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"Skunk" Baxter, missle defense expert? [message #61584] Mon, 19 December 2005 10:00 Go to next message
Tony Benson is currently offline  Tony Benson   UNITED STATES
Messages: 453
Registered: June 2006
Senior Member
ently running DAW with audio/midi and was thinking of getting
>>into the SX thing.
>> I haven't gotten into the soft synth thing at all so I'm a
>>little hesitant having to go the new dedicated comp,software,vsti
>>route compared to a hardware synth I can turn on and make noise
>
Re: "Skunk" Baxter, missle defense expert? [message #61587 is a reply to message #61584] Mon, 19 December 2005 10:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Deej [1] is currently offline  Deej [1]   UNITED STATES
Messages: 2149
Registered: January 2006
Senior Member
.Track
>balancing becomes off kilter.. YOu speed so much time just trying to put
>out fires that you lose focus on the mix.. Then all of a sudden, here comes
>that Nuendoi smearinng sound,..Nice and smooth..But, you're trying mix agresiive
>!@@@ARGG.... So, then you start making trade offs on masert fader levels
>(-5bd).. And so on and so it goes.. TOOO Much work ..In _PAris and PT ,
>could've been done in jiffy..
>
>
>Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>FWIW, I'm producing a rap/R&B project in Nuendo - so far no problems getting
>>it to sound really good. I see your point, and maybe there is a magic
wall
>>at 30-40 simultaneous tracks in 32-bit float, but I just don't see many
>>p
Re: "Skunk" Baxter, missle defense expert? [message #61602 is a reply to message #61587] Mon, 19 December 2005 13:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rod Lincoln is currently offline  Rod Lincoln
Messages: 883
Registered: September 2005
Senior Member
t;
> > > >>>> >Jeremy
> > > >>>> >
> > > >>>> >
> > > >>>> >
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> Sounds like directory deletion.
> > > >>>> Try:
> > > >>>> http://www.stellarinfo.com/disk-recovery.htm
> > > >>>> or
> > > >>>> http://www.ontrack.com/
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>> And next time call the track "Lucky Indie"
> > > >>>> g
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>Thad, you are of course right.

I can't get used to the concept of "cheap laptops." Odd, since I'm quite
conversant with the concept of "cheap everything else."

the equipment I used on my new year's gig cost me... hmm... about $250...with
cables, let's say $300...

-steve

"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>A valid point, the playing live part, but if someone spills beer on your
$3k
>Motif you're out more than if the same guy spills beer in your $600 Dell
>laptop. I DJ with a laptop fairly often and it's worth less than all but
>two of my guitras, all of my amps. Actually, my Moog delay and Fulltone
wah
>have a significantly higher replacement cost than my laptop.
>
>TCB
>
>"steve the artguy" <artguy@svnsillyme.net> wrote:
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>At this point I'm waiting for someone to give me even one solid reason
>to
>>>use hardware synths other than familiarity.
>>>
>>>TCB
>>
>>
>>ok, Thad, here's one.,
>>
>>I have yet to take anything small to a gig (mixer, rompler module, etc)
>which
>>I put carefully on top of my keyboard thingies, which hasn't gotten knocked
>>off and onto the ground. Whether it's the drunks in the audience or careless
>>band members or my own stupid self, it seems to happen to every one of
them.
>>I'd hate to have that happen with a laptop. Crunch!
>>
>>That, and I'm the only one in the known universe at this point without
a
>>laptop...or a cell phone...or a pda... or a gps... or...an automated loom....
>>
>>
>>-steve the luddite
>>
>>-steve
>>>
>>>"Pete Ruthenburg" <ruthenburg@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> So I'm looking to get a new synth in here.Pretty slim synth
>>>>collection-Kurz PC2X and 2500 rack,D50.I'm looking at the Yamaha
>>>>motifs,but a buddy was telling me I should go soft synth.I'm not
>>>>currently running DAW with audio/midi and was thinking of getting
>>>>into the SX thing.
>>>> I haven't gotten into the soft synth thing at all so I'm a
>>>>little hesitant having to go the new dedicated comp,software,vsti
>>>>route compared to a hardware synth I can turn on and make noise
>>>>with.
>>>> However,I can see the benefit of going that route with software
>>>>that will continually be updated as opposed to a hard synth that
>>>>will be worth whatever in a couple of years.
>>>>
>>>>Any advice appreciated,
>>>>Pete
>>>
>>
>>>At this point I'm waiting for someone to give me even one solid reason
to
>>use hardware synths other than familiarity.
>>
>>TCB

I'll give you another, but probabably not one that applies to you. I've
been tossing around the idea of getting a nice synth workstation. I'm not
really a keyboardist and don't do much electronic music. I have a few soft
synths, some freebies/built-ins and some that I bought. I also have Emulator-X
and an Oasys card. It's all quite a pain in the ass to manage when I need
to put a keyboard part down. I'm not intimate with all these synths, so
I waste a lot of time hunting around for what I want, often not finding it.
Having a workstation with a large soundbank would alow me to just scroll
through sounds until something sparked my creative funny bone. My Oasys
is the antithesis of this approach. You really need to know what you are
looking for. Hardware synths also give the ability to just turn on a synth
in less than a second and just start playing. Sometimes this is very valuable
too. And finally, when I need to upgrade my computer to run "Hungry Reverb
4.0 (tm)", I don't need to rebuild my arsenal of synths, and a trusty old
Kurzweil 2500 doesn't care when you migrate to a new OS on your computer.

Hardware synths, good for midiots ;-)
-ChrisTony, It sounds like you are actually describing a pad. Piezos have very
high output impedances and need a buffer amp as an input when passing audio,
like the on board preamps used on an acoustic guitar. The purpose of this
buffer amp is to raise the input impedance that the transducer sees. This
prevents the transducer from being unduly loaded by the input amplifier and
keeps the frquency response even and alows for maximum signal transfer between
pickup and amplifier. Plugging a piezo into a normal 10Kohm line input actually
would drop the signal down versus the same piezo through a proper buffer
amp at unity gain feeding the same pre. Since the audio quality isn't a concearn
with the trigger signal, pretty much any method of getting the right signal
voltage would be fine. I've triggered drumgog with a radioshack piezo taped
to a wooden board. I ran this into a little mackie and then into my recording
software. I can't recall if I needed to use a mic or line input though,
but whatever gets the required gain should be fine.

-Chris

"Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>Yes, the voltage output of a piezo drum trigger is proportional to how much

>it vibrates. They work just a piezo bridge on a guitar. The problem is that

>they don't always operate at an impedance consistent with audio gear. This

>is why it might be necessary to experiment with "buffer" resistors between

>the hot and ground connection of the triggers. One way to do this would
be
>to run the trigger into the line in of a mixer channel and use the gain

>control to adjust the level of the direct output back into your recording

>gear. If the output is too hot even at the lowest gain setting, it's time
to
>get the solder iron out. I remember some triggers I used to use back in
the
>late 80's had resistors soldered between the hot and ground lugs of the
1/4
>plugs. And that was to buffer the output down to work with regular trigger

>inputs. You'd have to experiment to get it right for audio inputs. It should

>actually work very well with Drumagog.
>
>Tony
>
>
>"jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>news:43bedeb9@linux...
>> could you still get velocity info this way, or would it be edit-city?
>>
>> Tony Benson wrote:
>>
>>>Jef,
>>>
>>>Since Dimitrios wants to use Drumagog as his sound source, an external

>>>trigger to midi device really wouldn't be necessary and might actually

>>>introduce some extra latency from the midi conversion. I think a recorded

>>>trigger pulse would actually be the best way to "trigger" Drumagog as

>>>there would be much less crosstalk and the threshold on Drumagog could
be
>>>lowered quite a bit. I may actually experiment with this scenario a
>>>little. I don't think I'll quit recording my "real" drums, but now I'm

>>>intrigued.
>>>
>>>Tony
>>>
>>>
>>>"jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>>>news:43be6f5c@linux...
>>>
>>>>now *that's* a good trick!
>>>>
>>>>still suspicious of the other use though. for the 199 you can pick up
a
>>>>dm-5 for it doesn't seem, to me anyway, worth the exp hassles.
>>>>
>>>>just my 2cents
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Aaron Allen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Another sweet trick is to put triggers on a conventional kit and use

>>>>>them to
>>>>>open the gates :)
>>>>>AA
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote in message
>>>>>news:43bd53ff@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>The voltage from the triggers will record just like audio. Basically,
a
>>>>>>piezo trigger acts as a contact microphone. The bandwidth is usually

>>>>>>very
>>>>>>narrow and the sensitivity is much less than a conventional microphone.
>>>>>>You will need to do some tweaking to get the gain and sensitivity
>>>>>>right,
>>>>>>but that shouldn't be too difficult. One thing to remember though is

>>>>>>that
>>>>>>triggers are sensitive to vibration from the whole drum kit. There
will
>>>>>>be
>>>>>>a trade off between sensitivity and reducing false triggering, so that
>>>>>>means it's difficult to get a wide range of trigger velocities without
>>>>>>risking some double or false triggering. This is one area where an
>>>>>>external trigger input device can help, as they can be set to ignore
>>>>>>double triggering and usually have various settings to optimize the
>>>>>>trigger's output. Anyway, if your doing pop, rock, or other music that
>>>>>>doesn't necessarily require a lot of "finesse" on the drums, you should

>>>>>>be
>>>>>>able to make triggers and drumagog work. Don't plan on being able to
do
>>>>>>jazz or snare parts with ghost notes, etc. One thing you might also

>>>>>>want
>>>>>>to look into is putting mesh heads on the drums in addition to filling

>>>>>>the
>>>>>>shells with foam, packing peanuts, etc. That would reduce to "click"
>>>>>>attack you'll get with regular drum heads.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Tony
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:43bd4794@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I use triggers both in the studio and live (kick only).
>>>>>>>I don't see how triggers could work w/o an interface between them
and
>>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>software. What are you thinkin', just put them into an audio input?

>>>>>>>I'm
>>>>>>>not familliar with drummagog but w/o the interface where will you
get
>>>>>>>all
>>>>>>>the velocity etc info? Won't you have to convert the voltage from
the
>>>>>>>trigger into something useful?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>jef
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Dimitrios wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Hi and happy new year.
>>>>>>>>I amconsidering trying these roland drum triggers.
>>>>>>>>I only wonder can these trigger signals be recorded and asre these
>>>>>>>>reliable
>>>>>>>>enouph to drive Drumagog's engine ?
>>>>>>>>Thus not to buy and trigger to midi device that makes things more
>>>>>>>>complicated.
>>>>>>>>I would like to have clean (no leackage) trigger sound that could

>>>>>>>>drive
>>>>>>>>drumagog
>>>>>>>>perfectly (if you can say that)
>>>>>>>>I am already using it with real drum sounds but sometimes leackage
is
>>>>>>>>an
>>>>>>>>enemy to perfect sound replacement.
>>>>>>>>Any insight in this direction would be appreciatted.
>>>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>>>Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>"Just the two of us" is Grover Washington Jr.
Sounds alot like Lou though.




"Miguel Vigil" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message news:43bef51a$1@linux...
> RIP, Lou
>
> El Miguel ..... "just the two of us"
>
>
>
>
> "Lance Reichert" <lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:43be9a36$1@linux...
> > What a voice - thanks Lou!
> >
> > http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10737897/
> >
> > Singer Lou Rawls dies of cancer at 72
> > Grammy winner began as choir boy, sold 40 million albums
> >
> >
>
>Using it here with Nuendo via rewire - works great. There are other synths
and effects that sound better than comparable components in Reason, but for
putting together electronica, dance, and even pop or rap rhythm tracks it's
a cool app. It's also a great app to use for some composing work on the
road on a laptop as it's cpu friendly - you can get a lot of tracks/sounds
going pretty easily for sketching out ideas.

Combinator patches are a bit more applicable for standalone synth use since
you can layer/combine synths and effects to create broader and more dynamic
sounds.

For the money, it's a lot of fun, and can be quite useful. I believe the
track for the show Alias was composed on a laptop with Reason, FWIW.

I'm doing some tracks in it, but remixing in Nuendo for better reverbs, EQ,
etc.

Dedric

On 1/6/06 10:44 AM, in article 43be9e63$1@linux, "Pete Ruthenburg"
<ruthenburg@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>
> So is anybody using this?Seems like it could be useful or is it
> just popular with the electronica/dance crowd?Obviously the
> orchestral type sounds don't compare to other libraries,but it
> seems like you get alot for the money.
> Or is that the selling point;alot of good but not great sounds
> for the money.
>
> PeteExactly Chris. You obviously have a much better technical understanding of
it than I do, but that's what I was trying to say. As long as you can get
the trigger signal recorded with a decent amount of dynamic range, you
should be able to get great results with Drumagog.

Tony

On 1/7/06 12:04 AM, in article 43bf4bec$1@linux, "Chris Wargo" <na@na.na>
wrote:

>
> Tony, It sounds like you are actually describing a pad. Piezos have very
> high output impedances and need a buffer amp as an input when passing audio,
> like the on board preamps used on an acoustic guitar. The purpose of this
> buffer amp is to raise the input impedance that the transducer sees. This
> prevents the transducer from being unduly loaded by the input amplifier and
> keeps the frquency response even and alows for maximum signal transfer between
> pickup and amplifier. Plugging a piezo into a normal 10Kohm line input
> actually
> would drop the signal down versus the same piezo through a proper buffer
> amp at unity gain feeding the same pre. Since the audio quality isn't a
> concearn
> with the trigger signal, pretty much any method of getting the right signal
> voltage would be fine. I've triggered drumgog with a radioshack piezo taped
> to a wooden board. I ran this into a little mackie and then into my recording
> software. I can't recall if I needed to use a mic or line input though,
> but whatever gets the required gain should be fine.
>
> -Chris
>
> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote:
>> Yes, the voltage output of a piezo drum trigger is proportional to how much
>
>> it vibrates. They work just a piezo bridge on a guitar. The problem is that
>
>> they don't always operate at an impedance consistent with audio gear. This
>
>> is why it might be necessary to experiment with "buffer" resistors between
>
>> the hot and ground connection of the triggers. One way to do this would
> be
>> to run the trigger into the line in of a mixer channel and use the gain
>
>> control to adjust the level of the direct output back into your recording
>
>> gear. If the output is too hot even at the lowest gain setting, it's time
> to
>> get the solder iron out. I remember some triggers I used to use back in
> the
>> late 80's had resistors soldered between the hot and ground lugs of the
> 1/4
>> plugs. And that was to buffer the output down to work with regular trigger
>
>> inputs. You'd have to experiment to get it right for audio inputs. It should
>
>> actually work very well with Drumagog.
>>
>> Tony
>>
>>
>> "jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>> news:43bedeb9@linux...
>>> could you still get velocity info this way, or would it be edit-city?
>>>
>>> Tony Benson wrote:
>>>
>>>> Jef,
>>>>
>>>> Since Dimitrios wants to use Drumagog as his sound source, an external
>
>>>> trigger to midi device really wouldn't be necessary and might actually
>
>>>> introduce some extra latency from the midi conversion. I think a recorded
>
>>>> trigger pulse would actually be the best way to "trigger" Drumagog as
>
>>>> there would be much less crosstalk and the threshold on Drumagog could
> be
>>>> lowered quite a bit. I may actually experiment with this scenario a
>>>> little. I don't think I'll quit recording my "real" drums, but now I'm
>
>>>> intrigued.
>>>>
>>>> Tony
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:43be6f5c@linux...
>>>>
>>>>> now *that's* a good trick!
>>>>>
>>>>> still suspicious of the other use though. for the 199 you can pick up
> a
>>>>> dm-5 for it doesn't seem, to me anyway, worth the exp hassles.
>>>>>
>>>>> just my 2cents
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Aaron Allen wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Another sweet trick is to put triggers on a conventional kit and use
>
>>>>>> them to
>>>>>> open the gates :)
>>>>>> AA
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:43bd53ff@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The voltage from the triggers will record just like audio. Basically,
> a
>>>>>>> piezo trigger acts as a contact microphone. The bandwidth is usually
>
>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>> narrow and the sensitivity is much less than a conventional microphone.
>>>>>>> You will need to do some tweaking to get the gain and sensitivity
>>>>>>> right,
>>>>>>> but that shouldn't be too difficult. One thing to remember though is
>
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> triggers are sensitive to vibration from the whole drum kit. There
> will
>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>> a trade off between sensitivity and reducing false triggering, so that
>>>>>>> means it's difficult to get a wide range of trigger velocities without
>>>>>>> risking some double or false triggering. This is one area where an
>>>>>>> external trigger input device can help, as they can be set to ignore
>>>>>>> double triggering and usually have various settings to optimize the
>>>>>>> trigger's output. Anyway, if your doing pop, rock, or other music that
>>>>>>> doesn't necessarily require a lot of "finesse" on the drums, you should
>
>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>> able to make triggers and drumagog work. Don't plan on being able to
> do
>>>>>>> jazz or snare parts with ghost notes, etc. One thing you might also
>
>>>>>>> want
>>>>>>> to look into is putting mesh heads on the drums in addition to filling
>
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> shells with foam, packing peanuts, etc. That would reduce to "click"
>>>>>>> attack you'll get with regular drum heads.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tony
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:43bd4794@linux...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I use triggers both in the studio and live (kick only).
>>>>>>>> I don't see how triggers could work w/o an interface between them
> and
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> software. What are you thinkin', just put them into an audio input?
>
>>>>>>>> I'm
>>>>>>>> not familliar with drummagog but w/o the interface where will you
> get
>>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>>> the velocity etc info? Won't you have to convert the voltage from
> the
>>>>>>>> trigger into something useful?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> jef
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dimitrios wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi and happy new year.
>>>>>>>>> I amconsidering trying these roland drum triggers.
>>>>>>>>> I only wonder can these trigger signals be recorded and asre these
>>>>>>>>> reliable
>>>>>>>>> enouph to drive Drumagog's engine ?
>>>>>>>>> Thus not to buy and trigger to midi device that makes things more
>>>>>>>>> complicated.
>>>>>>>>> I would like to have clean (no leackage) trigger sound that could
>
>>>>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>> drumagog
>>>>>>>>> perfectly (if you can say that)
>>>>>>>>> I am already using it with real drum sounds but sometimes leackage
> is
>>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>>> enemy to perfect sound replacement.
>>>>>>>>> Any insight in this direction would be appreciatted.
>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>> Dimitrios
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>Yeah, Ive been using it for about 6 months.
It rocks for anything electronic IMHO.
It might be the most fun I've had making music ever.
As for the sound quality, it's on par with anything around, but I can
get a Linndrum to sound good, lol.
It's a great tool, like everything else.
Your creativity and skill are what really counts.
-Will



"Pete Ruthenburg" <ruthenburg@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> So is anybody using this?Seems like it could be useful or is it
>just popular with the electronica/dance crowd?Obviously the
>orchestral type sounds don't compare to other libraries,but it
>seems like you get alot for the money.
> Or is that the selling point;alot of good but not great sounds
>for the money.
>
>PeteThis is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0521_01C6133E.C4E1CBB0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
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Just The Two Of Us
Grover with Bill Withers.

Very Lou-ish.


"Lance Reichert" <lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net> wrote in message =
news:43bf4c4f@linux...
"Just the two of us" is Grover Washington Jr.
Sounds alot like Lou though.




"Miguel Vigil" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message =
news:43bef51a$1@linux...
> RIP, Lou
>
> El Miguel ..... "just the two of us"
>
>
>
>
> "Lance Reichert" <lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:43be9a36$1@linux...
> > What a voice - thanks Lou!
> >
> > http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10737897/
> >
> > Singer Lou Rawls dies of cancer at 72
> > Grammy winner began as choir boy, sold 40 million albums
> >
> >
>
>


------=_NextPart_000_0521_01C6133E.C4E1CBB0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Just The Two Of Us</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Grover with Bill Withers.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Very Lou-ish.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Lance Reichert" &lt;<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net">lance.rocks@nospam.verizon=
..net</A>&gt;=20
wrote in message <A=20
href=3D"news:43bf4c4f@linux">news:43bf4c4f@linux</A>...</DIV>"Just the =
two of=20
us" is&nbsp; Grover Washington Jr.<BR>Sounds alot like Lou=20
though.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>"Miguel Vigil" &lt;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:nospam@nospam.com">nospam@nospam.com</A>&gt; wrote in =
message <A=20
href=3D"news:43bef51a$1@linux">news:43bef51a$1@linux</A>...<BR>&gt; =
RIP,=20
Lou<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; El Miguel ..... "just the two of=20
us"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR >&gt; "Lance Reichert" &lt;<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net">lance.rocks@nospam.verizon=
..net</A>&gt;=20
wrote in message<BR>&gt; <A=20
href=3D"news:43be9a36$1@linux">news:43be9a36$1@linux</A>...<BR>&gt; =
&gt; What a=20
voice - thanks Lou!<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; <A=20
=
href=3D"http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10737897/">http://www.msnbc.msn.com/i=
d/10737897/</A><BR>&gt;=20
&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Singer Lou Rawls dies of cancer at 72<BR>&gt; &gt; =
Grammy=20
winner began as choir boy, sold 40 million albums<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; =

&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE> </BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0521_01C6133E.C4E1CBB0--Hi All

So say I was to use drum trigger system (via midi) to trigger the sounds in
something like BFD or DFH in my computer...any idea what kind of latency I'd
be looking at in a live situation

Thanks

DonOh no! I thought you were talking about dithering... lol.


"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
news:43beaa24$1@linux...
> Sooooo.....do you video tape it too?
>
> "Ed" <askme@email.com> wrote in message news:43be6faa$1@linux...
> > I like to watch mine dither.... tho... :)
> >
> >
> > "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
> > news:43bdf55a@linux...
> > > Ain't that *special file* thing cool? I love being able to just skip
the
> > > whole dither step.
> > >
> > > ;o)
> > >
> > > "Lance Reichert" <lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net> wrote in message
> > > news:43bded96@linux...
> > > > You can import a 24 bit stereo wav and export the file as an mp3
> > > > without mixing down to 16 bit. Since I post online roughs for
clients
> as
> > > > mp3s,
> > > > that's pretty darn handy.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>I agree, very cool, thanks for the tip.

Kent (RK)

"Mike R." <emarenot@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:43bd28c8@linux...
> Don, that last bit about using mono was a very helpful tip. I've run
across
> alot of 'em, but never that one. Thanks!
> MR
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:43bc8f14$1@linux...
> > Another imprtant point is the frequencies around the vocalist...if there
> are
> > a couple of instruments in the same range the vocals will be fighting to
> be
> > heard...make sure there is somewhat of ahole around the vocals so that
> they
> > fill that void or hole all by themselves.
> >
> > A quick trick is to throw the mix in mono and see what you hear...if the
> > guitar or piano is interfering, try a new level or re-EQ the offending
> > instrument so it backs off enough to give the vocals their space.
> >
> > Doubling or tripling work (with appropriate time delay)...adding a
chorus
> to
> > the third can help...compressing a copy of the vox track and blending to
> > taste might work..and the above suggestion will work
> >
> > YMMV
> >
> > Don
> >
> > "RK" <kent510745@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:43bc7a43@linux...
> > > Trying to get lead vocals to jump out of the mix and I remember a
trick
> > > listed somewhere telling you to copy a vocal track to a different
track,
> > > pan
> > > tracks left and right, then reverse the phase on the second track and
> > > slowly
> > > bring the fader on the second track to meet the other track fader at
0.
> > > Seemed to work, but the effects seemed to cancel each other out. Does
> > > anyone use this, and if so, how do you get the FX to not whack each
> other
> > > out?
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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MIne locks too. I was a bit frustrated also, but then realized it was a =
small price to pay. Definitely curious if anyone else was having that =
problem.

Kent
"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
news:43be1bac@linux...
Do you guys have any problem when going from chapter to chapter?
My DVD player jams up and goes to the table of contents after every =
section.
It drives me nuts because I feel like I'm always missing information?
I've tried two different disks but they're both the same so it's =
either
the DVD production or my lame ass DVD player.

Anybody else?

By the way I still watch it no matter how painful...
Tom


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charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1528" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>MIne locks too.&nbsp; I was a bit =
frustrated also,=20
but then realized it was a small price to pay.&nbsp; Definitely curious =
if=20
anyone else was having that problem.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Kent</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Tom Bruhl" &lt;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>&gt; wrote =
in message=20
<A href=3D"news:43be1bac@linux">news:43be1bac@linux</A>...</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Do you guys have any problem when =
going from=20
chapter to chapter?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>My DVD player jams up and goes to the =
table of=20
contents after every section.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>It drives me nuts because I feel like =
I'm always=20
missing information?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I've tried two different disks but =
they're both=20
the same so it's either</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>the DVD production or my lame ass DVD =

player.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Anybody else?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>By the way I&nbsp;still watch it no =
matter how=20
painful...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Tom</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML >

------=_NextPart_000_003E_01C61364.50277BA0--Check out Bill L's compresor to match the UAD 1176LN. He starts with the
gentle crush and then:

-67.4db 1.25:1

0.0030 0.0076

0.007 8.7

Sounds good, too. Up to 14 dB of reduction. Let me know if you want me to
post his article.

Kent

"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:43bdaeca@linux...
> ratio 1.10:1 ? That's not a compressor !!! WTF ?
>
> Lance Reichert wrote:
> >
> > DImitrios posted this a while back.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C61366.E37E3950
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How high did you take the ratio? Did you adjust the lookahead as well?

Have you tried Bill L's UAD 1176LN gentle crush comp? If so, what did =
you think of that?

Kent
"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
news:43be1c6b$1@linux...
It wasn't as soft sounding as the UAD La2a.
I think increasing the ratio a little bit helped. Not a bad
starting point though. Give it a try if you haven't.

Thanks Dimitrios.
T.
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<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1528" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>How high did you take the ratio?&nbsp; =
Did you=20
adjust the lookahead as well?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Have you tried Bill L's UAD 1176LN =
gentle crush=20
comp?&nbsp; If so, what did you think of that?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Kent</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Tom Bruhl" &lt;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>&gt; wrote =
in message=20
<A href=3D"news:43be1c6b$1@linux">news:43be1c6b$1@linux</A>...</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>It wasn't as soft sounding as the UAD =

La2a.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I think increasing the ratio a =
little&nbsp;bit=20
helped.&nbsp; Not a bad</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>starting point though.&nbsp; Give it =
a try if you=20
haven't.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks Dimitrios.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>T.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C61366.E37E3950--I'm sure v.5 is great stuff -- but it's not cheap, and it brings a
whole lot of surround and video feautres into Wavelab that I'll never
use... I'd stay with 3.1 for mastering and cd output, but I need to
move that work onto a newer XP setup -- which isn't supported in
v.3... I'm sure you'll like working with Wavelab -- in any version...

chas


On Fri, 6 Jan 2006 18:30:16 -0600, "Edna" <edna@texomaonline.com>
wrote:

>Is there some problem with version 5 - hope not since I have it ordered :(
>
>"Chas. Duncan" <duncan5199ATsbcglobalDOTnet@> wrote in message
>news:govtr1hoat4gtdblf3qg6dsqbqlf00ped1@4ax.com...
>>
>> Yeah, I see "Essentials" for $99 at audiomidi.com right now. Might be
>> enough for my needs, but I'd rather dig up a legitimate copy of 4.0
>> on somebody's dusty shelf somewhere... Might be e-bay time...
>> chas.
>>
>>
>> On 7 Jan 2006 10:27:13 +1000, "cujo" <chris@nospamapplemanstudio.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >I keep meaning to get Wavelab essentails wich was 99 bucks at MF a few
>months
>> >back
>> >
>> >Chas. Duncan <duncan5199ATsbcglobalDOTnet@> wrote:
>> >>Want to buy, acquire, own a copy of Wavelab 4.1... Have 3.1 here and
>> >>would be glad to keep on using it, but I'm needing to move it to an XP
>> >>box, and 3.1 doesn't do XP. Not really interested in the surround
>> >>features and all the other complications of 5.0, and would like to
>> >>avoid spending money on features I don't need or want -- just need to
>> >>be doing that work under XP -- hence the search for 4.0...
>> >>
>> >>Any ideas? thanks -- Chas.
>>
>Wow.

I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know? Too
negative.

But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and ran
across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.

It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the thread
just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini baiting
them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his own ego
and silly puckishness.

I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."

I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously anymore. If
the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because of
its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but a
position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound and the
style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an empty
fashion it always wanted to be anyway.

Sorry for the rant.
JimmyThanks guys for the info. Glad to hear 5 ok. Ver 4 is still for sale at
8th st music, but not cheap @490, ebay has academic version of 5 at 389
BINow.
Edna
"Edna" <edna@texomaonline.com> wrote in message news:43bf0c20@linux...
> Is there some problem with version 5 - hope not since I have it ordered :(
>
> "Chas. Duncan" <duncan5199ATsbcglobalDOTnet@> wrote in message
> news:govtr1hoat4gtdblf3qg6dsqbqlf00ped1@4ax.com...
> >
> > Yeah, I see "Essentials" for $99 at audiomidi.com right now. Might be
> > enough for my needs, but I'd rather dig up a legitimate copy of 4.0
> > on somebody's dusty shelf somewhere... Might be e-bay time...
> > chas.
> >
> >
> > On 7 Jan 2006 10:27:13 +1000, "cujo" <chris@nospamapplemanstudio.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >I keep meaning to get Wavelab essentails wich was 99 bucks at MF a few
> months
> > >back
> > >
> > >Chas. Duncan <duncan5199ATsbcglobalDOTnet@> wrote:
> > >>Want to buy, acquire, own a copy of Wavelab 4.1... Have 3.1 here and
> > >>would be glad to keep on using it, but I'm needing to move it to an XP
> > >>box, and 3.1 doesn't do XP. Not really interested in the surround
> > >>features and all the other complications of 5.0, and would like to
> > >>avoid spending money on features I don't need or want -- just need to
> > >>be doing that work under XP -- hence the search for 4.0...
> > >>
> > >>Any ideas? thanks -- Chas.
> >
>
>Fast computers aren't the silver bullet for ever bugaboo relating to native
systems, I'm finding, but they certainly do get you down the road a bit
quicker. Even with almost 5GHz of processing power and 4G RAM, there are
buffer issues. They are a different kind of buffer issue though. After a
while, working at small buffer settings (64-128k), I will start getting some
cracking in the audio. The fix is to toggle the buffer setting to another
setting, then back again. This clears it up until it starts happening again
a few hours later. The good news is that you can actually toggle the buffer
settings without having to wait a while for it to happen and while waiting,
wonder if you are going to have to reboot your machine because it won't
quite be able to pull off the buffer setting switch while the audio app is
running.

I'm waiting for one last VSTi to show up here before I get into the whole
in-depgh Windows optimization thing. I was mixing project last in SX with
58 tracks, (bussing 12 drum tracks to a stereo pair in Paris-that is sooo
cool) and streaming the other 46 tracks over lightpipe. My buffers in Sx
were set to 128k. I was able to get pretty surgical with my fader moves at
this low latency and after about an hour and a half, when the crackling
would start up, I'd just toggle to 256, let the project reset to these
buffers, then toggle back to 128. Tool less than 30 seconds and I was good
again.. This is with just the very basic system tweaking done. there are
still a lot of background services running. I think that after I finish the
final tweaks to this system, it's going to be a monster box. Right now I can
load the most CPU/memory intensive patch into Ivory and then trigger 10
notes with the sustain pedal depressed and it will decay to silence over
about 15 seconds with no dropouts at 64k buffer settings.

;o)

"gene lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:43be83d6$1@linux...
>
> "Gary Flanigan" <gary_flanigan@ce9.uscourts.gov> wrote:
> >
> >This is an interesting concept, but does it work? And does it work in
PARIS?
> >
> >Thanks
>
>
> I tried the demo, but not in Paris. I had a very similar experience to
Jesse.
> The Q-cloned eq was almost indistinguishable from the originals I tried.
> The only reason I did not purchase it (aside for not liking Waves update
> policies) was that I don't mind rendering with the real eq in the loop,
which
> I call "Q-Clone-Real" ;-)
> Q-Clone however does allow people to share impulses of good sounding gear.
> I found that aspect more intriguing. Many people have complained that the
> process of hunting around through impulses with one db variations is
painfully
> time-consuming, but I found a simple technique that is quick.
> Pick an impulse that is close to what you are looking for (like a Neve
with
> 3db boost at 10K) and then use a high quality plugin eq like the Sony
Oxford
> to do the fine-tuning. This works quickly and still gives the flava' of
the
> cloned eq. I use a similar technique with TriTones ColorTone.
>
> Overall, the sound is quite impressive, and CPU/Load issues will soon go
> away when we all build computers like DJ's :-)
>
> One site sharing high-end Q-Clone impulses:
> http://www.buenosairesbreaks.com/q-clone/
>
>
> Gene
>
>For some time I've used an old MIDI program and interface (Vision/Studio64X)
to create drum loops. Lately, I want to incorpoate those loops into Paris
projects. I've figured out how to import them onto the Paris playing field
at track 19 and I've got Paris triggering the MIDI from there, but what's
the best way to convert the MIDI track to an audio track? Would just "Bouncing
to disk" do the trick, or is there another way?

Many thanks!
RichardI'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count the
bands on the fingers of one hand.....and there would perhaps only be one,
maybe two songs on the CD that were worth a shit, IMO. They just sort of
morph into this sonic morass of over compressed, boring crap.

OTOH, some of the absolute best music I've ever heard in the last 5 years
happens at a little event here in Durango called the Durango Songwriters
Expo.

www.durangosong.com

It's limited to around 150 people who pay around $200.00 plus airfare to get
here in order to hobnob with industry bigwigs who purportedly come here to
listen to and critique their music and give them pointers on how to be
successful in the industry, but everyone knows that everyone really just
come here to chill at a luxury resort in the mountains in the most beautiful
time of year here (early Ocotber) and play golf between meals and party like
a bunch of heathens for 3 nights..

A lot of the participants have home studios, are excellent
producers/writers/musicians and their music kicks ass. We'll never get a
chance to hear it on the radio, but there's a lot of it out there and it's
great stuff. I do sound for this event and look forward to it every year
because I get to hear some incredible music.

One CD that I need to buy is Thad's. For some reason, I just haven't gotten
around to it, but I did listen to some of the song clips and it's something
I think I would actually enjoy sitting down and spending some quality time
with........and I just don't have a lot of that to spare these days.

"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:43bffcdc@linux...
> Wow.
>
> I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know? Too
> negative.
>
> But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and ran
> across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
> concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.
>
> It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
> cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the
thread
> just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini baiting
> them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his own
ego
> and silly puckishness.
>
> I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."
>
> I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously anymore.
If
> the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
> choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because of
> its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but a
> position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
> generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound and
the
> style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an empty
> fashion it always wanted to be anyway.
>
> Sorry for the rant.
> Jimmy
>
>Post it!


"Kent" <kent510745@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Check out Bill L's compresor to match the UAD 1176LN. He starts with the
>gentle crush and then:
>
>-67.4db 1.25:1
>
>0.0030 0.0076
>
>0.007 8.7
>
>Sounds good, too. Up to 14 dB of reduction. Let me know if you want me
to
>post his article.
>
>Kent
>
>"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:43bdaeca@linux...
>> ratio 1.10:1 ? That's not a compressor !!! WTF ?
>>
>> Lance Reichert wrote:
>> >
>> > DImitrios posted this a while back.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>
>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
>enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count the
>bands on the fingers of one hand.....

That's probably true of any genre unless you are in tune with what's down
below the surface. The stuff that gets marketed from any genre is usually
crap. I just watched the Wilco documentary "I am trying to break your heart".
It was painful to see them getting dropped 2 weeks after delivering the
album to Reprise, an album many (myself included) now consider to be a masterpiece.

I pretty much hate modern country music, but I suspect that's mostly because
I don't know where to look. I don't have any friends in tune with what's
good, and I am certainly not going to find it on the radio. So I find myself
listening to the Carter family and Johnny Cash instead.

Then there is always the distinct posibility that my tastes are out of tune
with what is actually happening in country. :-)

On the original topic, my friend is mixing a recording tomorrow that Albini
did. I'm curious to hear the raw tracks.

-ChrisHey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you probably already
know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices they
wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/

JamesThis is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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"...nevermind"


El Idioso






"Tom Bruhl" <arpegio@comcast.net> wrote in message =
news:43bf8362@linux...
Just The Two Of Us
Grover with Bill Withers.

Very Lou-ish.


"Lance Reichert" <lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net> wrote in message =
news:43bf4c4f@linux...
"Just the two of us" is Grover Washington Jr.
Sounds alot like Lou though.




"Miguel Vigil" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message =
news:43bef51a$1@linux...
> RIP, Lou
>
> El Miguel ..... "just the two of us"
>
>
>
>
> "Lance Reichert" <lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:43be9a36$1@linux...
> > What a voice - thanks Lou!
> >
> > http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10737897/
> >
> > Singer Lou Rawls dies of cancer at 72
> > Grammy winner began as choir boy, sold 40 million albums
> >
> >
>
>


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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>"...nevermind"</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>El Idioso</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Tom Bruhl" &lt;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:arpegio@comcast.net">arpegio@comcast.net</A>&gt; wrote =
in message=20
<A href=3D"news:43bf8362@linux">news:43bf8362@linux</A>...</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Just The Two Of Us</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Grover with Bill =
Withers.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Very Lou-ish.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>"Lance Reichert" &lt;<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net">lance.rocks@nospam.verizon=
..net</A>&gt;=20
wrote in message <A=20
href=3D"news:43bf4c4f@linux">news:43bf4c4f@linux</A>...</DIV>"Just =
the two of=20
us" is&nbsp; Grover Washington Jr.<BR>Sounds alot like Lou=20
though.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>"Miguel Vigil" &lt;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:nospam@nospam.com">nospam@nospam.com</A>&gt; wrote in =
message=20
<A =
href=3D"news:43bef51a$1@linux">news:43bef51a$1@linux</A>...<BR>&gt; RIP, =

Lou<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; El Miguel ..... "just the two of=20
us"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR >&gt; "Lance Reichert" &lt;<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net">lance.rocks@nospam.verizon=
..net</A>&gt;=20
wrote in message<BR>&gt; <A=20
href=3D"news:43be9a36$1@linux">news:43be9a36$1@linux</A>...<BR>&gt; =
&gt; What=20
a voice - thanks Lou!<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; <A=20
=
href=3D"http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10737897/">http://www.msnbc.msn.com/i=
d/10737897/</A><BR>&gt;=20
&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Singer Lou Rawls dies of cancer at 72<BR>&gt; &gt; =
Grammy=20
winner began as choir boy, sold 40 million albums<BR>&gt; =
&gt;<BR>&gt;=20
&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE> </BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C61391.C6C32020--"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:43bffcdc@linux...
> Wow.
>
> I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know? Too
> negative.
>
> But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and ran
> across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
> concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.
>
> It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
> cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the
> thread
> just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini baiting
> them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his own
> ego
> and silly puckishness.
>
> I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."
>
> I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously anymore.
> If
> the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
> choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because of
> its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but a
> position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
> generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound and
> the
> style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an empty
> fashion it always wanted to be anyway.
>
> Sorry for the rant.
> Jimmy
>

Being a semi regular at PSW I was embarassed at the childishness that was
displayed on that thread...unfortunately it prompted another series of
threads which also degenerated into name calling wankfests that had me
shaking my head in disbelief

DonIt's my understanding that Paris' midi functions are as useless as tits on a
bull...I would suggest finding another means like a second computer linked
in any fashion to get your midi converted to audio tracks into Paris

Don


"Richard Faylor" <RichardFaylor@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:43c00c68$1@linux...
>
> For some time I've used an old MIDI program and interface
> (Vision/Studio64X)
> to create drum loops. Lately, I want to incorpoate those loops into Paris
> projects. I've figured out how to import them onto the Paris playing field
> at track 19 and I've got Paris triggering the MIDI from there, but what's
> the best way to convert the MIDI track to an audio track? Would just
> "Bouncing
> to disk" do the trick, or is there another way?
>
> Many thanks!
> RichardWell, only a fool would insist that things haven't gotten very, very dire in
the world of popular music in the last 15 years, no doubt about it. I have
theories about it, but I don't want to waste anybody's time with my idle
musings and windy wordiness.

As for songs/albums, i-Tunes is really cool for bypassing the 1 good
song/the rest is filler syndrome. FWIW.

But I do think that Steve Albini has gotten WAAAAAY too much attention in
the last 20 years. Displays a kind of stealth arrogance that seems out of
proportion with his accomplishments. Take that with 2 grains of salt, of
course, coming as it is from a gentleman loser such as myself.

Jimmy


"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
news:43c00f45$1@linux...
> I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
> enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count the
> bands on the fingers of one hand.....and there would perhaps only be one,
> maybe two songs on the CD that were worth a shit, IMO. They just sort of
> morph into this sonic morass of over compressed, boring crap.
>Man. I have tried so hard to understand the Wilco thing. I just do not get
it. Oh well, to each his/her own.

I do think that part of what happened to rock was that it stopped being
somewhat playful/light-hearted and got way too self-serious. That's not
meant as a put-down on Wilco, just an honest opinion.

Radiohead being a wonderful example of a band who came on so strong and then
immdeiately sank beneath a morass of self-importance and meaningless
doodling. But at least the guy could fucking sing. I have a lot more
tolerance for (true not fake) indie bands with singers who can actually sing
better than my neighbor.

Jimmy


"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c0240c$1@linux...
>
> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
> >I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
> >enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count
the
> >bands on the fingers of one hand.....
>
> That's probably true of any genre unless you are in tune with what's down
> below the surface. The stuff that gets marketed from any genre is usually
> crap. I just watched the Wilco documentary "I am trying to break your
heart".
> It was painful to see them getting dropped 2 weeks after delivering the
> album to Reprise, an album many (myself included) now consider to be a
masterpiece.
>
> I pretty much hate modern country music, but I suspect that's mostly
because
> I don't know where to look. I don't have any friends in tune with what's
> good, and I am certainly not going to find it on the radio. So I find
myself
> listening to the Carter family and Johnny Cash instead.
>
> Then there is always the distinct posibility that my tastes are out of
tune
> with what is actually happening in country. :-)
>
> On the original topic, my friend is mixing a recording tomorrow that
Albini
> did. I'm curious to hear the raw tracks.
>
> -ChrisI suppose part of that is simply human nature rearing its ugly pud online.
Everybody has an opinion, and, like assholes, most opinions stink. And most
folk that spend a lot of time in online forums seem...well....terminally
geeky in a semi-hostile/overly-touchy kind of way...

Jimmy


"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote

> Being a semi regular at PSW I was embarassed at the childishness that was
> displayed on that thread...unfortunately it prompted another series of
> threads which also degenerated into name calling wankfests that had me
> shaking my head in disbelief
>
> Don
>
>
>Hey Chris - How are ya?

Have you checked out Nickel Creek's first two albums?
That's some of my favorite chill-out music and the only thing I've been
moved by in a while.
That, and the first Narada "Guitar works" compliation.

LanceThis is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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---=_linux43c0416a--Lance, long time no speak...doing good. Yourself? Maybe we can grab Gene
and get some lunch again. I'll check out Narada too.

Holy cow, I forgot all about Nickel Creek. I've been meaning to pick some
up for a long time now. I'm picking up some asap.

Talk to you soon,
Chris

"Lance Reichert" <lance.rocks@nospam.verizon.net> wrote:
>Hey Chris - How are ya?
>
>Have you checked out Nickel Creek's first two albums?
>That's some of my favorite chill-out music and the only thing I've been
>moved by in a while.
>That, and the first Narada "Guitar works" compliation.
>
>Lance
>
>The way I see it 'our' generation and many others learned and copied the
greats that came before us. The current generation has no talent and
doesn't try to even learn who the greats are. Any of them ever listen
to Django or BB King? They thumb their noses at the greats and don't
know any music theory and live in a bubble. But hey, today I bought
another Earl Klugh, 2 Outfields and 2 Wilson Phillips. I love pop rock,
jazz, hard rock, blues, r&b and a bunch of other eclectic styles that
these kids will never hear. Luckily my 10 year old neighbor is into
Rush, Kiss and AC/DC and got a drum set for christmas and his 7 year old
brother got a baby strat and a peavey amp so there's still hope. Truly
though this music today won't stand up 20 years from now. That outfield
album "Play Deep" still stands up totally today. Amazing really. hehe

John

uptown jimmy wrote:
> Wow.
>
> I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know? Too
> negative.
>
> But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and ran
> across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
> concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.
>
> It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
> cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the thread
> just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini baiting
> them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his own ego
> and silly puckishness.
>
> I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."
>
> I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously anymore. If
> the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
> choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because of
> its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but a
> position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
> generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound and the
> style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an empty
> fashion it always wanted to be anyway.
>
> Sorry for the rant.
> Jimmy
>
>I hear you about rock loosing it's playfullness. Everyone needs to be a tourtured
arteest these days. But heavy moody rock has been around from before my
time. For example, I don't think Hendrix was playful, ever. Beautiful,
transcendental, hopeful, romantic, yes. Playful or lighthearted, no. Hendrix
was a somber guy with a gift. I don't think his music could have been anything
else. The problem comes when frat-rockers wake up and want to be artists
because that's in fashion at the moment.

Regarding Wilco, I wouldn't really call them rock. It's more like folk music,
which has always tended towards somber and introsopective. I think it's
really well done, and really honest. But of course you need to relate to
that sentiment as a listener in the first place.

When asked about Red Barcheta, Alex Lifeson once said something to the effect
of "all songs shouldn't be about girls, fun, and fast cars, but some should".
I like that quote.

-Chris

"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>Man. I have tried so hard to understand the Wilco thing. I just do not get
>it. Oh well, to each his/her own.
>
>I do think that part of what happened to rock was that it stopped being
>somewhat playful/light-hearted and got way too self-serious. That's not
>meant as a put-down on Wilco, just an honest opinion.
>
>Radiohead being a wonderful example of a band who came on so strong and
then
>immdeiately sank beneath a morass of self-importance and meaningless
>doodling. But at least the guy could fucking sing. I have a lot more
>tolerance for (true not fake) indie bands with singers who can actually
sing
>better than my neighbor.
>
>Jimmy
>
>
>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c0240c$1@linux...
>>
>> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>> >I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
>> >enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count
>the
>> >bands on the fingers of one hand.....
>>
>> That's probably true of any genre unless you are in tune with what's down
>> below the surface. The stuff that gets marketed from any genre is usually
>> crap. I just watched the Wilco documentary "I am trying to break your
>heart".
>> It was painful to see them getting dropped 2 weeks after delivering the
>> album to Reprise, an album many (myself included) now consider to be a
>masterpiece.
>>
>> I pretty much hate modern country music, but I suspect that's mostly
>because
>> I don't know where to look. I don't have any friends in tune with what's
>> good, and I am certainly not going to find it on the radio. So I find
>myself
>> listening to the Carter family and Johnny Cash instead.
>>
>> Then there is always the distinct posibility that my tastes are out of
>tune
>> with what is actually happening in country. :-)
>>
>> On the original topic, my friend is mixing a recording tomorrow that
>Albini
>> did. I'm curious to hear the raw tracks.
>>
>> -Chris
>
>Hendrix was only playful on stage live. I remember a couple of shots on
my videos where he smiles like a 10 year old when he pulled of a killer
solo and he looked like he had totally surprised himself. Smile like
"wow can you believe it"? hehe

Chris Wargo wrote:
> I hear you about rock loosing it's playfullness. Everyone needs to be a tourtured
> arteest these days. But heavy moody rock has been around from before my
> time. For example, I don't think Hendrix was playful, ever. Beautiful,
> transcendental, hopeful, romantic, yes. Playful or lighthearted, no. Hendrix
> was a somber guy with a gift. I don't think his music could have been anything
> else. The problem comes when frat-rockers wake up and want to be artists
> because that's in fashion at the moment.
>
> Regarding Wilco, I wouldn't really call them rock. It's more like folk music,
> which has always tended towards somber and introsopective. I think it's
> really well done, and really honest. But of course you need to relate to
> that sentiment as a listener in the first place.
>
> When asked about Red Barcheta, Alex Lifeson once said something to the effect
> of "all songs shouldn't be about girls, fun, and fast cars, but some should".
> I like that quote.
>
> -Chris
>
> "uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>>Man. I have tried so hard to understand the Wilco thing. I just do not get
>>it. Oh well, to each his/her own.
>>
>>I do think that part of what happened to rock was that it stopped being
>>somewhat playful/light-hearted and got way too self-serious. That's not
>>meant as a put-down on Wilco, just an honest opinion.
>>
>>Radiohead being a wonderful example of a band who came on so strong and
>
> then
>
>>immdeiately sank beneath a morass of self-importance and meaningless
>>doodling. But at least the guy could fucking sing. I have a lot more
>>tolerance for (true not fake) indie bands with singers who can actually
>
> sing
>
>>better than my neighbor.
>>
>>Jimmy
>>
>>
>>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c0240c$1@linux...
>>
>>>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
>>>>enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count
>>
>>the
>>
>>>>bands on the fingers of one hand.....
>>>
>>>That's probably true of any genre unless you are in tune with what's down
>>>below the surface. The stuff that gets marketed from any genre is usually
>>>crap. I just watched the Wilco documentary "I am trying to break your
>>
>>heart".
>>
>>> It was painful to see them getting dropped 2 weeks after delivering the
>>>album to Reprise, an album many (myself included) now consider to be a
>>
>>masterpiece.
>>
>>>I pretty much hate modern country music, but I suspect that's mostly
>>
>>because
>>
>>>I don't know where to look. I don't have any friends in tune with what's
>>>good, and I am certainly not going to find it on the radio. So I find
>>
>>myself
>>
>>>listening to the Carter family and Johnny Cash instead.
>>>
>>>Then there is always the distinct posibility that my tastes are out of
>>
>>tune
>>
>>>with what is actually happening in country. :-)
>>>
>>>On the original topic, my friend is mixing a recording tomorrow that
>>
>>Albini
>>
>>>did. I'm curious to hear the raw tracks.
>>>
>>>-Chris
>>
>>
>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote:
>
>Lance, long time no speak...doing good. Yourself? Maybe we can grab Gene
>and get some lunch again. I'll check out Narada too.
>
>Holy cow, I forgot all about Nickel Creek. I've been meaning to pick some
>up for a long time now. I'm picking up some asap.
>
>Talk to you soon,
>Chris
>
I’m up for that. We are overdue.
GeneWow. With all due respect, I think I understand your point, but I don't know
if I'd call setting your guitar on fire somber or introspective. Playful,
yes, putting it nicely. But not somber. Vaudeville, even, but not somber.

Good point about folk, though. Never could stand any of it after 1960 except
for Dylan and sweet Joni Mitchell. Well-played.

But I mother-mm-mm luuuv me some Rush from that very periodyou named.
"Moving Pictures" is a masterpiece, and I like "Permanent Waves" as well.

Jimmy


"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c05029$1@linux...
>
> I hear you about rock loosing it's playfullness. Everyone needs to be a
tourtured
> arteest these days. But heavy moody rock has been around from before my
> time. For example, I don't think Hendrix was playful, ever. Beautiful,
> transcendental, hopeful, romantic, yes. Playful or lighthearted, no.
Hendrix
> was a somber guy with a gift. I don't think his music could have been
anything
> else. The problem comes when frat-rockers wake up and want to be artists
> because that's in fashion at the moment.
>
> Regarding Wilco, I wouldn't really call them rock. It's more like folk
music,
> which has always tended towards somber and introsopective. I think it's
> really well done, and really honest. But of course you need to relate to
> that sentiment as a listener in the first place.
>
> When asked about Red Barcheta, Alex Lifeson once said something to the
effect
> of "all songs shouldn't be about girls, fun, and fast cars, but some
should".
> I like that quote.
>
> -Chris
>
> "uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >Man. I have tried so hard to understand the Wilco thing. I just do not
get
> >it. Oh well, to each his/her own.
> >
> >I do think that part of what happened to rock was that it stopped being
> >somewhat playful/light-hearted and got way too self-serious. That's not
> >meant as a put-down on Wilco, just an honest opinion.
> >
> >Radiohead being a wonderful example of a band who came on so strong and
> then
> >immdeiately sank beneath a morass of self-importance and meaningless
> >doodling. But at least the guy could fucking sing. I have a lot more
> >tolerance for (true not fake) indie bands with singers who can actually
> sing
> >better than my neighbor.
> >
> >Jimmy
> >
> >
> >"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c0240c$1@linux...
> >>
> >> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
> >> >I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really
liked
> >> >enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count
> >the
> >> >bands on the fingers of one hand.....
> >>
> >> That's probably true of any genre unless you are in tune with what's
down
> >> below the surface. The stuff that gets marketed from any genre is
usually
> >> crap. I just watched the Wilco documentary "I am trying to break your
> >heart".
> >> It was painful to see them getting dropped 2 weeks after delivering
the
> >> album to Reprise, an album many (myself included) now consider to be a
> >masterpiece.
> >>
> >> I pretty much hate modern country music, but I suspect that's mostly
> >because
> >> I don't know where to look. I don't have any friends in tune with
what's
> >> good, and I am certainly not going to find it on the radio. So I find
> >myself
> >> listening to the Carter family and Johnny Cash instead.
> >>
> >> Then there is always the distinct posibility that my tastes are out of
> >tune
> >> with what is actually happening in country. :-)
> >>
> >> On the original topic, my friend is mixing a recording tomorrow that
> >Albini
> >> did. I'm curious to hear the raw tracks.
> >>
> >> -Chris
> >
> >
>First off, Happy New Year to all! Now, down to business ;-)I am looking for
a new PC for the studio. It will primarily handle e-mail, internet access
and Photoshop duties. I usualy build my own systems, but there seems to be
great "bang for the buck" these days right off of the shelf (Best Buy, Circuit
City, etc.)I'm am curious to know if any of you have found any amazing deals
on PC's that I might have missed.

Thanks

TyroneHey Neil,long time !!:)

Well, lets get answering some your questions:

-mixing 24bit files/44.1
-no verbs or any timebased fx as inserts.
-Vst metering= 65-70 percent
-track were streaming from a firewire drive

I think that you are on to something with consolidating tracks.

I still the problem lies with the type of music R&B/Hip Hop, with 32 tracks
of just backing vocals:) add on 12 tracks of MPC hard hitting beats, thunderous
sytnth bass..Mannnnn!!:)

I Load those same tracks into Paris &ProTools, boom. Big, solid, round sound,
with a wide summing stage.

In Nuendo(2.3), the mix is fine, but is was a choooooore, to get the mix
like it should. Where as, in the two forementioned DAWs, a peice of cake.

note: The producer used Cubase SX 3.x to cut tracks. He was not satisfied
with his premix results, that's why he called me to mix the prject in Paris..
Well, me thinking he did not know what he was doing, arrangantly, I started
mixing in Nuendo,foregoing his directive.

Well, after a good 6 hours of struggling to get that Radio R&B sound which
is either all PT, PT/SSl or 2inch/PT/SSL..boywa I in trouble..There was no
way I was going to get those results with Nuendo..Also, version 3 of both
SX/Nuendo sounds different than version 1 or 2. Version 1 & 2 has more crunch
sound..Version 3 has a nice smooth sound thats's not for agressive type of
music per say. .. Not saying you can;t get the sound using Nuendo/SX(ITB)
inthe box, but it's a chore..

Well, I hope that explains some things..Take care.







-
-



"Neil" <OIUIU@OIU.com> wrote:
>
>Lamont, I have to disagree with you to a certain extent... I'm
>using CubaseSX (version 1.06, which I've heard, alternately from
>different sources, that it does have the same sound engine as
>Nuendo, and that it also does not, but in any case, if it does
>not, then I'm sure the one in Nuendo is better), and I don't get
>this smearing you're talking about - even at track counts in the
>36-40+ range (IIRC, 42 tracks is the highest I've needed thus
>far). The only thing I've noticed about it is that when you do
>get into those higher track counts, the soundstage does have a
>tendency to collapse a tiny bit... a few percentage points at
>most, though, and that can be remedied by exporting four or five
>stereo stems.
>
>
>A few questions:
>What resolution are you recording at where you're hearing this
>smearing? I use 24-bit/88.2k, and I've got 2 or 3 songs with
>track counts in the high 30's with probably 20 or so plug-in's
>going, and I'm not hearing anything like this. Do you think it
>could be your PC on the verge of bogging down at those levels of
>demand? What's your VST Performance Meter look like in those
>cases? Around 90% or higher? Also are you using time-based
>plugin's like reverbs & delays as insert plugin's on individual
>channels, or are you using them across group channels in a
>send/return fashion?
>
>Inquiring minds want to know.
>
>Neil
>
>
>
>
>"lamont" jjdpro#amerietch.net wrote:
>>
>>Hey Dedric,
>>they way I nad other cut and mix R & B/Gospel baking vocals is have at
>least
>>4-8 layers per note. I go for 6 usually times 4 part harmony = 24 tracks
>>of balck vocals..Not including the MPC drums tracks=12-16 tracks..Lead
Vocals..=2
>>, Keyss 4 tracks, Bass =2 tracks, Guitars 2-3 tracks....
>>
>>Now mix this many tracks in nuendo fine, until youstart add plugins..That's
>>when things start getting crazy.. Levels not matching, distortion fron
tracks..Track
>>balancing becomes off kilter.. YOu speed so much time just trying to put
>>out fires that you lose focus on the mix.. Then all of a sudden, here comes
>>that Nuendoi smearinng sound,..Nice and smooth..But, you're trying mix
agresiive
>>!@@@ARGG.... So, then you start making trade offs on masert fader levels
>>(-5bd).. And so on and so it goes.. TOOO Much work ..In _PAris and PT
,
>>could've been done in jiffy..
>>
>>
>>Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>>FWIW, I'm producing a rap/R&B project in Nuendo - so far no problems getting
>>>it to sound really good. I see your point, and maybe there is a magic
>wall
>>>at 30-40 simultaneous tracks in 32-bit float, but I just don't see many
>>>projects needing that many tracks simultaneously - I can't recall what
>we
>>>had on the last song - it was stacked with doubled vocals, backgrounds
>>>doubled on the chorus, accents, individual instrument tracks, etc.
>>>
>>>A little well-placed subtractive EQ and a few other minor considerations
>>>usually keep things from getting out of hand.
>>>
>>>Can't speak for PTHD - haven't mixed on it yet.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>Dedric
>>>
>>>On 1/3/06 10:55 AM, in article 43baac8e$1@linux, "LaMont"
>>><jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> about the state of current DAWs and what's working and what's not. Opinions
>>>> varied,but the one constant opinion that was stated was how dificult
>it
>>was
>>>> to mix in Cubase and Nuendo on mixes over 30 tracks. No matter what
i/o
>>>> converters(Apogee,Lucid,Motu,
>>>> RME) mixing Rock , R&B, Hip-Hop is a dificult chore in SX/Nuendo..Where
>>>> as mixing in Paris and Pro Tools is not..
>>>> Hey,Just one Engineer's opinon.
>>>>
>>>> P.S
>>>> Jsut for geekdum sakes, the new Sonar 5 uses a newly coded 64 to 32bit
>>>> floating
>>>> point mixer..
>>>>
>>>> "Martin Harrington" <lendan@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
>>>>> Yukkk,
>>>>> Don't do it..PT I mean.
>>>>> I've just been playing with PT M-Powered 6.8, using my Delta 1010,
and
>>I
>>>>
>>>>> have to say...I don't like it.
>>>>> The interface is (IMNSHO), horrible, confusing, and convoluted.
>>>>> Moves that come easily in Paris, and more easily in Nuendo, are tiresome
>>>> in
>>>>> PT, apart from the reagon tool...taht has always been good, right from
>>the
>>>>
>>>>> Session 8 days, but not much else.
>>>>> And..it only plays .MOV video files, which in my case is a no-no, (the
>>full
>>>>
>>>>> TDM version may play the others but I don't think so).
>>>>> To top it off, playing one of my projects from Nuendo, (reassembled),
>>it
>>>>
>>>>> didn't have the "life" that the original had, by a long shot.
>>>>> I repeat...don't go there, Jeff......
>>>>> --
>>>>> Martin Harrington
>>>>> www.lendanear-sound.com
>>>>>
>>>>> "jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:436fce7a$1@linux...
>>>>>> I just read the doc, thanks for posting the link. Much of it is quite
>>>>>> interesting and just as much is confusing.
>>>>>> I didn't know tdm systems sounded gnarly, never having worked with
>one.
>>>> At
>>>>>> what track count would they sonically crap out?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If I can't get some of my tedious little troubles with paris resolved
>>>> I'm
>>>>>> considering switching to protools.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> jef
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DJ wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://akwww.digidesign.com/support/docs/WhitePaper_48BitMix er.pdf
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any comments? It appears to me that the signals are recorded at 24
>>>>>>> bit, then processed at whatever bit rate the plugin on the channel
>>has,
>>>>>>> including dither, or not, then reprocessed to 24 bit, then these
channels
>>>>>>> are summed. I'm no guru when it comes to this stuff, but I get this
>>>>>>> feeling
>>>>>>> that this reprocessing *per channel* is the reason the TDM systems
>>seem
>>>> to
>>>>>>> start sounding gnarly as more and more tracks are summed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>check out www.salescircular.com, pricewatch.com and froogle on google
for sure.

Tyrone Corbett wrote:
> First off, Happy New Year to all! Now, down to business ;-)I am looking for
> a new PC for the studio. It will primarily handle e-mail, internet access
> and Photoshop duties. I usualy build my own systems, but there seems to be
> great "bang for the buck" these days right off of the shelf (Best Buy, Circuit
> City, etc.)I'm am curious to know if any of you have found any amazing deals
> on PC's that I might have missed.
>
> Thanks
>
> Tyronecounterpoints is a monster rush cd too

uptown jimmy wrote:
> Wow. With all due respect, I think I understand your point, but I don't know
> if I'd call setting your guitar on fire somber or introspective. Playful,
> yes, putting it nicely. But not somber. Vaudeville, even, but not somber.
>
> Good point about folk, though. Never could stand any of it after 1960 except
> for Dylan and sweet Joni Mitchell. Well-played.
>
> But I mother-mm-mm luuuv me some Rush from that very periodyou named.
> "Moving Pictures" is a masterpiece, and I like "Permanent Waves" as well.
>
> Jimmy
>
>
> "Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c05029$1@linux...
>
>>I hear you about rock loosing it's playfullness. Everyone needs to be a
>
> tourtured
>
>>arteest these days. But heavy moody rock has been around from before my
>>time. For example, I don't think Hendrix was playful, ever. Beautiful,
>>transcendental, hopeful, romantic, yes. Playful or lighthearted, no.
>
> Hendrix
>
>>was a somber guy with a gift. I don't think his music could have been
>
> anything
>
>>else. The problem comes when frat-rockers wake up and want to be artists
>>because that's in fashion at the moment.
>>
>>Regarding Wilco, I wouldn't really call them rock. It's more like folk
>
> music,
>
>>which has always tended towards somber and introsopective. I think it's
>>really well done, and really honest. But of course you need to relate to
>>that sentiment as a listener in the first place.
>>
>>When asked about Red Barcheta, Alex Lifeson once said something to the
>
> effect
>
>>of "all songs shouldn't be about girls, fun, and fast cars, but some
>
> should".
>
>>I like that quote.
>>
>>-Chris
>>
>>"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Man. I have tried so hard to understand the Wilco thing. I just do not
>
> get
>
>>>it. Oh well, to each his/her own.
>>>
>>>I do think that part of what happened to rock was that it stopped being
>>>somewhat playful/light-hearted and got way too self-serious. That's not
>>>meant as a put-down on Wilco, just an honest opinion.
>>>
>>>Radiohead being a wonderful example of a band who came on so strong and
>>
>>then
>>
>>>immdeiately sank beneath a morass of self-importance and meaningless
>>>doodling. But at least the guy could fucking sing. I have a lot more
>>>tolerance for (true not fake) indie bands with singers who can actually
>>
>>sing
>>
>>>better than my neighbor.
>>>
>>>Jimmy
>>>
>>>
>>>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c0240c$1@linux...
>>>
>>>>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really
>
> liked
>
>>>>>enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count
>>>
>>>the
>>>
>>>>>bands on the fingers of one hand.....
>>>>
>>>>That's probably true of any genre unless you are in tune with what's
>
> down
>
>>>>below the surface. The stuff that gets marketed from any genre is
>
> usually
>
>>>>crap. I just watched the Wilco documentary "I am trying to break your
>>>
>>>heart".
>>>
>>>> It was painful to see them getting dropped 2 weeks after delivering
>
> the
>
>>>>album to Reprise, an album many (myself included) now consider to be a
>>>
>>>masterpiece.
>>>
>>>>I pretty much hate modern country music, but I suspect that's mostly
>>>
>>>because
>>>
>>>>I don't know where to look. I don't have any friends in tune with
>
> what's
>
>>>>good, and I am certainly not going to find it on the radio. So I find
>>>
>>>myself
>>>
>>>>listening to the Carter family and Johnny Cash instead.
>>>>
>>>>Then there is always the distinct posibility that my tastes are out of
>>>
>>>tune
>>>
>>>>with what is actually happening in country. :-)
>>>>
>>>>On the original topic, my friend is mixing a recording tomorrow that
>>>
>>>Albini
>>>
>>>>did. I'm curious to hear the raw tracks.
>>>>
>>>>-Chris
>>>
>>>
>
>how do you measure/find out the latency of vst and dx plugs?Hey Chris, glad to hear you're doing good.
Other than beating down the flu, I'm good too.
I'm almost over it though!

Thanks for the lunch invite. I have allot of time flexibility during the day
and can work around you guys. Let me know if you guys want to set that up
"off the board".
Is your "gasworks" email address still good?

The first two Nickel Creek albums:Nickel Creek and This Side, are fantastic.
They were produced by Allison Krauss. You wont be disappointed.

LanceI'm looking forward to it Gene.

Lance
"gene lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:43c069aa$1@linux...
>
> "Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote:
> >
> >Lance, long time no speak...doing good. Yourself? Maybe we can grab
Gene
> >and get some lunch again. I'll check out Narada too.
> >
> >Holy cow, I forgot all about Nickel Creek. I've been meaning to pick
some
> >up for a long time now. I'm picking up some asap.
> >
> >Talk to you soon,
> >Chris
> >
> I'm up for that. We are overdue.
> Gene
>Take a look at www.techbargains.com and see what's on special. There was a
nicely tricked out HP Athlon 64 based system for just a shade over $500 a
few days ago.

TCB

"Tyrone Corbett" <tyronecorbett@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>First off, Happy New Year to all! Now, down to business ;-)I am looking
for
>a new PC for the studio. It will primarily handle e-mail, internet access
>and Photoshop duties. I usualy build my own systems, but there seems to
be
>great "bang for the buck" these days right off of the shelf (Best Buy, Circuit
>City, etc.)I'm am curious to know if any of you have found any amazing deals
>on PC's that I might have missed.
>
>Thanks
>
>Tyrone"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
>enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count the
>bands on the fingers of one hand.....and there would perhaps only be one,
>maybe two songs on the CD that were worth a shit, IMO. They just sort of
>morph into this sonic morass of over compressed, boring crap.
>
>OTOH, some of the absolute best music I've ever heard in the last 5 years
>happens at a little event here in Durango called the Durango Songwriters
>Expo.
>
>www.durangosong.com
>
>It's limited to around 150 people who pay around $200.00 plus airfare to
get
>here in order to hobnob with industry bigwigs who purportedly come here
to
>listen to and critique their music and give them pointers on how to be
>successful in the industry, but everyone knows that everyone really just
>come here to chill at a luxury resort in the mountains in the most beautiful
>time of year here (early Ocotber) and play golf between meals and party
like
>a bunch of heathens for 3 nights..
>
>A lot of the participants have home studios, are excellent
>producers/writers/musicians and their music kicks ass. We'll never get a
>chance to hear it on the radio, but there's a lot of it out there and it's
>great stuff. I do sound for this event and look forward to it every year
>because I get to hear some incredible music.
>
>One CD that I need to buy is Thad's. For some reason, I just haven't gotten
>around to it, but I did listen to some of the song clips and it's something
>I think I would actually enjoy sitting down and spending some quality time
>with........and I just don't have a lot of that to spare these days.

As shucks, Deej, I'm blushing. Send me your address again and I'll mail you
one. Also, it's not *my* CD, I didn't write any of the songs on this one
and was brought in pretty late in the writing/recording process. I might
wind up with a track or two on the next one (thus making me the Ron Wood/George
Harrison of this band which suits me just fine) but it's really the product
of two supremely gifted songwriters who are nice enough to let me tag along
for the ride.

I have to say, it's funny at this late date to be in the best band I've ever
been in with a couple of guys who have kids. Our third gig is coming up this
Thursday and I'm really psyched to get the tunes out in front of people again.
The working title for the next CD is Stotes Afire! (we have animal themes
for most stuff, and a stote is the british word for a weasel like creature
usualy called an ermine) and I'm hoping to make it sound a lot thicker. I
think the first one is a little short on low end (being Mr. dub that isn't
surprising) and we might do the drums in a much nicer room. Actually, this
band would sound great mixed on a PARIS rig. Too bad I don't have one anymore
;-)

TCB

>"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
>news:43bffcdc@linux...
>> Wow.
>>
>> I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know?
Too
>> negative.
>>
>> But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and
ran
>> across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
>> concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.
>>
>> It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
>> cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the
>thread
>> just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini baiting
>> them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his own
>ego
>> and silly puckishness.
>>
>> I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."
>>
>> I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously anymore.
>If
>> the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
>> choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because
of
>> its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but a
>> position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
>> generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound and
>the
>> style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an empty
>> fashion it always wanted to be anyway.
>>
>> Sorry for the rant.
>> Jimmy
>>
>>
>
>Also there is pricegrabber.com

James

"Tyrone Corbett" <tyronecorbett@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>First off, Happy New Year to all! Now, down to business ;-)I am looking
for
>a new PC for the studio. It will primarily handle e-mail, internet access
>and Photoshop duties. I usualy build my own systems, but there seems to
be
>great "bang for the buck" these days right off of the shelf (Best Buy, Circuit
>City, etc.)I'm am curious to know if any of you have found any amazing deals
>on PC's that I might have missed.
>
>Thanks
>
>TyroneSeems to me that those who write and create music have a very
open-hearted approach to other writers and other styles, while
fans always fight over what has "street cred" or what is hip, or
other such nonsense.

Very unprofessional. IM-ever-so-HO

DC



"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>Wow.
>
>I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know? Too
>negative.
>
>But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and ran
>across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
>concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.
>
>It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
>cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the thread
>just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini baiting
>them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his own
ego
>and silly puckishness.
>
>I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."
>
>I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously anymore.
If
>the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
>choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because of
>its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but a
>position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
>generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound and
the
>style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an empty
>fashion it always wanted to be anyway.
>
>Sorry for the rant.
>Jimmy
>
>First rock concert I saw was Rush - Exit Stage Left tour I believe. What a
concert... I've never picked up CD versions of my old album/cassette
collection - I just might have to do that now.

Dedric

On 1/7/06 6:46 PM, in article 43c06f7e@linux, "uptown jimmy"
<johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:

> Wow. With all due respect, I think I understand your point, but I don't know
> if I'd call setting your guitar on fire somber or introspective. Playful,
> yes, putting it nicely. But not somber. Vaudeville, even, but not somber.
>
> Good point about folk, though. Never could stand any of it after 1960 except
> for Dylan and sweet Joni Mitchell. Well-played.
>
> But I mother-mm-mm luuuv me some Rush from that very periodyou named.
> "Moving Pictures" is a masterpiece, and I like "Permanent Waves" as well.
>
> Jimmy
>
>
> "Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c05029$1@linux...
>>
>> I hear you about rock loosing it's playfullness. Everyone needs to be a
> tourtured
>> arteest these days. But heavy moody rock has been around from before my
>> time. For example, I don't think Hendrix was playful, ever. Beautiful,
>> transcendental, hopeful, romantic, yes. Playful or lighthearted, no.
> Hendrix
>> was a somber guy with a gift. I don't think his music could have been
> anything
>> else. The problem comes when frat-rockers wake up and want to be artists
>> because that's in fashion at the moment.
>>
>> Regarding Wilco, I wouldn't really call them rock. It's more like folk
> music,
>> which has always tended towards somber and introsopective. I think it's
>> really well done, and really honest. But of course you need to relate to
>> that sentiment as a listener in the first place.
>>
>> When asked about Red Barcheta, Alex Lifeson once said something to the
> effect
>> of "all songs shouldn't be about girls, fun, and fast cars, but some
> should".
>> I like that quote.
>>
>> -Chris
>>
>> "uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>> Man. I have tried so hard to understand the Wilco thing. I just do not
> get
>>> it. Oh well, to each his/her own.
>>>
>>> I do think that part of what happened to rock was that it stopped being
>>> somewhat playful/light-hearted and got way too self-serious. That's not
>>> meant as a put-down on Wilco, just an honest opinion.
>>>
>>> Radiohead being a wonderful example of a band who came on so strong and
>> then
>>> immdeiately sank beneath a morass of self-importance and meaningless
>>> doodling. But at least the guy could fucking sing. I have a lot more
>>> tolerance for (true not fake) indie bands with singers who can actually
>> sing
>>> better than my neighbor.
>>>
>>> Jimmy
>>>
>>>
>>> "Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c0240c$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>>> I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really
> liked
>>>>> enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count
>>> the
>>>>> bands on the fingers of one hand.....
>>>>
>>>> That's probably true of any genre unless you are in tune with what's
> down
>>>> below the surface. The stuff that gets marketed from any genre is
> usually
>>>> crap. I just watched the Wilco documentary "I am trying to break your
>>> heart".
>>>> It was painful to see them getting dropped 2 weeks after delivering
> the
>>>> album to Reprise, an album many (myself included) now consider to be a
>>> masterpiece.
>>>>
>>>> I pretty much hate modern country music, but I suspect that's mostly
>>> because
>>>> I don't know where to look. I don't have any friends in tune with
> what's
>>>> good, and I am certainly not going to find it on the radio. So I find
>>> myself
>>>> listening to the Carter family and Johnny Cash instead.
>>>>
>>>> Then there is always the distinct posibility that my tastes are out of
>>> tune
>>>> with what is actually happening in country. :-)
>>>>
>>>> On the original topic, my friend is mixing a recording tomorrow that
>>> Albini
>>>> did. I'm curious to hear the raw tracks.
>>>>
>>>> -Chris
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>Don,

I don't know about BFD, but Toontracks has some DFH Superior demo videos on
their web site with a drummer playing a Roland TD-20 kit with some extra
eCymbals and the latency is very low. The performances are killer! I think
they have pretty detailed instructions on how to set it up also. Here's a
link:

www.toontrack.com

I have DFH and love the sounds. I've just been programming it from a
keyboard so far.

Tony



On 1/7/06 8:03 AM, in article 43bfcac8@linux, "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca>
wrote:

> Hi All
>
> So say I was to use drum trigger system (via midi) to trigger the sounds in
> something like BFD or DFH in my computer...any idea what kind of latency I'd
> be looking at in a live situation
>
> Thanks
>
> Don
>
>Hey Lamont - interesting. I have a similar setup with the tracks we are
doing (not quite as many BGVs, but close) - depends on the sound I'm going
for - choir/ensemble, more layers - pop, less. Rhythm tracks rarely benefit
more from layering than from sound design, so that's can become a toss up
depending on preference and workflow/approach.

Sounds to me like it could be a matter of pushing the headroom differently
across the spectrum. Nuendo and PT aren't that much different in terms of
dynamic headroom where we really hear it, even with the 48-bit vs. 32-float
comparison, but that has been a never ending debate.

If I had a PT HD rig and a Neve handy, I would do some direct A/B mixes to
see where the differences lie, and whether mix approach or the format makes
the biggest difference. I don't assume Nuendo is delivering everything I
would want from it when mixing, but I make it work.

I do have to wonder though (in general, not your specific example) - the
"wall of sound" approach has been demonstrated to reach a point of
diminishing returns, regardless of the platform (Asia / Geoff Downes
anyone?:). Most layers are only adding harmonic variation (hence spread and
dimension where 1 part would sound flat), but the frequency range is still
the same whether two or twenty parts are used on that note - just added
levels at different points than the original (a bit oversimplified). What
has to be kept under control is the gain across the spectrum (e.g. Soloist
vs. a choir on a note - very different sound, but not necessarily "more"
sound for the mix platform to handle, given a single pan setting).

How that could break down in one platform, but not another is a mystery to
me. I think it may be more complicated than 32-bit float vs. 48 fixed etc.
To me, Nuendo is more transparent than Paris was, but less forgiving on
pushing gain, and still plenty of headroom and punch when backing off a bit
to leave me room to work. That's where I ran into problems when first
working with it, but if I backed off the master and added a brick wall
limiter to prevent clipping, it has been working very nicely.

It might be interesting to compare our mix approaches on a test song
sometime. Perhaps when/if 128-bit/384k or DSD derived systems are our
mainstay, we'll discover that all of the above, including consoles that we
assumed were a proper reference point were in fact skewed and deficient much
more than we even feared.

Regards,
Dedric

On 1/6/06 12:50 AM, in article 43be132a$1@linux, "lamont"
<jjdpro#amerietch.net> wrote:

>
> Hey Dedric,
> they way I nad other cut and mix R & B/Gospel baking vocals is have at least
> 4-8 layers per note. I go for 6 usually times 4 part harmony = 24 tracks
> of balck vocals..Not including the MPC drums tracks=12-16 tracks..Lead
> Vocals..=2
> , Keyss 4 tracks, Bass =2 tracks, Guitars 2-3 tracks....
>
> Now mix this many tracks in nuendo fine, until youstart add plugins..That's
> when things start getting crazy.. Levels not matching, distortion fron
> tracks..Track
> balancing becomes off kilter.. YOu speed so much time just trying to put
> out fires that you lose focus on the mix.. Then all of a sudden, here comes
> that Nuendoi smearinng sound,..Nice and smooth..But, you're trying mix
> agresiive
> !@@@ARGG.... So, then you start making trade offs on masert fader levels
> (-5bd).. And so on and so it goes.. TOOO Much work ..In _PAris and PT ,
> could've been done in jiffy..
>
>
> Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>> FWIW, I'm producing a rap/R&B project in Nuendo - so far no problems getting
>> it to sound really good. I see your point, and maybe there is a magic wall
>> at 30-40 simultaneous tracks in 32-bit float, but I just don't see many
>> projects needing that many tracks simultaneously - I can't recall what we
>> had on the last song - it was stacked with doubled vocals, backgrounds
>> doubled on the chorus, accents, individual instrument tracks, etc.
>>
>> A little well-placed subtractive EQ and a few other minor considerations
>> usually keep things from getting out of hand.
>>
>> Can't speak for PTHD - haven't mixed on it yet.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Dedric
>>
>> On 1/3/06 10:55 AM, in article 43baac8e$1@linux, "LaMont"
>> <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>>
>>> about the state of current DAWs and what's working and what's not. Opinions
>>> varied,but the one constant opinion that was stated was how dificult it
> was
>>> to mix in Cubase and Nuendo on mixes over 30 tracks. No matter what i/o
>>> converters(Apogee,Lucid,Motu,
>>> RME) mixing Rock , R&B, Hip-Hop is a dificult chore in SX/Nuendo..Where
>>> as mixing in Paris and Pro Tools is not..
>>> Hey,Just one Engineer's opinon.
>>>
>>> P.S
>>> Jsut for geekdum sakes, the new Sonar 5 uses a newly coded 64 to 32bit
>>> floating
>>> point mixer..
>>>
>>> "Martin Harrington" <lendan@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
>>>> Yukkk,
>>>> Don't do it..PT I mean.
>>>> I've just been playing with PT M-Powered 6.8, using my Delta 1010, and
> I
>>>
>>>> have to say...I don't like it.
>>>> The interface is (IMNSHO), horrible, confusing, and convoluted.
>>>> Moves that come easily in Paris, and more easily in Nuendo, are tiresome
>>> in
>>>> PT, apart from the reagon tool...taht has always been good, right from
> the
>>>
>>>> Session 8 days, but not much else.
>>>> And..it only plays .MOV video files, which in my case is a no-no, (the
> full
>>>
>>>> TDM version may play the others but I don't think so).
>>>> To top it off, playing one of my projects from Nuendo, (reassembled),
> it
>>>
>>>> didn't have the "life" that the original had, by a long shot.
>>>> I repeat...don't go there, Jeff......
>>>> --
>>>> Martin Harrington
>>>> www.lendanear-sound.com
>>>>
>>>> "jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:436fce7a$1@linux...
>>>>> I just read the doc, thanks for posting the link. Much of it is quite
>>>>> interesting and just as much is confusing.
>>>>> I didn't know tdm systems sounded gnarly, never having worked with one.
>>> At
>>>>> what track count would they sonically crap out?
>>>>>
>>>>> If I can't get some of my tedious little troubles with paris resolved
>>> I'm
>>>>> considering switching to protools.
>>>>>
>>>>> jef
>>>>>
>>>>> DJ wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> http://akwww.digidesign.com/support/docs/WhitePaper_48BitMix er.pdf
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any comments? It appears to me that the signals are recorded at 24
>>>>>> bit, then processed at whatever bit rate the plugin on the channel
> has,
>>>>>> including dither, or not, then reprocessed to 24 bit, then these channels
>>>>>> are summed. I'm no guru when it comes to this stuff, but I get this
>>>>>> feeling
>>>>>> that this reprocessing *per channel* is the reason the TDM systems
> seem
>>> to
>>>>>> start sounding gnarly as more and more tracks are summed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>"LaMont" <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>
>
>Hey Neil,long time !!:)
>
>Well, lets get answering some your questions:
>
>-mixing 24bit files/44.1

OK, do you think some of the difference between what you're
getting & what I'm getting (with regard to results) might be
due to resolution differences?

>-no verbs or any timebased fx as inserts.

OK, was just wondering if that might've been clouding up the
matrix with too many sources of reflections, etc.

>-Vst metering= 65-70 percent

Better than what I'm acheiving on high track counts... I have a
couple of songs bridging on 90%, so that shouldn't be an issue
for you.

>-track were streaming from a firewire drive

Ah-HA!!!! I wonder if this might be an issue... Firewire is
definitively slower than a direct-bus IDE, or even USB-2. Have
you tried copying a complete project onto an IDE drive to see
if that makes a diffference in streamaing capacity? I'm not
certain that this can make a difference in sound quality, but
it might be worth a/b-ing. Theoretically, it shouldn't, but as
we've all found out in various scenarious, sometimes you just
never know.

>I think that you are on to something with consolidating tracks.

Yep, it really does work... Doug Oberkircher gave me a tip
about that here regarding a mix on an older (non-HD) PT
mix I was working on once, and also, I think Gene Lennon
has pointed this out before with regard to Nuendo or SX, as
well... if not Gene, then definitely someone else on this NG.

>I still the problem lies with the type of music R&B/Hip Hop, with 32 tracks
>of just backing vocals:) add on 12 tracks of MPC hard hitting beats, thunderous
>sytnth bass..Mannnnn!!:)

I don't think it's that genre in particular.... I think it's
just something to be dealt with in a different way in each
case - just like you don't use the same processing for rock vs.
country, maybe you just don't use the same style of mix
bussing procedures for R&B that might work well for another
genre. 54 tracks ain't huge, especially considering all those
tracks aren't going to be running all at once in the case of BG
Vox taking up 32 of 'em, so I think you should be able to make
it work in Nuendo... lemme ask you this: are the BG Vox tracks
split at various intervals, or are they one continuous file for
each track? If they're one continuous file, then that's sucking
CPU cycles & bandwidth that the mix buss doens't need to be
seeing all the time. THAT will make a difference, as it's still
trying to process them, even when there's no singing going on!
(Don't forget, if there's even -100db's worth of signal on
there when no one's singing on those tracks, all 32 of them are
still being processed through the mix buss!)

NeilYikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to discontinue
it.

;o}

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:43c029b6$1@linux...
>
> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you probably
already
> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices they
> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
>
> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
>
> JamesHey Thad,

Thanks. I'll take you up on that offer for the CD, but if you're seeling
them, I'd just as soon pay $$ to support you guys. Is it available online
FS? If so send me a link.

As far as the weasel-like creature, I think that one iws spelled
*stoat*.....but WTF, I could be wrong.

;o)
.
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:43c08743$1@linux...
>
> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
> >I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
> >enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count
the
> >bands on the fingers of one hand.....and there would perhaps only be one,
> >maybe two songs on the CD that were worth a shit, IMO. They just sort of
> >morph into this sonic morass of over compressed, boring crap.
> >
> >OTOH, some of the absolute best music I've ever heard in the last 5 years
> >happens at a little event here in Durango called the Durango Songwriters
> >Expo.
> >
> >www.durangosong.com
> >
> >It's limited to around 150 people who pay around $200.00 plus airfare to
> get
> >here in order to hobnob with industry bigwigs who purportedly come here
> to
> >listen to and critique their music and give them pointers on how to be
> >successful in the industry, but everyone knows that everyone really just
> >come here to chill at a luxury resort in the mountains in the most
beautiful
> >time of year here (early Ocotber) and play golf between meals and party
> like
> >a bunch of heathens for 3 nights..
> >
> >A lot of the participants have home studios, are excellent
> >producers/writers/musicians and their music kicks ass. We'll never get a
> >chance to hear it on the radio, but there's a lot of it out there and
it's
> >great stuff. I do sound for this event and look forward to it every year
> >because I get to hear some incredible music.
> >
> >One CD that I need to buy is Thad's. For some reason, I just haven't
gotten
> >around to it, but I did listen to some of the song clips and it's
something
> >I think I would actually enjoy sitting down and spending some quality
time
> >with........and I just don't have a lot of that to spare these days.
>
> As shucks, Deej, I'm blushing. Send me your address again and I'll mail
you
> one. Also, it's not *my* CD, I didn't write any of the songs on this one
> and was brought in pretty late in the writing/recording process. I might
> wind up with a track or two on the next one (thus making me the Ron
Wood/George
> Harrison of this band which suits me just fine) but it's really the
product
> of two supremely gifted songwriters who are nice enough to let me tag
along
> for the ride.
>
> I have to say, it's funny at this late date to be in the best band I've
ever
> been in with a couple of guys who have kids. Our third gig is coming up
this
> Thursday and I'm really psyched to get the tunes out in front of people
again.
> The working title for the next CD is Stotes Afire! (we have animal themes
> for most stuff, and a stote is the british word for a weasel like creature
> usualy called an ermine) and I'm hoping to make it sound a lot thicker. I
> think the first one is a little short on low end (being Mr. dub that isn't
> surprising) and we might do the drums in a much nicer room. Actually, this
> band would sound great mixed on a PARIS rig. Too bad I don't have one
anymore
> ;-)
>
> TCB
>
> >"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> >news:43bffcdc@linux...
> >> Wow.
> >>
> >> I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know?
> Too
> >> negative.
> >>
> >> But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and
> ran
> >> across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
> >> concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.
> >>
> >> It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
> >> cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the
> >thread
> >> just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini
baiting
> >> them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his own
> >ego
> >> and silly puckishness.
> >>
> >> I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."
> >>
> >> I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously
anymore.
> >If
> >> the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
> >> choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because
> of
> >> its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but a
> >> position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
> >> generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound and
> >the
> >> style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an
empty
> >> fashion it always wanted to be anyway.
> >>
> >> Sorry for the rant.
> >> Jimmy
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>Here ye be:

I started out doing some tests of Chuck's NoLIMIT, which devolved into a
compressor plugin shoot-out. I didn't go totally crazy - really I was just
trying to see if I could get the regular Paris compressor to sound like the
UAD1 1176LN "Gentle Vocal Comp" preset. While I was at it, I threw in Waves
Ren Comp on a vocal setting. I then tweaked the Paris and the Waves to sound
as close to the 1176 as I could get them. I then tested them on male and
female vocal. The listeners were myself and my wife, who is an excellent
singer and a pianist, and actually has great ears (and she digs doing these
tests).

The winner by a very, very small margin was the UAD1. After that came the
Paris comp, and last was the Waves. My wife said the Waves so unded slightly
"metallic", which I interpreted to mean it had artifacts and was a little
flangey sounding. I agree, but it didn't sound bad, just not as good. The
UAD1 just sounded the most pleasing. The Paris compressor was really close
though - totally usable IMHO - and I thought it might be useful for some
folks if I shared the settings I arrived at, especially as the Paris comp is
by far the hardest compressor plug I have ever knobulated.

I started with the "gentle crush" setting (I mention this because there has
been a theory that there is a different algorithm used in the "Opto"
setting. I have no idea whether this is true, nor do I know which algo is in
the gentle crush.)

-67.4db 1.25:1

0.0030 0.0076

0.007 8.7

The important settings to change for your vocal application would be the
threshold and the output. I set the threshold so I was gettin g up to around
14 dB of reduction. Hope this may be useful to those who don' t have a UAD1.

As to the NoLimit plug, I found it not so useful on vocals. M aybe I didn't
set it right - not sure. I wish it has a meter (Chuck, was that why you were
asking about good examples of plug in meters?) I will be testing it for
mastering program tomorrow. I will let y'all know what I think.

Bill

Dude has a good ear. He also came up with a kick ass plate verb.



Kent

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:43c01de9$1@linux...
>
> Post it!
>
>
> "Kent" <kent510745@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >Check out Bill L's compresor to match the UAD 1176LN. He starts with the
> >gentle crush and then:
> >
> >-67.4db 1.25:1
> >
> >0.0030 0.0076
> >
> >0.007 8.7
> >
> >Sounds good, too. Up to 14 dB of reduction. Let me know if you want me
> to
> >post his article.
> >
> >Kent
> >
> >"John" <no@no.com> wrote in message news:43bdaeca@linux...
> >> ratio 1.10:1 ? That's not a compressor !!! WTF ?
> >>
> >> Lance Reichert wrote:
> >> >
> >> > DImitrios posted this a while back.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >
> >
>Good Points. :)

Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>Hey Lamont - interesting. I have a similar setup with the tracks we are
>doing (not quite as many BGVs, but close) - depends on the sound I'm going
>for - choir/ensemble, more layers - pop, less. Rhythm tracks rarely benefit
>more from layering than from sound design, so that's can become a toss up
>depending on preference and workflow/approach.
>
>Sounds to me like it could be a matter of pushing the headroom differently
>across the spectrum. Nuendo and PT aren't that much different in terms
of
>dynamic headroom where we really hear it, even with the 48-bit vs. 32-float
>comparison, but that has been a never ending debate.
>
>If I had a PT HD rig and a Neve handy, I would do some direct A/B mixes
to
>see where the differences lie, and whether mix approach or the format makes
>the biggest difference. I don't assume Nuendo is delivering everything
I
>would want from it when mixing, but I make it work.
>
>I do have to wonder though (in general, not your specific example) - the
>"wall of sound" approach has been demonstrated to reach a point of
>diminishing returns, regardless of the platform (Asia / Geoff Downes
>anyone?:). Most layers are only adding harmonic variation (hence spread
and
>dimension where 1 part would sound flat), but the frequency range is still
>the same whether two or twenty parts are used on that note - just added
>levels at different points than the original (a bit oversimplified). What
>has to be kept under control is the gain across the spectrum (e.g. Soloist
>vs. a choir on a note - very different sound, but not necessarily "more"
>sound for the mix platform to handle, given a single pan setting).
>
>How that could break down in one platform, but not another is a mystery
to
>me. I think it may be more complicated than 32-bit float vs. 48 fixed etc.
>To me, Nuendo is more transparent than Paris was, but less forgiving on
>pushing gain, and still plenty of headroom and punch when backing off a
bit
>to leave me room to work. That's where I ran into problems when first
>working with it, but if I backed off the master and added a brick wall
>limiter to prevent clipping, it has been working very nicely.
>
>It might be interesting to compare our mix approaches on a test song
>sometime. Perhaps when/if 128-bit/384k or DSD derived systems are our
>mainstay, we'll discover that all of the above, including consoles that
we
>assumed were a proper reference point were in fact skewed and deficient
much
>more than we even feared.
>
>Regards,
>Dedric
>
>On 1/6/06 12:50 AM, in article 43be132a$1@linux, "lamont"
><jjdpro#amerietch.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> Hey Dedric,
>> they way I nad other cut and mix R & B/Gospel baking vocals is have at
least
>> 4-8 layers per note. I go for 6 usually times 4 part harmony = 24 tracks
>> of balck vocals..Not including the MPC drums tracks=12-16 tracks..Lead
>> Vocals..=2
>> , Keyss 4 tracks, Bass =2 tracks, Guitars 2-3 tracks....
>>
>> Now mix this many tracks in nuendo fine, until youstart add plugins..That's
>> when things start getting crazy.. Levels not matching, distortion fron
>> tracks..Track
>> balancing becomes off kilter.. YOu speed so much time just trying to put
>> out fires that you lose focus on the mix.. Then all of a sudden, here
comes
>> that Nuendoi smearinng sound,..Nice and smooth..But, you're trying mix
>> agresiive
>> !@@@ARGG.... So, then you start making trade offs on masert fader levels
>> (-5bd).. And so on and so it goes.. TOOO Much work ..In _PAris and PT
,
>> could've been done in jiffy..
>>
>>
>> Dedric Terry <dterry@keyofd.net> wrote:
>>> FWIW, I'm producing a rap/R&B project in Nuendo - so far no problems
getting
>>> it to sound really good. I see your point, and maybe there is a magic
wall
>>> at 30-40 simultaneous tracks in 32-bit float, but I just don't see many
>>> projects needing that many tracks simultaneously - I can't recall what
we
>>> had on the last song - it was stacked with doubled vocals, backgrounds
>>> doubled on the chorus, accents, individual instrument tracks, etc.
>>>
>>> A little well-placed subtractive EQ and a few other minor considerations
>>> usually keep things from getting out of hand.
>>>
>>> Can't speak for PTHD - haven't mixed on it yet.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Dedric
>>>
>>> On 1/3/06 10:55 AM, in article 43baac8e$1@linux, "LaMont"
>>> <jjdpro@ameritech.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> about the state of current DAWs and what's working and what's not. Opinions
>>>> varied,but the one constant opinion that was stated was how dificult
it
>> was
>>>> to mix in Cubase and Nuendo on mixes over 30 tracks. No matter what
i/o
>>>> converters(Apogee,Lucid,Motu,
>>>> RME) mixing Rock , R&B, Hip-Hop is a dificult chore in SX/Nuendo..Where
>>>> as mixing in Paris and Pro Tools is not..
>>>> Hey,Just one Engineer's opinon.
>>>>
>>>> P.S
>>>> Jsut for geekdum sakes, the new Sonar 5 uses a newly coded 64 to 32bit
>>>> floating
>>>> point mixer..
>>>>
>>>> "Martin Harrington" <lendan@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
>>>>> Yukkk,
>>>>> Don't do it..PT I mean.
>>>>> I've just been playing with PT M-Powered 6.8, using my Delta 1010,
and
>> I
>>>>
>>>>> have to say...I don't like it.
>>>>> The interface is (IMNSHO), horrible, confusing, and convoluted.
>>>>> Moves that come easily in Paris, and more easily in Nuendo, are tiresome
>>>> in
>>>>> PT, apart from the reagon tool...taht has always been good, right from
>> the
>>>>
>>>>> Session 8 days, but not much else.
>>>>> And..it only plays .MOV video files, which in my case is a no-no, (the
>> full
>>>>
>>>>> TDM version may play the others but I don't think so).
>>>>> To top it off, playing one of my projects from Nuendo, (reassembled),
>> it
>>>>
>>>>> didn't have the "life" that the original had, by a long shot.
>>>>> I repeat...don't go there, Jeff......
>>>>> --
>>>>> Martin Harrington
>>>>> www.lendanear-sound.com
>>>>>
>>>>> "jef knight" <thestudio@allknightmusic.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:436fce7a$1@linux...
>>>>>> I just read the doc, thanks for posting the link. Much of it is quite
>>>>>> interesting and just as much is confusing.
>>>>>> I didn't know tdm systems sounded gnarly, never having worked with
one.
>>>> At
>>>>>> what track count would they sonically crap out?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If I can't get some of my tedious little troubles with paris resolved
>>>> I'm
>>>>>> considering switching to protools.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> jef
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DJ wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://akwww.digidesign.com/support/docs/WhitePaper_48BitMix er.pdf
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any comments? It appears to me that the signals are recorded at 24
>>>>>>> bit, then processed at whatever bit rate the plugin on the channel
>> has,
>>>>>>> including dither, or not, then reprocessed to 24 bit, then these
channels
>>>>>>> are summed. I'm no guru when it comes to this stuff, but I get this
>>>>>>> feeling
>>>>>>> that this reprocessing *per channel* is the reason the TDM systems
>> seem
>>>> to
>>>>>>> start sounding gnarly as more and more tracks are summed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>reminds me of nmu in (the u.p. of michigan) '68. it was a real kick
jumping off the 3rd and 4th floor roofs of the dorms into the snow.

On 8 Jan 2006 09:32:10 +1000, "gene lennon"
<glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote:

>hey boots,

probably getting ready for the post xmas poverty that the gearheads
enjoy this time each year.


On Sun, 8 Jan 2006 00:32:38 -0700, "DJ"
<animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:

>Yikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to discontinue
>it.
>
>;o}
>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:43c029b6$1@linux...
>>
>> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you probably
>already
>> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices they
>> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
>>
>> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
>>
>> James
>Thanks Tony!

That pretty well answers my question

Don

"Tony Benson" <tony@standinghampton.com> wrote in message
news:BFE5FB22.565B%tony@standinghampton.com...
> Don,
>
> I don't know about BFD, but Toontracks has some DFH Superior demo videos
> on
> their web site with a drummer playing a Roland TD-20 kit with some extra
> eCymbals and the latency is very low. The performances are killer! I think
> they have pretty detailed instructions on how to set it up also. Here's a
> link:
>
> www.toontrack.com
>
> I have DFH and love the sounds. I've just been programming it from a
> keyboard so far.
>
> Tony
>
>
>
> On 1/7/06 8:03 AM, in article 43bfcac8@linux, "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi All
>>
>> So say I was to use drum trigger system (via midi) to trigger the sounds
>> in
>> something like BFD or DFH in my computer...any idea what kind of latency
>> I'd
>> be looking at in a live situation
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Don
>>
>>
>I enjoy building too, but I agree with you, the prices at some of these big
box stores are really low. We were looking at the e machines at Best Buy a
couple of months ago. I did some checking on the web and the quality of the
current machines seems to be pretty high. Just an FYI, my dad is using a
1.5 year old Dell to run Photoshop CS and ALOT of plugins on photos from a
10+ megapixle camera. He's been very happy with the processing speed.
Good luck.
MR

"Tyrone Corbett" <tyronecorbett@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:43c072d4$1@linux...
>
> First off, Happy New Year to all! Now, down to business ;-)I am looking
for
> a new PC for the studio. It will primarily handle e-mail, internet
access
> and Photoshop duties. I usualy build my own systems, but there seems to be
> great "bang for the buck" these days right off of the shelf (Best Buy,
Circuit
> City, etc.)I'm am curious to know if any of you have found any amazing
deals
> on PC's that I might have missed.
>
> Thanks
>
> TyroneIf you are monitoring the drum samples through paris, you would need to
"print" the drums via that track.
I would try to separate the individual drum sounds somehow during that
process.

Best,
Lance

"Richard Faylor" <RichardFaylor@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:43c00c68$1@linux...
>
> For some time I've used an old MIDI program and interface
(Vision/Studio64X)
> to create drum loops. Lately, I want to incorpoate those loops into Paris
> projects. I've figured out how to import them onto the Paris playing field
> at track 19 and I've got Paris triggering the MIDI from there, but what's
> the best way to convert the MIDI track to an audio track? Would just
"Bouncing
> to disk" do the trick, or is there another way?
>
> Many thanks!
> RichardYou're absoulutely right.



"DC" <dc@spamsteve.com> wrote in message news:43c08de4$1@linux...
>
> Seems to me that those who write and create music have a very
> open-hearted approach to other writers and other styles, while
> fans always fight over what has "street cred" or what is hip, or
> other such nonsense.
>
> Very unprofessional. IM-ever-so-HO
>
> DC
>
>
>
> "uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >Wow.
> >
> >I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know?
Too
> >negative.
> >
> >But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and ran
> >across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
> >concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.
> >
> >It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
> >cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the
thread
> >just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini baiting
> >them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his own
> ego
> >and silly puckishness.
> >
> >I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."
> >
> >I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously anymore.
> If
> >the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
> >choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because of
> >its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but a
> >position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
> >generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound and
> the
> >style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an
empty
> >fashion it always wanted to be anyway.
> >
> >Sorry for the rant.
> >Jimmy
> >
> >
>I just ordered one from 8thstreet. Thanks James. Anyone want to buy a Mackie
universal control?

-Chris

rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>hey boots,
>
>probably getting ready for the post xmas poverty that the gearheads
>enjoy this time each year.
>
>
>On Sun, 8 Jan 2006 00:32:38 -0700, "DJ"
><animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>
>>Yikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to discontinue
>>it.
>>
>>;o}
>>
>>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:43c029b6$1@linux...
>>>
>>> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you probably
>>already
>>> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices they
>>> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
>>>
>>> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
>>>
>>> James
>>
>Hey Deej

Just wondering

Donemail me privately with the details on getting one

jef



Roginator wrote:

>I did master.....
>
>I used ADR Superdynamic limiter, Dual White instruments 4001 EQ and DBX 120
>xp.....
>
>I'm using the WC output from a Mytek A/D converter sending to a Lucid GenX6
whic is set to distribute incoming clock signal, then taking the 6 clock
outputs from the GenX6 which are distributing the Mytek clock signal and
sending one output to a pair of RME HDSP 9652's by using a BNC splitter,
another output is sent to an RME Multiface, another is sent to a Lexicon
Studio 32 reverb and the last 3 are being sent to my 3 x MECs. One
interesting thing is that the two HDSP 9652's would lock to the incoming
clock signal when sending an independent feed to each one, but the Multiface
would not sync to it's spearate WC signal and Paris would not sync to it's 3
x WC inputs until the BNC splitter was used to send the same clock output to
the two HDSP 9652's. It took me about a week of trial-and-error
troubleshooting, threats of violence and attempted bribes to get this
happening. I was even considering joining a church.

;o)



"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:43c13353$1@linux...
> Hey Deej
>
> Just wondering
>
> Don
>
>Oh, and one other thing......do not believe everything you read about auto
termination. After about a year of jacking around with this squirrelly
thing, thinking that autotermination should suffice since it was supposed to
work, I ordered a bunch of 75ohm BNC terminator caps and applied them to
the BNC outputs of everything in my studio and anything else I could find
within a 10 mile radius of my studio. No more sync problems.

;op

"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote in message
news:43c163dc$1@linux...
> I'm using the WC output from a Mytek A/D converter sending to a Lucid
GenX6
> whic is set to distribute incoming clock signal, then taking the 6 clock
> outputs from the GenX6 which are distributing the Mytek clock signal and
> sending one output to a pair of RME HDSP 9652's by using a BNC splitter,
> another output is sent to an RME Multiface, another is sent to a Lexicon
> Studio 32 reverb and the last 3 are being sent to my 3 x MECs. One
> interesting thing is that the two HDSP 9652's would lock to the incoming
> clock signal when sending an independent feed to each one, but the
Multiface
> would not sync to it's spearate WC signal and Paris would not sync to it's
3
> x WC inputs until the BNC splitter was used to send the same clock output
to
> the two HDSP 9652's. It took me about a week of trial-and-error
> troubleshooting, threats of violence and attempted bribes to get this
> happening. I was even considering joining a church.
>
> ;o)
>
>
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:43c13353$1@linux...
> > Hey Deej
> >
> > Just wondering
> >
> > Don
> >
> >
>
>is there an app that can measure the latencies or a table that has them
all listed ?

John wrote:
> how do you measure/find out the latency of vst and dx plugs?Chris,

Let us know how you like this please. The only thing that's giving me second
thoughts is that it doesn't have an LCD display. That's been a very handy
feature on the Houston controller I'm using. Switching fader banks is a bit
of a PITA though in a big mix when I've got , multiple instruments that
require inverse fader moves and I've got them on different banks. If the
Tascam it worked reliably, I'd have no problem just laying scribble strips
long the fader row. Having a couple of 24 track banks sure would make life
faster and easier.

Is there a specific Cubase SX driver for the Tascam controller or does it
use HUI mode?

What is is about the Mackie controller that you don't like (other than
having only 8 faders)?

Deej

"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c12da2$1@linux...
>
> I just ordered one from 8thstreet. Thanks James. Anyone want to buy a
Mackie
> universal control?
>
> -Chris
>
> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >hey boots,
> >
> >probably getting ready for the post xmas poverty that the gearheads
> >enjoy this time each year.
> >
> >
> >On Sun, 8 Jan 2006 00:32:38 -0700, "DJ"
> ><animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
> >
> >>Yikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to
discontinue
> >>it.
> >>
> >>;o}
> >>
> >>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >>news:43c029b6$1@linux...
> >>>
> >>> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you
probably
> >>already
> >>> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices
they
> >>> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
> >>>
> >>>
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
> >>>
> >>> James
> >>
> >
>I am also using my Mytek converter for master clock. I borrowed a Big Ben
for comparison and I liked the Mytek slightly better, although both clocks
were significantly better than the Paris clock or my 2408 clock.

My setup is also complex, particularly since I am now doing 96K and 44.1K
simultaneously, and I switch my clocking around depending on my current configuration,
but my setup seems to have given me a little less grief that DJ’s.
I also have some double terminated clock inputs.

"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
“It took me about a week of trial-and-error
>troubleshooting, threats of violence and attempted bribes to get this
>happening. I was even considering joining a church.”

Termination problems? Perhaps you would like to join my Church:
The Church of Terminal Complacency.
(A wholly owned subsidiary of The Church of Anechoisum)Hey Deej,

Well, if you really want to you can pay for it here.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000BGQY1C/qid =1136751408/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_1/103-7700736-7529402?v=glance&a mp;s=music&n=507846

and supposedly it's in the iTunes store, but I refuse to let Apple take over
my one Windows box to find out.

A I said before, I'm really looking forward to the next recording. I'll get
to put my big guitar noises in there and play lots of percussion.

TCB

"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>Hey Thad,
>
>Thanks. I'll take you up on that offer for the CD, but if you're seeling
>them, I'd just as soon pay $$ to support you guys. Is it available online
>FS? If so send me a link.
>
>As far as the weasel-like creature, I think that one iws spelled
>*stoat*.....but WTF, I could be wrong.
>
>;o)
> .
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote in message news:43c08743$1@linux...
>>
>> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>> >I'm trying to think of any pop, R & B or *rock* music I've really liked
>> >enough to spend money for in the last 15 years. I could probably count
>the
>> >bands on the fingers of one hand.....and there would perhaps only be
one,
>> >maybe two songs on the CD that were worth a shit, IMO. They just sort
of
>> >morph into this sonic morass of over compressed, boring crap.
>> >
>> >OTOH, some of the absolute best music I've ever heard in the last 5 years
>> >happens at a little event here in Durango called the Durango Songwriters
>> >Expo.
>> >
>> >www.durangosong.com
>> >
>> >It's limited to around 150 people who pay around $200.00 plus airfare
to
>> get
>> >here in order to hobnob with industry bigwigs who purportedly come here
>> to
>> >listen to and critique their music and give them pointers on how to be
>> >successful in the industry, but everyone knows that everyone really just
>> >come here to chill at a luxury resort in the mountains in the most
>beautiful
>> >time of year here (early Ocotber) and play golf between meals and party
>> like
>> >a bunch of heathens for 3 nights..
>> >
>> >A lot of the participants have home studios, are excellent
>> >producers/writers/musicians and their music kicks ass. We'll never get
a
>> >chance to hear it on the radio, but there's a lot of it out there and
>it's
>> >great stuff. I do sound for this event and look forward to it every year
>> >because I get to hear some incredible music.
>> >
>> >One CD that I need to buy is Thad's. For some reason, I just haven't
>gotten
>> >around to it, but I did listen to some of the song clips and it's
>something
>> >I think I would actually enjoy sitting down and spending some quality
>time
>> >with........and I just don't have a lot of that to spare these days.
>>
>> As shucks, Deej, I'm blushing. Send me your address again and I'll mail
>you
>> one. Also, it's not *my* CD, I didn't write any of the songs on this one
>> and was brought in pretty late in the writing/recording process. I might
>> wind up with a track or two on the next one (thus making me the Ron
>Wood/George
>> Harrison of this band which suits me just fine) but it's really the
>product
>> of two supremely gifted songwriters who are nice enough to let me tag
>along
>> for the ride.
>>
>> I have to say, it's funny at this late date to be in the best band I've
>ever
>> been in with a couple of guys who have kids. Our third gig is coming up
>this
>> Thursday and I'm really psyched to get the tunes out in front of people
>again.
>> The working title for the next CD is Stotes Afire! (we have animal themes
>> for most stuff, and a stote is the british word for a weasel like creature
>> usualy called an ermine) and I'm hoping to make it sound a lot thicker.
I
>> think the first one is a little short on low end (being Mr. dub that isn't
>> surprising) and we might do the drums in a much nicer room. Actually,
this
>> band would sound great mixed on a PARIS rig. Too bad I don't have one
>anymore
>> ;-)
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> >"uptown jimmy" <johnson314@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
>> >news:43bffcdc@linux...
>> >> Wow.
>> >>
>> >> I try not to be a hater. I really do. It just seems too easy, ya know?
>> Too
>> >> negative.
>> >>
>> >> But I was doing my weekly skim through the various online forums, and
>> ran
>> >> across a thread on Steve Albini's PSW forum, started by Steve himself,
>> >> concerning who was more important, Wang Chung or Minutemen.
>> >>
>> >> It immediately degenerates a pathetic display of all the most heinous,
>> >> cliched, eye-roll-inducing indie-rock crap you'll ever read. And the
>> >thread
>> >> just goes on and on for pages and pages, with the god-like Albini
>baiting
>> >> them with little Zen koan-type comments appropos of nothing but his
own
>> >ego
>> >> and silly puckishness.
>> >>
>> >> I found myself thinking: "Damn, what a bunch of fucking losers."
>> >>
>> >> I cannot believe anyone takes this "punk/indie" stuff seriously
>anymore.
>> >If
>> >> the music's great, then great. But the whole "punk/indie" lifestyle
>> >> choice...it seems even more trite than other lifestyle choices because
>> of
>> >> its incessant insistence that it isn't a lifestyle choice at all but
a
>> >> position of moral/aesthetic/fashion authority. Meanwhile an entire
>> >> generation of spoiled, oblivious white kids have co-opted the sound
and
>> >the
>> >> style and made it into the candy-coated, mass-marketed cartoon of an
>empty
>> >> fashion it always wanted to be anyway.
>> >>
>> >> Sorry for the rant.
>> >> Jimmy
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>e machines is owned by Gateway, I do believe.

I would consider weighing out the warranty issue, components vs. a whole
machine. Building is fun, but it can be a PITA getting every thing to work
nicely with each other. When you buy a whole machine, you usually get a
software bundle with it. so that may be worth something to you.

Always ask what the return policy is on computers before you buy!!!


Somebody will want to kick my a** for mentioning this. You might want to
see what happens on tuesday with apple's announcements about the new intel
based Macs. I don't know what the systems will cost but my guess is that
they will start at $399.00. The word is, the new intel/Mac systems will
allow you to partition the drive and run Windows, Mac O/S, and Linux. Apple
has stated that they don't care if you run Windows or linux on the new machines.
I think their thinking is, if you buy our box, who cares what software you
run on it.

The idea is you'd get more bang for the buck. A machine that can run different
OSs could be handy in a studio. Of course this depends on your needs,

I just thought I would make the suggestion.

James


"Mike R." <emarenot@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I enjoy building too, but I agree with you, the prices at some of these
big
>box stores are really low. We were looking at the e machines at Best Buy
a
>couple of months ago. I did some checking on the web and the quality of
the
>current machines seems to be pretty high. Just an FYI, my dad is using
a
>1.5 year old Dell to run Photoshop CS and ALOT of plugins on photos from
a
>10+ megapixle camera. He's been very happy with the processing speed.
>Good luck.
>MR
>
>"Tyrone Corbett" <tyronecorbett@comcast.net> wrote in message
>news:43c072d4$1@linux...
>>
>> First off, Happy New Year to all! Now, down to business ;-)I am looking
>for
>> a new PC for the studio. It will primarily handle e-mail, internet
>access
>> and Photoshop duties. I usualy build my own systems, but there seems to
be
>> great "bang for the buck" these days right off of the shelf (Best Buy,
>Circuit
>> City, etc.)I'm am curious to know if any of you have found any amazing
>deals
>> on PC's that I might have missed.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Tyrone
>
>The sixty four thousand question! Is there really that much of a difference
in sound quality and sync between expensive and inexpensive BNC cables?

I'm about to buy BNC cables again, and I'd hate to pay $60.00 for a cable
when I could have paid $10.00.

Recommendations for good but less expensive BNC cables?

ThanksDeej, Comments below:

"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>Chris,
>
>Let us know how you like this please. The only thing that's giving me second
>thoughts is that it doesn't have an LCD display.

That was one of the deal breakers for me on the tascam firewire interface
that I owned for a week or two. I think that it is a much bigger deal though
if you are only using 8 faders and flipping around all the time. I almost
never go over 24 audio tracks in my projects. I figure that I will make
a default project (I'm using Cubase SL)with 24 tracks of audio and virtual
instruments from 25+. I suspect that I will work the same way I did when
I was doing analog or Paris, where most of my basic tracks will always be
in the same place. If I want to grab the lead vocal, it's always on track
16, etc. A flip of the bank button and I will be working on my midi/vsti
tracks. I think I can live without the LCD's this way. I'll probably end
up using some masking/drafting tape too.


>Is there a specific Cubase SX driver for the Tascam controller or does it
>use HUI mode?

It works in Mackie universal controler mode, Hui mode, or general midi controller
mode. The latest update claims improve functionality for cubase/nuendo,
but I can't find more info about it. From what I can tell, the latest manual
has the info and that isn't the manual that they have on line. If you hold
the F5 key during boot on the unit, it puts it into a custom Cubase/Mackie
Control mode with keys and key combos customed mapped for that software.

>What is is about the Mackie controller that you don't like (other than
>having only 8 faders)?

I can't say that I have any complaints. In fact, there will be some tradeoffs
going for the 24 faders. The Mackie has the scribble strips. It has more
buttons that are readily availible and labled (without doing funky stuff
like remembering key combos (shift/F2, alt/stop etc). It also had a weighted
flywheel, which the tascam doesn't. If money weren't an option, I think
I'd be better off with the Mackie and two extenders. When I bought the Mackie,
the US2400 had just come out but was selling around $2000. It was worth
it to me to pay $2800 down the road for three Mackies over $2000 for the
Tascam.

Now the price is too good not to go for the US2400. Dang compromises....
;-)

I'll share my findings with the group when I get it going. I need to upgrade
to SL3 from SL1 though before I can put it through the paces. Multiple mackie
control (which is how this works) is only supported after SL/SX 2.2. I'll
order that tomorrow.

-Chris

>Deej
>
>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c12da2$1@linux...
>>
>> I just ordered one from 8thstreet. Thanks James. Anyone want to buy a
>Mackie
>> universal control?
>>
>> -Chris
>>
>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >hey boots,
>> >
>> >probably getting ready for the post xmas poverty that the gearheads
>> >enjoy this time each year.
>> >
>> >
>> >On Sun, 8 Jan 2006 00:32:38 -0700, "DJ"
>> ><animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>> >
>> >>Yikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to
>discontinue
>> >>it.
>> >>
>> >>;o}
>> >>
>> >>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >>news:43c029b6$1@linux...
>> >>>
>> >>> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you
>probably
>> >>already
>> >>> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices
>they
>> >>> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
>> >>>
>> >>>
> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
>> >>>
>> >>> James
>> >>
>> >
>>
>
>--------------350001BBA4CD64D6F5471C37
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

What are the settings? I couldn't view the pic in the previous post...

Gantt

Tom Bruhl wrote:

> It wasn't as soft sounding as the UAD La2a.I think increasing the
> ratio a little bit helped. Not a badstarting point though. Give it a
> try if you haven't. Thanks Dimitrios.T.

--------------350001BBA4CD64D6F5471C37
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
<body bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
What are the settings?&nbsp; I couldn't view the pic in the previous post...
<p>Gantt
<p>Tom Bruhl wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE><style></style>
<font face="Arial"><font size=-1>It
wasn't as soft sounding as the UAD La2a.</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>I
think increasing the ratio a little bit helped.&nbsp; Not a bad</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>starting
point though.&nbsp; Give it a try if you haven't.</font></font>&nbsp;<font face="Arial"><font size=-1>Thanks
Dimitrios.</font></font><font face="Arial"><font size=-1>T.</font></font></blockquote>

</body>
</html>

--------------350001BBA4CD64D6F5471C37--That's my only complaint with my FW-1884, but it is a bit of a pain.

I was actually looking at the new M-Audio controller/interface, which is sort
of a hybrid between the Mackie Control and the Tascam.. it doesn't have a
mixer mode though like the Tascam 1884, or as many midi i/o ports but it seems
pretty cool.

Cheers,

TC

DJ wrote:
> Chris,
>
> Let us know how you like this please. The only thing that's giving me second
> thoughts is that it doesn't have an LCD display. That's been a very handy
> feature on the Houston controller I'm using. Switching fader banks is a bit
> of a PITA though in a big mix when I've got , multiple instruments that
> require inverse fader moves and I've got them on different banks. If the
> Tascam it worked reliably, I'd have no problem just laying scribble strips
> long the fader row. Having a couple of 24 track banks sure would make life
> faster and easier.
>
> Is there a specific Cubase SX driver for the Tascam controller or does it
> use HUI mode?
>Guys - FYI -

Looks like Tascam has addressed the scribble strip issue:

"New! SoftLCD displays 24 channels of data sent by your DAW app on your computer
monitor just like a giant hardware scribble strip."

Looks like a free download. Check it out!!!

"http://www.tascam.com/Products/US-2400.html"

Cheers,
Jon


"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote:
>
>Deej, Comments below:
>
>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>Chris,
>>
>>Let us know how you like this please. The only thing that's giving me second
>>thoughts is that it doesn't have an LCD display.
>
>That was one of the deal breakers for me on the tascam firewire interface
>that I owned for a week or two. I think that it is a much bigger deal though
>if you are only using 8 faders and flipping around all the time. I almost
>never go over 24 audio tracks in my projects. I figure that I will make
>a default project (I'm using Cubase SL)with 24 tracks of audio and virtual
>instruments from 25+. I suspect that I will work the same way I did when
>I was doing analog or Paris, where most of my basic tracks will always be
>in the same place. If I want to grab the lead vocal, it's always on track
>16, etc. A flip of the bank button and I will be working on my midi/vsti
>tracks. I think I can live without the LCD's this way. I'll probably end
>up using some masking/drafting tape too.
>
>
>>Is there a specific Cubase SX driver for the Tascam controller or does
it
>>use HUI mode?
>
>It works in Mackie universal controler mode, Hui mode, or general midi controller
>mode. The latest update claims improve functionality for cubase/nuendo,
>but I can't find more info about it. From what I can tell, the latest manual
>has the info and that isn't the manual that they have on line. If you hold
>the F5 key during boot on the unit, it puts it into a custom Cubase/Mackie
>Control mode with keys and key combos customed mapped for that software.
>
>>What is is about the Mackie controller that you don't like (other than
>>having only 8 faders)?
>
>I can't say that I have any complaints. In fact, there will be some tradeoffs
>going for the 24 faders. The Mackie has the scribble strips. It has more
>buttons that are readily availible and labled (without doing funky stuff
>like remembering key combos (shift/F2, alt/stop etc). It also had a weighted
>flywheel, which the tascam doesn't. If money weren't an option, I think
>I'd be better off with the Mackie and two extenders. When I bought the
Mackie,
>the US2400 had just come out but was selling around $2000. It was worth
>it to me to pay $2800 down the road for three Mackies over $2000 for the
>Tascam.
>
>Now the price is too good not to go for the US2400. Dang compromises....
>;-)
>
>I'll share my findings with the group when I get it going. I need to upgrade
>to SL3 from SL1 though before I can put it through the paces. Multiple
mackie
>control (which is how this works) is only supported after SL/SX 2.2. I'll
>order that tomorrow.
>
>-Chris
>
>>Deej
>>
>>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c12da2$1@linux...
>>>
>>> I just ordered one from 8thstreet. Thanks James. Anyone want to buy
a
>>Mackie
>>> universal control?
>>>
>>> -Chris
>>>
>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> >hey boots,
>>> >
>>> >probably getting ready for the post xmas poverty that the gearheads
>>> >enjoy this time each year.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >On Sun, 8 Jan 2006 00:32:38 -0700, "DJ"
>>> ><animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >>Yikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to
>>discontinue
>>> >>it.
>>> >>
>>> >>;o}
>>> >>
>>> >>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>> >>news:43c029b6$1@linux...
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you
>>probably
>>> >>already
>>> >>> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices
>>they
>>> >>> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
>>> >>>
>>> >>> James
>>> >>
>>> >
>>>
>>
>>
>Perhaps you would like to join my Church:
> The Church of Terminal Complacency.
> (A wholly owned subsidiary of The Church of Anechoisum)

These days, I attend St. Mattress Cathedral most every morning that time
allows.
;o)

"gene lennon" <glennon@NOSPmyrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:43c170c7$1@linux...
>
> I am also using my Mytek converter for master clock. I borrowed a Big Ben
> for comparison and I liked the Mytek slightly better, although both clocks
> were significantly better than the Paris clock or my 2408 clock.
>
> My setup is also complex, particularly since I am now doing 96K and 44.1K
> simultaneously, and I switch my clocking around depending on my current
configuration,
> but my setup seems to have given me a little less grief that DJ's.
> I also have some double terminated clock inputs.
>
> "DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
> "It took me about a week of trial-and-error
> >troubleshooting, threats of violence and attempted bribes to get this
> >happening. I was even considering joining a church."
>
> Termination problems? Perhaps you would like to join my Church:
> The Church of Terminal Complacency.
> (A wholly owned subsidiary of The Church of Anechoisum)
>
>I had trouble using that with the Tascam FW inerface. The lables weren't
in line with each channel, and the width of the lables didn't correspond
to the width of the channels. It would be sort of like mixing on an analog
console, but having the scribble tape on you meter bridge, and off the the
right. Better than nothing, but not as good as tape below each channel.
It also eats up desktop space. I suspect I won't even download this app.

-Chris

"Jon Jiles" <nope@nono.com> wrote:
>
>Guys - FYI -
>
>Looks like Tascam has addressed the scribble strip issue:
>
>"New! SoftLCD displays 24 channels of data sent by your DAW app on your
computer
>monitor just like a giant hardware scribble strip."
>
>Looks like a free download. Check it out!!!
>
>"http://www.tascam.com/Products/US-2400.html"
>
>Cheers,
>Jon
>
>
>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote:
>>
>>Deej, Comments below:
>>
>>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>Chris,
>>>
>>>Let us know how you like this please. The only thing that's giving me
second
>>>thoughts is that it doesn't have an LCD display.
>>
>>That was one of the deal breakers for me on the tascam firewire interface
>>that I owned for a week or two. I think that it is a much bigger deal
though
>>if you are only using 8 faders and flipping around all the time. I almost
>>never go over 24 audio tracks in my projects. I figure that I will make
>>a default project (I'm using Cubase SL)with 24 tracks of audio and virtual
>>instruments from 25+. I suspect that I will work the same way I did when
>>I was doing analog or Paris, where most of my basic tracks will always
be
>>in the same place. If I want to grab the lead vocal, it's always on track
>>16, etc. A flip of the bank button and I will be working on my midi/vsti
>>tracks. I think I can live without the LCD's this way. I'll probably
end
>>up using some masking/drafting tape too.
>>
>>
>>>Is there a specific Cubase SX driver for the Tascam controller or does
>it
>>>use HUI mode?
>>
>>It works in Mackie universal controler mode, Hui mode, or general midi
controller
>>mode. The latest update claims improve functionality for cubase/nuendo,
>>but I can't find more info about it. From what I can tell, the latest
manual
>>has the info and that isn't the manual that they have on line. If you
hold
>>the F5 key during boot on the unit, it puts it into a custom Cubase/Mackie
>>Control mode with keys and key combos customed mapped for that software.
>>
>>>What is is about the Mackie controller that you don't like (other than
>>>having only 8 faders)?
>>
>>I can't say that I have any complaints. In fact, there will be some tradeoffs
>>going for the 24 faders. The Mackie has the scribble strips. It has more
>>buttons that are readily availible and labled (without doing funky stuff
>>like remembering key combos (shift/F2, alt/stop etc). It also had a weighted
>>flywheel, which the tascam doesn't. If money weren't an option, I think
>>I'd be better off with the Mackie and two extenders. When I bought the
>Mackie,
>>the US2400 had just come out but was selling around $2000. It was worth
>>it to me to pay $2800 down the road for three Mackies over $2000 for the
>>Tascam.
>>
>>Now the price is too good not to go for the US2400. Dang compromises....
>>;-)
>>
>>I'll share my findings with the group when I get it going. I need to upgrade
>>to SL3 from SL1 though before I can put it through the paces. Multiple
>mackie
>>control (which is how this works) is only supported after SL/SX 2.2. I'll
>>order that tomorrow.
>>
>>-Chris
>>
>>>Deej
>>>
>>>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c12da2$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> I just ordered one from 8thstreet. Thanks James. Anyone want to buy
>a
>>>Mackie
>>>> universal control?
>>>>
>>>> -Chris
>>>>
>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >hey boots,
>>>> >
>>>> >probably getting ready for the post xmas poverty that the gearheads
>>>> >enjoy this time each year.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >On Sun, 8 Jan 2006 00:32:38 -0700, "DJ"
>>>> ><animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >>Yikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to
>>>discontinue
>>>> >>it.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>;o}
>>>> >>
>>>> >>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>> >>news:43c029b6$1@linux...
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you
>>>probably
>>>> >>already
>>>> >>> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices
>>>they
>>>> >>> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> James
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote:
>
>I had trouble using that with the Tascam FW inerface. The lables weren't
>in line with each channel, and the width of the lables didn't correspond
>to the width of the channels. It would be sort of like mixing on an analog
>console, but having the scribble tape on you meter bridge, and off the the
>right. Better than nothing, but not as good as tape below each channel.
> It also eats up desktop space. I suspect I won't even download this app.
>
>-Chris


Might as well try it, it may be improved.

>
>"Jon Jiles" <nope@nono.com> wrote:
>>
>>Guys - FYI -
>>
>>Looks like Tascam has addressed the scribble strip issue:
>>
>>"New! SoftLCD displays 24 channels of data sent by your DAW app on your
>computer
>>monitor just like a giant hardware scribble strip."
>>
>>Looks like a free download. Check it out!!!
>>
>>"http://www.tascam.com/Products/US-2400.html"
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Jon
>>
>>
>>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote:
>>>
>>>Deej, Comments below:
>>>
>>>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>>Chris,
>>>>
>>>>Let us know how you like this please. The only thing that's giving me
>second
>>>>thoughts is that it doesn't have an LCD display.
>>>
>>>That was one of the deal breakers for me on the tascam firewire interface
>>>that I owned for a week or two. I think that it is a much bigger deal
>though
>>>if you are only using 8 faders and flipping around all the time. I almost
>>>never go over 24 audio tracks in my projects. I figure that I will make
>>>a default project (I'm using Cubase SL)with 24 tracks of audio and virtual
>>>instruments from 25+. I suspect that I will work the same way I did when
>>>I was doing analog or Paris, where most of my basic tracks will always
>be
>>>in the same place. If I want to grab the lead vocal, it's always on track
>>>16, etc. A flip of the bank button and I will be working on my midi/vsti
>>>tracks. I think I can live without the LCD's this way. I'll probably
>end
>>>up using some masking/drafting tape too.
>>>
>>>
>>>>Is there a specific Cubase SX driver for the Tascam controller or does
>>it
>>>>use HUI mode?
>>>
>>>It works in Mackie universal controler mode, Hui mode, or general midi
>controller
>>>mode. The latest update claims improve functionality for cubase/nuendo,
>>>but I can't find more info about it. From what I can tell, the latest
>manual
>>>has the info and that isn't the manual that they have on line. If you
>hold
>>>the F5 key during boot on the unit, it puts it into a custom Cubase/Mackie
>>>Control mode with keys and key combos customed mapped for that software.
>>>
>>>>What is is about the Mackie controller that you don't like (other than
>>>>having only 8 faders)?
>>>
>>>I can't say that I have any complaints. In fact, there will be some tradeoffs
>>>going for the 24 faders. The Mackie has the scribble strips. It has
more
>>>buttons that are readily availible and labled (without doing funky stuff
>>>like remembering key combos (shift/F2, alt/stop etc). It also had a weighted
>>>flywheel, which the tascam doesn't. If money weren't an option, I think
>>>I'd be better off with the Mackie and two extenders. When I bought the
>>Mackie,
>>>the US2400 had just come out but was selling around $2000. It was worth
>>>it to me to pay $2800 down the road for three Mackies over $2000 for the
>>>Tascam.
>>>
>>>Now the price is too good not to go for the US2400. Dang compromises....
>>>;-)
>>>
>>>I'll share my findings with the group when I get it going. I need to
upgrade
>>>to SL3 from SL1 though before I can put it through the paces. Multiple
>>mackie
>>>control (which is how this works) is only supported after SL/SX 2.2.
I'll
>>>order that tomorrow.
>>>
>>>-Chris
>>>
>>>>Deej
>>>>
>>>>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c12da2$1@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> I just ordered one from 8thstreet. Thanks James. Anyone want to buy
>>a
>>>>Mackie
>>>>> universal control?
>>>>>
>>>>> -Chris
>>>>>
>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> >hey boots,
>>>>> >
>>>>> >probably getting ready for the post xmas poverty that the gearheads
>>>>> >enjoy this time each year.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >On Sun, 8 Jan 2006 00:32:38 -0700, "DJ"
>>>>> ><animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>>> >
>>>>> >>Yikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to
>>>>discontinue
>>>>> >>it.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>;o}
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> >>news:43c029b6$1@linux...
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you
>>>>probably
>>>>> >>already
>>>>> >>> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices
>>>>they
>>>>> >>> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>>
>>>> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> James
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>I'm processing one of the kick tracks ( mic on beater) and one of the snare
tracks (underneath on snares) with a touch of my SPL TD, other than that,
what my ears are telling me right now is that the rest of this mix will only
be processed with a little subtractive and shelving EQ and some
ambience......no compressors....at least not yet. Much of this has to do
with using Cubase into Paris, I think. There's something *gluey* going on
here with just a touch of the NoLimit on the mix bus that I'm liking. We'll
see as this goes along.I think the software was fine, it's more to do with my monitors. I'm using
two CRTs up on the meterbridge of an Argosy desk. So right of the bat, I
have to look up and away from the control unit and figure out what channel
on the screen is the one I have my finger on. There is a 4 inch gap between
my monitors that also makes it tough to get one's bearings. I suppose though
it couldn't hurt to try again. Being Tascam and not Sony, there probably
isn't any malware in the app. ;-) Thanks again or the heads-up James.

-Chris

"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote:
>>
>>I had trouble using that with the Tascam FW inerface. The lables weren't
>>in line with each channel, and the width of the lables didn't correspond
>>to the width of the channels. It would be sort of like mixing on an analog
>>console, but having the scribble tape on you meter bridge, and off the
the
>>right. Better than nothing, but not as good as tape below each channel.
>> It also eats up desktop space. I suspect I won't even download this app.
>>
>>-Chris
>
>
>Might as well try it, it may be improved.
>
>>
>>"Jon Jiles" <nope@nono.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Guys - FYI -
>>>
>>>Looks like Tascam has addressed the scribble strip issue:
>>>
>>>"New! SoftLCD displays 24 channels of data sent by your DAW app on your
>>computer
>>>monitor just like a giant hardware scribble strip."
>>>
>>>Looks like a free download. Check it out!!!
>>>
>>>"http://www.tascam.com/Products/US-2400.html"
>>>
>>>Cheers,
>>>Jon
>>>
>>>
>>>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Deej, Comments below:
>>>>
>>>>"DJ" <animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>>>Chris,
>>>>>
>>>>>Let us know how you like this please. The only thing that's giving me
>>second
>>>>>thoughts is that it doesn't have an LCD display.
>>>>
>>>>That was one of the deal breakers for me on the tascam firewire interface
>>>>that I owned for a week or two. I think that it is a much bigger deal
>>though
>>>>if you are only using 8 faders and flipping around all the time. I almost
>>>>never go over 24 audio tracks in my projects. I figure that I will make
>>>>a default project (I'm using Cubase SL)with 24 tracks of audio and virtual
>>>>instruments from 25+. I suspect that I will work the same way I did
when
>>>>I was doing analog or Paris, where most of my basic tracks will always
>>be
>>>>in the same place. If I want to grab the lead vocal, it's always on
track
>>>>16, etc. A flip of the bank button and I will be working on my midi/vsti
>>>>tracks. I think I can live without the LCD's this way. I'll probably
>>end
>>>>up using some masking/drafting tape too.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Is there a specific Cubase SX driver for the Tascam controller or does
>>>it
>>>>>use HUI mode?
>>>>
>>>>It works in Mackie universal controler mode, Hui mode, or general midi
>>controller
>>>>mode. The latest update claims improve functionality for cubase/nuendo,
>>>>but I can't find more info about it. From what I can tell, the latest
>>manual
>>>>has the info and that isn't the manual that they have on line. If you
>>hold
>>>>the F5 key during boot on the unit, it puts it into a custom Cubase/Mackie
>>>>Control mode with keys and key combos customed mapped for that software.
>>>>
>>>>>What is is about the Mackie controller that you don't like (other than
>>>>>having only 8 faders)?
>>>>
>>>>I can't say that I have any complaints. In fact, there will be some
tradeoffs
>>>>going for the 24 faders. The Mackie has the scribble strips. It has
>more
>>>>buttons that are readily availible and labled (without doing funky stuff
>>>>like remembering key combos (shift/F2, alt/stop etc). It also had a weighted
>>>>flywheel, which the tascam doesn't. If money weren't an option, I think
>>>>I'd be better off with the Mackie and two extenders. When I bought the
>>>Mackie,
>>>>the US2400 had just come out but was selling around $2000. It was worth
>>>>it to me to pay $2800 down the road for three Mackies over $2000 for
the
>>>>Tascam.
>>>>
>>>>Now the price is too good not to go for the US2400. Dang compromises....
>>>>;-)
>>>>
>>>>I'll share my findings with the group when I get it going. I need to
>upgrade
>>>>to SL3 from SL1 though before I can put it through the paces. Multiple
>>>mackie
>>>>control (which is how this works) is only supported after SL/SX 2.2.

>I'll
>>>>order that tomorrow.
>>>>
>>>>-Chris
>>>>
>>>>>Deej
>>>>>
>>>>>"Chris Wargo" <na@na.na> wrote in message news:43c12da2$1@linux...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I just ordered one from 8thstreet. Thanks James. Anyone want to buy
>>>a
>>>>>Mackie
>>>>>> universal control?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -Chris
>>>>>>
>>>>>> rick <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> >hey boots,
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >probably getting ready for the post xmas poverty that the gearheads
>>>>>> >enjoy this time each year.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >On Sun, 8 Jan 2006 00:32:38 -0700, "DJ"
>>>>>> ><animix_spam-this-ahole_@animas.net> wrote:
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >>Yikes!!!! That's cheap. Now I wonder if they're getting ready to
>>>>>discontinue
>>>>>> >>it.
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>;o}
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> >>news:43c029b6$1@linux...
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> Hey Deej! You were just talking about the Tascam US-2400, you
>>>>>probably
>>>>>> >>already
>>>>>> >>> know this, there has been a price drop. Last time I checked prices
>>>>>they
>>>>>> >>> wanted about $1100.00. Check it out.
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/bas e_pid/706947/
>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>> >>> James
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------070300060104000708090907
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Deej,
I am now going through a similar Clock challenge, We are presently
working with Euphonix / Steinberg / C-Lab on a sample accurate
POST solution using NUENDO and a similar DUAL OPTERON like the one
we did @ Lakewood with Brian Tankersley.

The Block Diagrams for this setup are like a subway system map,
There are over 10 Lucid Clock distributors ( 6 outs each ) in the audio
path - a similar amount of Video as well.

This project lead me to a new Clock source -
http://www.antelopeaudio.com
These guys do a better job than Apogee , and for less $$
I have worked out some group buy details with these guys as well.

Here are some pix of the equipment room - the floor below
the Mix Room. This is a fraction of the gear :)

Morgan :)




DJ wrote:
> I'm using the WC output from a Mytek A/D converter sending to a Lucid GenX6
> whic is set to distribute incoming clock signal, then taking the 6 clock
> outputs from the GenX6 which are distributing the Mytek clock signal and
> sending one output to a pair of RME HDSP 9652's by using a BNC splitter,
> another output is sent to an RME Multiface, another is sent to a Lexicon
> Studio 32 reverb and the last 3 are being sent to my 3 x MECs. One
> interesting thing is that the two HDSP 9652's would lock to the incoming
> clock signal when sending an independent feed to each one, but the Multiface
> would not sync to it's spearate WC signal and Paris would not sync to it's 3
> x WC inputs until the BNC splitter was used to send the same clock output to
> the two HDSP 9652's. It took me about a week of trial-and-error
> troubleshooting, threats of violence and attempted bribes to get this
> happening. I was even considering joining a church.
>
> ;o)
>
>
>
> "Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote in message news:43c13353$1@linux...
>
>>Hey Deej
>>
>>Just wondering
>>
>>Don
>>
>>
>
>
>

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Re: "Skunk" Baxter, missle defense expert? [message #61604 is a reply to message #61602] Mon, 19 December 2005 13:47 Go to previous message
excelav is currently offline  excelav   
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Re: "Skunk" Baxter, missle defense expert? [message #61607 is a reply to message #61604] Mon, 19 December 2005 12:56 Go to previous message
Tony Benson is currently offline  Tony Benson   UNITED STATES
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Re: "Skunk" Baxter, missle defense expert? [message #61608 is a reply to message #61602] Mon, 19 December 2005 12:59 Go to previous message
Tony Benson is currently offline  Tony Benson   UNITED STATES
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