good, as I was finally able to
>install the Quantum Leap Orchestra and Symphonic Choirs along with
>several of the other sample libraries I had purchased but never
>installed. (Ever checked out the Prominy LPC? Rawkin!) I recently
>got a Macbook, so I've been playing with that, even using Parallels to
>run Winders XP and RedHat Enterprise 4. It's fun to run Microsoft
>development tools on a Mac...!
>
>Oh, did I mention I gave up the DJ gig down at the radio station?
>Five days a week at 5 AM on top of the regular job got to be a bit much...
>
>Phew... How's that? ;-)
>
>Doug (Wow, after proof-reading that, I think I must be insane!)
>
>Dedric,
My point has moe to do with 'head-room' of ITB mixes versus, using a analog
or digital mixer for summing.

There is a difference. Also, I challege anyone to open up say SX, DP, Logic
and play a stereo way file @ unity gain ..then, If you have copy of say Pr-Tools
LE M-powered, import that same file.. Then listen.
You can here the difference, even using the same audio interface..

I agree with you that you have to mix differently using the natives, but
Soft ware has a sound.. To me and others, to get make SX/Nuendo slam at it's
best, is to using a outboard summing mixer.

These days, my work flow is to record,edit,then bounce stems from Nuendo.
Simply put, there is no better workflow DAW on the planet for such tasks.
Then, I either mix in Pro-Tools or Paris depending on the color I'm going
for.

Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>Lamont - if your D-A converters affect the way you mix inside a DAW, you
>aren't mixing what you think you are. Certainly converters can sound
>different, but the differences at the RME/Apogee level aren't in siginficant
>areas (mainly a slight difference in sound of the top end - yes I've heard
>all of these, along with Myteks, Cranesong, DCS, and others side by side
-
>Cranesong is my favorite - Myteks are great, but a little sterile. DCS is
>just too expensive).
>
>1) If you are saying you mix differently on a console because you are using
>Apogee converters from the DAW with soft limit vs. RME converters, also
into
>the same desk (no mixing in SX, just playback), you are simply using the
>converters to color the signal (albeit only slightly), in different ways
-
>Softlimit just limiting. Nothing wrong with that, but that is altering
the
>tracks going in, not the mixing platform itself. Saying RME converters
>limit you because they don't have a limiter built in says you aren't mixing
>the way most of us do - you are trying to get analog saturation out of
>digital - ain't gonna happen.
>
>2) If you are mixing inside SX and change your approach depending on which
>converter you monitor through, then that's a problem since your bounces
>aren't going to be the same, and your decisions aren't going to be
>consistent. The idea is to have your monitoring chain *not* affect your
mix
>decisions, but enable more accurate ones.
>
>If you mixdown to a 2-track of some sort (Masterlink, etc), then you are
>using SoftLimit as a limiter on the output. You could achieve the same
>think in a multitude of different ways.
>
>Regards,
>Dedric
>
>On 10/24/06 1:44 PM, in article 453e6d24$1@linux, "LaMont"
><jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> Neil I do mix follow the native mix rules. No overs, faders around -5db
ect,
>> and I can make it sound good..
>>
>> However, when I add in a mixer for summing, all of those native mixing
rules
>> are out the window. The whole mix "sonically" opens up..
>>
>> As well as, If I'm using Apogees AD16x/DA16x with soft-limiter set on,
I
>> can mix like I want to in SX. With RME interface's and converters, I have
>> to abide by the rules.
>>
>> Lastly, when i have to mix (In the Box) using SX/Nuendo, I refer to the
>> Charles
>> dye method and add in Harmonic distortion via plugs in (namely) antares
Mic
>> modler(tube) on the inserts. This gives a different texture to the faders.
>> These days,I just use the SSL plugs which have that harmonic distort color
>> that helps a native mix...
>> "Neil" <OIUOIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> "LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> My Point exactly.. If all of you who use Nuendo or Cubase cannot hear
that
>>>> there is something going on (software-wise) in Cubase or Nuendo that's
>> not
>>>> bringing "Full-life" to our wav files, then,I'm sorry, your ears are
not
>>>> as good as you may think..
>>>
>>> There IS something going on... IME, I think that a lot of people
>>> are using the tool in a manner in which it was not designed for.
>>> It's not designed to accomodate 50 tracks worth of clips/overs
>>> resulting in hundreds of thousands of errors per second... it's
>>> as simple as that.
>>> I don't think anyone who's said you can get good mixes out of
>>> Native suystems has insisted that it sounds exactly like Paris
>>> (or PT, or analog, or anything else), so is something different
>>> going on? Yeah... it's different - doesn't mean that it can't be
>>> good.
>>
>I went to a Sonar 6 demo last night. I am primarily interested in the 64-bit
mix engine and how it sounds. My last experiment with Sonar was several years
ago and I hated the sound.
Zac Kenney from cakewalk gave the demo. Not that it was a surprise, but the
setup was not appropriate to judge audio quality, although I did hear one
acoustic track that may sound very good in a better environment.
Some high-end plug-ins like the Refined Audiometrics PLParEQ EQ work native
in Sonar at 64 bits (Audio engine). I have not heard this yet but is should
be very good. I hope Sony and Algorithmix do the same. The included convolution
reverb also runs native at 64 (as do most of the included plug-ins and some
of the VSTIs). A demo version is not available yet, so I will have to wait.

Audio engine aside, the feature set and ergonomic aspects of Sonar are very
impressive.
Running on a 64 bit OS, Sonar can address all the RAM you would ever need.
A 100 plus track session with streaming video and many VSTIs seemed like
a �walk in the park.� on a dual core PC.
It did crash during the demo, so overall the jury is still out.

GeneSSL works great with Paris.
The sound is phenomenal.
Never heard of such a good native eq with personality.
XP here .
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Goran Stojiljkovic" <goran.stojiljkovic@os.t-com.hr> wrote:
>does it work?
>latency ?
>
>please answer......
>
>Dear Brandon,
Paris is not able to record the wormholing track.
But why do you need to do that ?
Let Paris be your realtime (well alomost realtime but some good samples latent)
mixer.
Do all of you work under your "other" daw and let Parisjust fade pan eq and
eds process.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote:
>Sorry here is plasq's response:
>
>Wormhole just transfers audio from one insert slot to another. How you
>record that is a problem of the DAW. It might not be possible in basic DAWs.
>
>Unfortunately, we do not know Paris, so I can't tell you how to do that.
>It's the same as recording any plugin output. In most hosts it works by
>routing the audio to a bus and recording the bus.
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>Brandon
>
>"Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote in message news:453f6bb8$1@linux...
>> Additionally,
>> I tried using Wires to send from the WH2 channel to another channel and
>> record that channel.
>> That didnt work either.
>>
>> Here is Plasq's response:
>>
>> Adrian
>> Admin
>>
>> Admin
>> Posts: 28
>>
>>
>> Well, at least I got it working. I am going to try and send a loop
>> starting from inside PARIS on the same computer. Re:CubaseSX to PARIS
Same
>> Computer - 2006/10/25 22:03 Wormhole just transfers audio from one insert
>> slot to another. How you record that is a problem of the DAW. It might
not
>> be possible in basic DAWs.
>>
>> Unfortunately, we do not know Paris, so I can't tell you how to
do
>> that. It's the same as recording any plugin output. In most hosts it works
>> by routing the audio to a bus and recording the bus.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Brandon
>>
>>
>>
>> "Brandon" <a@a.com> wrote in message news:453ecae6$1@linux...
>> >
>> > Cuase SX 2.0.1 sending to PARIS 3.0.
>> > Both instances wrapped fxpansion3.3.
>> > Same Computer.
>> >
>> > Ok, here is the deal.
>> > I opened an instance of WH2 in Cubase SX 2.0.1.
>> > I named it"test".
>> > I selected "start".
>> > I opened an instance of WH2 in PARIS 3.0.
>> > I selected Test-end.
>> > I selected "end"
>> > I placed a 6 minute audio slice of silence on the channel in PARIS 3.0.
>> > I pushed play in Cubase.
>> > I pushed play in PARIS.
>> > It worked I got a connection and I could here the audio coming thru
the
>> > channel in PARIS.
>> > NOW HERE"S THE PROBLEM....
>> > I can't record the WH2 signal in PARIS!
>> > I press record in PARIS and it just records silence over the silence
I
>> already
>> > got there.
>> > I have to place the monitoring selection to During Record Only.
>> > Otherwise when I record enable the track the signal goes silent.
>> > When During Record Only is selected the signal keeps playing when record
>> > enabled, but just records silence.
>> > What could cause this?
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> > Brandon
>>
>>
>>
>
>yes it works. Thank god Waves still code their plugins in Direct-x. Surprisely,
the plug added no latency. However, the mix I was working on only had 10
tracks.

"Goran Stojiljkovic" <goran.stojiljkovic@os.t-com.hr> wrote:
>does it work?
>latency ?
>
>please answer......
>
>Hi,
The SSLcompressor has 0 latency.
Thee SSL channel has 1 sample latency.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>yes it works. Thank god Waves still code their plugins in Direct-x. Surprisely,
>the plug added no latency. However, the mix I was working on only had 10
>tracks.
>
>"Goran Stojiljkovic" <goran.stojiljkovic@os.t-com.hr> wrote:
>>does it work?
>>latency ?
>>
>>please answer......
>>
>>
>Neil,

Thanks for posting this. Last night I recorded a test song, drums, guitar,
and bass in DP. I dropped the individual channel faders to -6.0 and added a
limiter (for "make-up" gain and almost no limiting) to the DP main out. I
didn't raise any channel fader above -6.0. Only lowered channels to balance
levels. Even though I only had about 20 channels going, I could already tell
it was one of the better sounding mixes I've been able to get out of DP. Can
it really be this simple? I was so used to maximizing the levels in PARIS
that I took that methodology over to DP and my mixes in DP always sounded
"smaller". Now I'm jazzed about doing some more experimentation in DP.
Thanks again.

Tony

"Neil" <IOUIU@OIU.com> wrote in message news:453d8006$1@linux...
>
> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>>If we can't get decent mixes out of a native daw then something is wrong.
>> Let's find the thing that's wrong, and make it right.
>
> (Long, but thought-provoking, and hopefully helpful, rant
> follows):
>
> I think the thing that's wrong is that some people just can't
> get their heads around the differences between analog & digital.
> With analog, "big" = hotter, and so hotter is better. When you
> overbias your tape machines & smack the hell out of the tape,
> you're getting compression right off the bat on every track you
> do that with, so one gets used to hearing most tracks with some
> degree of tape compression already... and we all know that
> compression can make things sound "bigger". Or, you use a
> compressor on the way in to the tape so that you get a better
> SNR, but since that's not an issue with digital (unless you're
> recording at levels so low that you just simply get poor
> resolution, but that's a slightly different scenario), people
> quit using compressors on the way in to digital since SNR isn't
> an issue there.... you also can't smack an AD convertor hard &
> expect it to like it - unlike tape. So right off the bat we've
> got a whole different set of dynamics action going on from one
> world to the other - then, when you've already got that
> compressed kick or bassline on tape, you compress it more, and
> you're compressing an already-compressed signal, so when you
> apply compression to your uncompressed kick on your DAW you're
> thinking "nah, that CAN'T be right, it can't need THAT much
> compression! I'd better back that off a bit!" (because you're
> looking at the ratios & the threshhold, etc, instead of using
> your ears). EQ reacts differently with digital, too... if you're
> used to mixing on a console, you might be used to boosting or
> cutting something by 3, 4, 6db & getting an audible
> difference... with digital/plugin EQ's, sometimes you gotta
> boost or cut HUGE swaths of that frequency to really make a
> difference... why? I think it's a phase thing... you get more
> phase shift with analog filters, and so the change is more
> apparent at smaller degrees of boost & cut. That also helps to
> isolate things to have their own place in the mix at the same
> time... considering that phase is the reason we have two ears -
> it's the thing that makes it possible for us to tell which
> direction a sound is coming from - this makes perfect sense.
>
> So, those of us (and I think that's "most of us here") who cut
> our teeth in the analog world first, and are used to all the
> things mentioned above - and who have not changed that style of
> mixing - could be disappointed in Native systems - not because
> they fall short of analog or Paris, but because they are
> actually much more accurate (assuming good quality convertors)
> & as a result do not impart certain types of coloration that we
> might interpret as "pleasing". If you could go back to a great
> mix you did on analog & a console & take out half of the amount
> of dynamics processing & half of the amount of EQ'ing you did,
> what would you get? A mix that sounded flatter & more colorless
> & with less dimension than the one you ended up with. Want
> proof? Here it is: If you didn't need the amount of EQ &
> dynamics you applied, you wouldn't have done so! If half the
> amounts/degrees of those things would have sufficed, that's
> what you would have used! So Paris sounds & acts kinda like
> analog, and people who like Paris like that aspect of it... how
> do we know there's not a few lines of code in there somewhere
> that adds graduated degrees of even-harmonic distortion when
> you push the faders or saturate the mix buss to whatever
> degree? I personally don't think it's strictly a DSP thing,
> because let's face it.. a plugin is basically doing the same
> thing to your mix whether it's running of a processor on it's
> own card or off your CPU; the difference being how well a
> particular VST or Direct-X compressor or reverb is written (and
> what it's designed to do in terms of treating the sound) vs.
> whatever DSP compressor or reverb plugin you're talking about.
> Can I get an "Amen, brutha!" on that?
>
> Chuck's nailed the Paris mix buss thing, it seems, with that
> -22db at the channel & +22db at the mix buss, but WHY does that
> make a difference? Well, here's why gang... it's just as I said
> earlier in another thread - you've got to give yourself some
> headroom, dammit! Paris apparently does this for you. Want to
> prove me wrong? Open up a Paris mix and drag the mix buss
> master fader down 22db from wherever you have it, then insert
> any plugin that has an output level control on each individual
> channel of that mix - if the plugin is a compressor, for
> example, don't use any compression, just use the output
> control - now boost every channel by 22db using that output
> control... if it only goes up 10 db, then insert that plugin
> twice in a row & max out the output on each insertion...
> that'll be close enough... how's that sound? I'll bet it won't
> sound all that good! Are you hearing that "overstuffed" mix
> buss sound? Is it smaller, with less dimension? I'd be curious
> to see what you guys think if you try this. Now that we know
> what Chuck told us he discovered, this is the best way to see
> if that makes a difference or not (my guess - it DOES make a
> difference, otherwise, they wouldn't have written the code that
> way!).
>
>
> So how can you get "big" in Native? Give yourself what Paris
> apparently already gives you... some headroom - think "clean",
> then dirty it up if you have to later... hell, just mash the
> mix with a comp & limiter or an L2 or something equivalent -
> you'll get all the harmonic distortion you want. I wasn't
> kidding the other day when I said: "Think zen when mixing in
> Cubase" it's all gotta flow without clips, gang... think about
> it... if you have one channel getting "overs" in a 32-bit float-
> point system, you may not notice it... heck you can't notice
> each sample in a given sound file can you? Of course not. But
> if you start adding more channels, and each of those channels
> is running hot... let's say 32 channels - as a comparison
> for you guys running two-card paris systems & no native mixes.
> and let's say you're running hot (over zero) about 25% of the
> time on each channel - that's 352,000 errors PER SECOND across
> the 32 tracks. That's a lot of floating-point math going on
> there, isn't it? And in this scenario, I want you to think of
> each error as a mistake, because that's what it is... in this
> style of mixing, it's a mistake. How can you expect something
> that's got 352,000 mistakes per second going on, to sound good?
>
> Are you still not convinced? Then you should also definitely
> investigate running stems (submixes) & reimporting. When I've
> done this I definitely can hear a difference, and I suspect you
> most likely will be able to as well.. it is NOT a huge
> difference, but it's audible. In fact, some months ago I posted
> a stems mix vs. a non-stems mix & a number of you said you
> could hear a difference. Now, if you think "aww, this is just
> another pain-in-the-ass procedure I have to go through if I mix
> in Native", keep in mind that you can run 90 Million stems
> mixes in the time it will take Deej to set up his first Pulsar
> card, and another 900 million in the time that it takes Chuck
> to research & write that plugin (OK, just giving hell to Deej
> there, and no really no offense intended to Chucks coding
> capability, but I'm just saying this is something you can do
> RIGHT NOW, TONIGHT if you want to if you have a Native system,
> without having to wait for anything new). Now, if you have a
> small project - one acoustic guitar, piano, & a vocal - with
> just a few tracks, running stems won't make a difference, but
> if you have a large project, give it a shot... you may not hear
> enough of a difference to make it worth doing in any given
> instance, but then again, you might.
>
> So, now that I hope I've made my case, here's my own personal
> guidelines for Native mixing - try it out & see wat you think:
>
> 1.) Do NOT bring down your Master Fader. It stays at zero
> (unless you're doing a fade).
>
> 2.) On your Master inserts, use a peakstop/brickwall limiter
> set anywhere from -.03 to -3db, depending on how much headroom
> you want to give your mastering engineer. Settings for volume
> maximization & other parameters will, of course, depend on the
> program material.
>
> 3.) Record at 24-bit 88.2k or higher (Dan Lavry has a white
> paper that makes a good case for a 60k sample rate - in order
> to get the ringing from the convertors' FIR filters out of the
> top range of our hearing - but since there is no standard 60k
> sample rate, 88.2 is the next one up). Also, 16-bit may have
> worked with Paris for whatever reason (maybe it just enhanced
> the harmonic distortion you're hearing?), but let's face it,
> everybody knows that more bits = greater "truth", especially
> when combined with higher resolutions.
>
> 4.) Default your individual channel settings to -6db or lower...
> I find that -6 is a good place to start because you can load up
> a decent amount of tracks without overloading the mix buss &
> hitting your limiter too hard at that level. Consider setting
> it lower as a starting point if you plan on getting into the
> range of 40+ tracks. HERE'S THE KEY... if you've got your mix
> roughed out & you can pull out that peakstop limiter I
> mentioned in #2 & NOT go over zero on the Master - you're
> golden. Fuck it, set 'em all at -15 as a starting point if you
> want, Paris is already setting them for you at -22, right? If
> you're getting a few scant overs without the limiter, you're
> still ok, really... the idea is not to overstuff the mix buss
> so heavily that if you pull the limiter off you're going into
> the +5, +6 range without it.
>
> Think "clean" people = think "no clips" (or as few as
> possible), you get 30-40 channels of "overs" constantly (like
> the 352,000 of 'em per second in the example I gave earlier),
> and it's going to get harsh & thin.... it's a cumulative effect.
>
> That's it, really... it's just like any other tool - you can't
> use an allen wrench to properly drive a nail, and you can't use
> a hammer to trim your nose hair.
>
> Happy Native mixing!
>
> (think "zen"!)
>
> Neil"Nappy" <mgrant01@san.rr.com> wrote in message news:453f7722$1@linux...
> What, no wood working? LOL

Heehee, I forgot about that! My martial arts instructor/family doctor
bought a bunch of land out in the Chiracahuas and has been building a
fortress...I mean house...for some time. He bought some big glass windows
from a bank (I think they're bullet-proof or something) and needed a couple
custom window frames made, so of course, since everyone knows Doug has a
woodshop, they just stacked a bunch of redwood outside the door and waited
for me to come home and take care of everything! And this was in the middle
of my packrat war too, so the shop floor was covered in turds. BTW, did I
mention the little rat bastards had filled my 4" dust collection system with
cholla buds and dried dog poo? Oh yeah, remind me to tell you the story of
how the packrats had been collecting the dog doo and putting it in a pile
just on the other side of my backyard wall. (And here I thought the kids
were being good...)

Anyway, the windows were the same height, but about an inch and a half
different in width. Since they were going to be put into two openings of
similar size, I made one of the frames with deeper slots for the longer
piece of glass. Well, they forgot to test fit everything, so they ended up
assembling the small glass into the big frame. Then, when they tried to put
the big glass into the small frame, they realized what they had done and had
to spend a couple hours prying everything back apart!!! Sheesh!!!

Never dull,
Doug

http://www.parisfaqs.com"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
news:453f6cc2@linux...
> Doesn't this belong in the "nut we have to crack" thread, LOL?

Good to see you too Aaron! ;-)

Doug (The nut was already a bit cracked...)

http://www.parisfaqs.comcan you build me a doghouse? hehe

Doug Wellington wrote:
> "Nappy" <mgrant01@san.rr.com> wrote in message news:453f7722$1@linux...
>> What, no wood working? LOL
>
> Heehee, I forgot about that! My martial arts instructor/family doctor
> bought a bunch of land out in the Chiracahuas and has been building a
> fortress...I mean house...for some time. He bought some big glass windows
> from a bank (I think they're bullet-proof or something) and needed a couple
> custom window frames made, so of course, since everyone knows Doug has a
> woodshop, they just stacked a bunch of redwood outside the door and waited
> for me to come home and take care of everything! And this was in the middle
> of my packrat war too, so the shop floor was covered in turds. BTW, did I
> mention the little rat bastards had filled my 4" dust collection system with
> cholla buds and dried dog poo? Oh yeah, remind me to tell you the story of
> how the packrats had been collecting the dog doo and putting it in a pile
> just on the other side of my backyard wall. (And here I thought the kids
> were being good...)
>
> Anyway, the windows were the same height, but about an inch and a half
> different in width. Since they were going to be put into two openings of
> similar size, I made one of the frames with deeper slots for the longer
> piece of glass. Well, they forgot to test fit everything, so they ended up
> assembling the small glass into the big frame. Then, when they tried to put
> the big glass into the small frame, they realized what they had done and had
> to spend a couple hours prying everything back apart!!! Sheesh!!!
>
> Never dull,
> Doug
>
> http://www.parisfaqs.com
>
>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_00AD_01C6F83B.70760720
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

What's a sample among friends?
T.

"Dimitrios" <musurgio@otenet.gr> wrote in message =
news:453f8b69$1@linux...

Hi,
The SSLcompressor has 0 latency.
Thee SSL channel has 1 sample latency.
Regards,
Dimitrios

"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>yes it works. Thank god Waves still code their plugins in Direct-x. =
Surprisely,
>the plug added no latency. However, the mix I was working on only had =
10
>tracks.=20
>
>"Goran Stojiljkovic" <goran.stojiljkovic@os.t-com.hr> wrote:
>>does it work?
>>latency ?
>>
>>please answer......=20
>>
>>
>

I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, and you?
http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html
------=_NextPart_000_00AD_01C6F83B.70760720
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>What's a sample among =
friends?</DIV>
<DIV>T.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Dimitrios" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:musurgio@otenet.gr">musurgio@otenet.gr</A>> wrote in =
message=20
<A=20
=
href=3D"news:453f8b69$1@linux">news:453f8b69$1@linux</A>...</DIV> Hi,<=
BR>The=20
SSLcompressor has 0 latency. Thee SSL channel has 1 sample=20
latency. Regards, Dimitrios "LaMont" <<A=20
href=3D"mailto:jjdpro@ameritech.net">jjdpro@ameritech.net</A>>=20
wrote: > >yes it works. Thank god Waves still code their =
plugins=20
in Direct-x. Surprisely, >the plug added no latency. However, =
the mix I=20
was working on only had 10 >tracks. > >"Goran =
Stojiljkovic"=20
<<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:goran.stojiljkovic@os.t-com.hr">goran.stojiljkovic@os.t-co=
m.hr</A>>=20
wrote: >>does it work? >>latency=20
? >> >>please answer......=20
 >> >> > </BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV> I choose Polesoft Lockspam to fight spam, =
and=20
you? <A=20
href=3D"http://www.polesoft.com/refer.html">http://www.polesoft.com/refer=
..html</A>   </DIV></BODY ></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_00AD_01C6F83B.70760720--"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:453f9a3d$1@linux...
> can you build me a doghouse? hehe

You want the one I've been living in for the last year? ;-)

Doug

http://www.parisfaqs.comWhat other ones?

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com

j-cron wrote:
> They sound ok. Not as good as the other ones.
>
> "Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message news:453ea17b$1@linux...
>> You can't go wrong with the K240S. I use it all the time as well in the
>> studio
>> as
>> at home. Great value for the money.
>>
>> Greetings
>> Ab
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>> I hear you Deej, I'm half dead now. My left side has gone numb. Or is it
>>> my right side?
>>>
>>> Plus, I have a Powerplay Pro-XL that I haven't been able to kill, and
>>> now it may never die...
>>>
>>> I guess I'll just get the K240S and see if the numbness goes away, but
>>> the headset amp is probably safe now.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>>> DJ wrote:
>>>> I don't know who works on these but without my older (600 ohm) K240DF's
>> I
>>>> would die.......plus....you can kill Behringer headphone amps with these
>>>> too.
>>>>
>>>> ;op
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:453daccc@linux...
>>>>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left
>>>>> channel.
>>>>> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
>>>> itself.
>>>>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>>>>
>>>>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>>>>
>>>>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>>>>
>>>>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55
>>>>> instead
>>>>> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>
>Not yet, I have to melt it apart first. Thanks for the suggestion!

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com

James McCloskey wrote:
> Hey Jamie! Did you check the continuity between the plug and the driver?
> It could be the cable, or a bad connection at the driver.
>
> James
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.
>
>> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset itself.
>>
>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>
>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>
>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>
>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead
>
>> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>WARM, not melt... ;-)

David.

Jamie K wrote:
>
> Not yet, I have to melt it apart first. Thanks for the suggestion!
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
> James McCloskey wrote:
>
>> Hey Jamie! Did you check the continuity between the plug and the driver?
>> It could be the cable, or a bad connection at the driver.
>>
>> James
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>
>>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left channel.
>>
>>
>>> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
>>> itself.
>>>
>>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>>
>>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>>
>>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>>
>>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55 instead
>>
>>
>>> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>I've been impressed by SIR. Somebody made it run with Paris ?Uh, sorry David, can't hear you over the sound of the flamethrower...

Heh.

Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com

EK Sound wrote:
> WARM, not melt... ;-)
>
> David.
>
> Jamie K wrote:
>>
>> Not yet, I have to melt it apart first. Thanks for the suggestion!
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Jamie! Did you check the continuity between the plug and the
>>> driver?
>>> It could be the cable, or a bad connection at the driver.
>>>
>>> James
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> My formerly trusty AKG K240DF headset no longer gives me a left
>>>> channel.
>>>
>>>
>>>> The jack wiring seems OK, so the problem is somewhere in the headset
>>>> itself.
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone have any recommendations for:
>>>>
>>>> A) A good place to fix it?
>>>>
>>>> B) A good reference headset at around the same price?
>>>>
>>>> The K240S is the current AKG model at $99. Lower impedance at 55
>>>> instead
>>>
>>>
>>>> of 600 ohms. Any opinions on those?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>I'm gonna DL Ardour and the source code and see if I can figure out how to
get it to work on Windows.

;oD

"Doug Wellington" <doug@parisfaqs.com> wrote in message
news:862A008B-63F7-11DB-B21B-000393A9F344%doug@parisfaqs.com...
> "Geoff MacKenzie" <gmkmail@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > After being hosed 2x by proprietary DAW venders I wonder if it isn't
better
> > to support projects like Ardour? Anyone ever give it a go? Thoughts?
> >
> > http://www.ardour.org/
>

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